Why build or buy a ukulele made from restricted or endangered wood?

As Rick and Hoosier have said.

The whole mystique of Hawaiian Koa is somewhat annoying. I am not knocking Hawaiians or their ethnic and cultural pride. I laud it. Koa is good tone wood. The acaccia Koa grown in the mountains of California and Colorado is still Koa, even if the growing conditions change its characteristics somewhat. I suspect my curly Koa ukulele made in Indonesia is not Koa at all. Acaccia, yes. Koa...hmm. It is analogous to Champagne. Sparkling Wines that do not come from the Champagne region are not champagne, by law. Of course in the USA we ignore this distinction. We are a snarky people. (And if Lambrusca rootstocks from America, had not been grafted onto european vinifera vinestock there would be no champagne at all).

I'm a sucker for highly figured woods, but do agree we should be conscious that some trees are threatened. Also, for those truly conscientious about it, now there are non-wood material options that sound good even compared to wood (e.g., the Blackbird eKoa used in the Clara).

There is a difference between the intent of a law and its effect …

I don’t want to see whales taken, elephants killed, nor endangered trees logged, and the idea of protecting them seems, on the face of it, sound. We don’t need blubber or ambergris, and there are other substances that can serve for elephant ivory or endangered woods. The problem arises when common sense fails to make it into the regulatory process. Which happens, it seems, as often as not ...

Your great-grandma’s old piano with its ivory and ebony keys? That guitar whose back is made from the door of a hundred-and-fifty-year-old church being torn down? The pendant your dear aunt Sally got on her sixteenth birthday party? Should be exempt, right?

Not if you don’t have paperwork attesting to these things, and even if you do, best you not try to travel across a border with ‘em. Somebody’s great-uncle bought some BRW from somebody else’s great uncle eighty years ago and stuck it in the garage, but paid cash and didn’t get a bill of sale? Great-nephew found it when old unk passed on? Illegal to use it in your next uke build. Same thing with that desk your daddy bought when he was working down in Brazil thirty years ago, if he didn't get a bill of sale you can find.

Banning mammoth or mastodon ivory because it looks like African elephant ivory? Kind of like banning oregano because it looks like marijuana. Just plain stupid, and thank you, New York state.

Can’t use Amazon Rosewood because it looks too much like Brazilian?

We aren’t supposed to have ex post facto laws in the U.S., so if it was legal when you bought it, you ought not to be penalized for having it now. Doesn’t work that way, of course, and in some cases, you can understand why. That Thompson submachine gun grandpappy brought back from the Korean War is regulated these days, and most of us won’t argue with that. You could buy guns from the Sears catalog and get them delivered at home when I was a kid, and that's not a good idea any more; still, the idea that a valuable piece of jewelry or a cherished musical instrument legally made is no longer something you can sell, or in some cases, even keep?

Somebody needs to get a few more sandwiches, ‘cause they are short of a picnic …

Rick Turner said:

Do not support the clear cutting of the Tongas Forest.

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agree...the attached is an old article,
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/cindy-shogan/tongass-national-forest_b_3922320.html
but hopefully this situation can be corrected! I can't believe the Forest Service is doing anything other than preserving this forest.

Steveperrywriter said:

There is a difference between the intent of a law and its effect …

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Right On Steve!

If we had a lot more musicians passing laws than lawyers, we'd be a lot better off.

OOOh, is that too political for the UU? Sorry, moderators. NOT!

Rick Turner said:

Just a comment re. Acacia koa. It is not defined as "koa" by where it usually grows anymore than Tasmanian blackwood (Acacia melanoxylon) is defined by being from Tasmania. Koa could grow elsewhere there is a similar climate and reasonably close soil conditions if anyone wanted to. I'm surprised that it's not being plantation grown in Costa Rica. Koa is not a location, it's a species.

Eat fewer hamburgers if you want to put less stress on tropical hardwood forests. Support any replanting efforts. Go out and plant a tree. Develop a love for woods like walnut, maple, and cherry. Do not support the clear cutting of the Tongas Forest.

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I thought Pepe Romero Jr.'s Climate Reality Project was great. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KIRqLeIHKw4 I met Pepe a few years back and he told me about his "Beetle Kill" wood guitar and ukulele he had built. Who would of thought to use diseased dead wood? Genius! I am sure there are so many types of wood that would sound great, but it just takes someone to get the wood and try it. I am sure some woods just won't bend or work well for certain parts of instruments but I would think there are a ton of great woods out there which are not commonly used but could certainly be used to make great instruments.

p.s. there are 22 MILLION ACRES of this in Colorado (I lived there and saw it in the 80's and 90's) and all over the U.S. frankly where you have beetle kill. I would imagine that's enough wood out there to last every luthier dozens of lifetimes of years of supply.

Hmmm...now it's got me thinking on that next instrument ;-)

Reading this thread reminded me of the raid on the Gibson factory a few years ago. My concern was that such a raid could put a small custom maker out of business.

Looking to find a suitable link to better inform myself, and to post here, it seemed that any news item I came across that explained what took place was also overtly political in nature. I guess therefore that if anyone isn't aware of the details, and would like to know, they had better do their own Google search for "Gibson guitar raid."

KnowsPickin said:

Just an FYI, Bob Taylor of Taylor guitars has taken some really excellent positive steps to help sustain the supply of ebony in the world. Here is a link to his video on the project.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=anCGvfsBoFY

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That was very enlightening. Thanks for the link. Very cool what Bob Taylor did.

Blackwood is now on the cites list, fortunately I had mine shipped to my luthier overseas before it went on the list. I agree if it's already cut its not an issue, cutting new tress on protected list is an issue. I chose blackwood for the beauty of the wood and the sound quality, pics of the build are on here under my name.

When you say "blackwood", what wood are you citing? Dalbergia melanoxylon (African blackwood...a true rosewood) or Acacia melanoxylon (black Acacia, aka Tasmanian blackwood which grows in California as well as Australia)?

It's really helpful in discussions about wood to know exactly what we're talking about.

BTW, I don't know of any California grown Acacia koa, but it would be great if folks started to plant it. If the Hawaiians can have California's Sequoiadendrum giganteum (giant Sequoia), then we should get some koa!

Ahhh, a bit o' research and here's a long discussion about koa in California with excellent comments on Acacia melanoxylon, too:
http://www.cloudforest.com/cafe/forum/61792.html

Time to go resaw some of that acacia that I have...

Rick Turner said:

If we had a lot more musicians passing laws than lawyers, we'd be a lot better off.

OOOh, is that too political for the UU? Sorry, moderators. NOT!

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Can we just have less lawyers ?:uhoh::stop::rotfl:

BTW, kind of buried in that blog about koa in California is a reference to "our" Acacia melanoxylon being a bit harder than Acacia koa. That is my experience as well; I find it to be a bit closer to typical Indian rosewood (Dalbergia latifolia) with the wood that I have gotten than a lot of koa, though there is variance in both species.

I was fortunate to be gifted about two tons of quarter log sections of Acacia melanoxylon about two years ago. I've been able to resaw a lot of beautifully quartered sets for ukes and guitars. The sections I got were from a section of the trunk that was about 34" to 38" in diameter, and I've had to do a lot of judicious chain saw work to get these down to sizes I can handle on my resaw.

Moore Bettah Ukuleles said:

Please, let's put this myth to rest. Koa is NOT endangered or restricted. It's just damned expensive because the demand I'd so high and the area where it's grown is relatively small. But you are correct, almost all of the koa being milled that I am familiar with is from downed trees. Some have been sitting on the forest floor for decades.

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There is much MUCH more Brazilian rosewood in the world then Hawaiian Koa (based on that Brazil is 8.5 million sq miles, while the Big island is 4000 sq miles) yet BRW is on CITES....

Custom luthiers don't contribute in any way to endangering any species, we are all very conscious of our materials and use every usable splinter.

I suppose one could make the comment that custom luthiers do contribute to the endangerment of species if one assumes that large factories follow the lead of custom luthiers, but I dont think they do.

Sorry, Beau, but Dalbergia nigra only grows in the Atlantic Forest of South Eastern Brazil:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dalbergia_nigra

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlantic_Forest

Note that in the 500 years or so that Europeans have been in Brazil, that forest has shrunk from 1 to 1.5 million square kilometers down to 4 thousand.

I love the stuff, and I have some of the "stump wood" that will slowly go into expensive guitars and ukes as I totter along closer to retirement. The stump wood was harvested from trees cut down before 1967. I consider it "salvage", and I have no ethical problems using it. But I won't buy any freshly cut BZ.

An enlightened and uncorrupted government would not only protect what trees are there, but also embark on a replanting mission. Fat chance...

Rick Turner said:

Sorry, Beau, but Dalbergia nigra only grows in the Atlantic Forest of South Eastern Brazil:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dalbergia_nigra

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlantic_Forest

Note that in the 500 years or so that Europeans have been in Brazil, that forest has shrunk from 1 to 1.5 million square kilometers down to 4 thousand.

I love the stuff, and I have some of the "stump wood" that will slowly go into expensive guitars and ukes as I totter along closer to retirement. The stump wood was harvested from trees cut down before 1967. I consider it "salvage", and I have no ethical problems using it. But I won't buy any freshly cut BZ.

An enlightened and uncorrupted government would not only protect what trees are there, but also embark on a replanting mission. Fat chance...

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Thanks for the additional info Rick- I didn't look into it far enough.

Like most things on an endangered list, its not endangered in a natural sense- i.e it doesnt suffer from something like beetle kill etc- it would still be in complete abundance if the corrupt gov just stop cutting it down to, as you said, to make way for livestock and shanty towns.

But that is humanity in a nut shell- exploit what is useful until it is utterly extinguished, much like an virus.

As far as I am concerned for all our brilliance and talent, at this point humanity is pretty much exactly that, a virus. Fortunately one that will eventually cause it's own extinction, hopefully well before we destroy the environment to the point where the cetaceans will not be able to recover. Google "Pacific gyre garbage patch" for just the tiniest example of how we refuse to stop sh*tting where we eat.

More birth control would help, but viruses may eventually take care of Gaia's problems with us...

Teek said:

As far as I am concerned for all our brilliance and talent, at this point humanity is pretty much exactly that, a virus. Fortunately one that will eventually cause it's own extinction, hopefully well before we destroy the environment to the point where the cetaceans will not be able to recover. Google "Pacific gyre garbage patch" for just the tiniest example of how we refuse to stop sh*tting where we eat.

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Well, aren't you a ray of sunshine ...

Steveperrywriter said:

Well, aren't you a ray of sunshine ...

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Why shut our eyes to the inevitable? The Pollyanna attitude that we can blithely continue doing what we're doing with no substantial repercussions is what has landed us in this definitely unsunny situation. We're past the point of salvation, with population continuing to grow as consumption per capita increases; it's not a matter of if but when.