Improvisation

CeeJay · Aug 16, 2016

Down Up Dick said:
Well, all of the above sounds correct and useful, but I just wanna have a good time making my music mine. Mostly I play all kinds of folk music. Some who read your post will probably be inspired to delve deeper into jazz improvisation with all those mind blowing chords.

Thanks for your input, maybe it will inspire someone to begin a study of jazz. ld:

Before we go too much further on this may I just get your definition of "Folk " music. Here in the UK it is Traditional ,Old Worlde and often involves a maiden rising up in the morning , meeting a ne'er do good lusty lad and possibly not still being a maiden at the setting of the sun !! Or certainly before the song ends lol.

The afficianados of this genre ,with some possible notable exceptions such as Steeleye Span (my personal folk rock favourites) especially the Traditional Irish Music Mob, seem to disapprove of any sort of improvisation ....despite the fact that the music is screaming out for it and it gets it from me....What is your definition of folk music? I've shown you mine now you show me yours

CeeJay · Aug 16, 2016

Down Up Dick said:
Hey, CeeJay, how's it goin'? Long time no hear-from ya. I'm glad you're back. ld:

Thanks very much.

Down Up Dick · Aug 16, 2016

CeeJay said:
Before we go too much further on this may I just get your definition of "Folk " music. Here in the UK it is Traditional ,Old Worlde and often involves a maiden rising up in the morning , meeting a ne'er do good lusty lad and possibly not still being a maiden at the setting of the sun !! Or certainly before the song ends lol.

The afficianados of this genre ,with some possible notable exceptions such as Steeleye Span (my personal folk rock favourites) especially the Traditional Irish Music Mob, seem to disapprove of any sort of improvisation ....despite the fact that the music is screaming out for it and it gets it from me....What is your definition of folk music? I've shown you mine now you show me yours

Wow, I don't know that I've thought about a folk music definition all that much. Off hand I'd say it's just tunes that folks made up and played for/with their fellow tipplers in a pub, and their names have faded into the mist of history. But some of my Celtic music books teach "adornments" such as triplets or rolls, etc. German music has those wonderful trills and little runs. I especially love the Oom-pah-pahs (I play tuba too) and the dancing. Our old folk music seems to me to be mostly imported from Britain. I usta like to play the old fife tunes on my fifes, but my embouchure ain't what it usta be (nothin' is) anymore. Klezmer (?) music is fun and heartbreaking. I love it, and it is certainly improvised. Eastern European folk music is also much like that. About the only folky music I don't care for is Spanish; the music's all right, but I don't care for the dancing and yelling. Anyway, I'm not sure I have a definition. It's just (mostly) old tunes from other societies that people play and sing and use to kick up their heels.

I'd say the above was a pretty good definition of the folk music that I like, for one written at 0530! And my first coffee got cold!

And, my definition of improvisation is just play it the way you wanna hear it!

ld:

Joyful Uke · Aug 16, 2016

Down Up Dick said:
Joyful Uke (I like your UU name) if you can play a tune or sing it and add a few notes that fit pretty good, you're improvising. Maybe on a basic level, but, if you continue working on "feeling" your music, perhaps it'll turn into something that you wanna play.

That's mostly what I'm doin'. ld:

I guess I consider what I'm doing arranging (at a very simple level) vs. improvising. But, I'm sure there is overlap between the 2.

I'm not sure where the lines are drawn between arranging, improvising, and composing. I think of improvising as on-the-fly and not pre-planned, and probably never replicated by the performer again, because next time, it will be improvised differently. But, that's just the random definition that popped into my head, and I'm not sure that's correct.

Down Up Dick · Aug 16, 2016

Joyful Uke said:
I guess I consider what I'm doing arranging (at a very simple level) vs. improvising. But, I'm sure there is overlap between the 2.

I'm not sure where the lines are drawn between arranging, improvising, and composing. I think of improvising as on-the-fly and not pre-planned, and probably never replicated by the performer again, because next time, it will be improvised differently. But, that's just the random definition that popped into my head, and I'm not sure that's correct.

Yeah, I pretty much agree with your definitions. I don't care anything about composing though, it just doesn't interest me. I like to arrange (rearrange?) though. What I'm really interested in though is playing by ear. I guess that's where my interest in improvising started.

I wish I could play as well as I whistle, but I seem to have bad hand-eye (mind?) coordination--ahh, well.

ld:

LimousinLil · Aug 16, 2016

mountain goat said:
Hey Dick,
my partner and I like to play improvised original pieces.
neither of us are trained musicians,
we just turn the camera on and see what happens.
it's a liberating and free way to play sometimes and always surprising.
the best thing about "mistakes" is incorporating them into the song!
i think the key is to not overthink anything, let your ears and your heart, your instinct, take the lead
and just let go of control, the conventional definitions of right and wrong.
if it sounds good it is good!
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLwSBAImDtlKpGjlYvD5hMYkYESwooq1C_

Which "key" are you talking about ... I would go for something simple like 'C' myself and I wouldn't dream of overthinking it! Mmm ... probably easier to improvise with someone else when you're going in that direction - me, I have enough trouble just playing the stuff that's already been written down! (And, actually, now I think about it, I would find the whole thing positively scary ... not even remotely "liberating". Yes ... obviously far too "uptight"! But choosing the titles could be fun - in fact, that could be the best bit .... I could think of the most WONDERFUL and totally irrelevant titles!)

Joyful Uke · Aug 17, 2016

Down Up Dick said:
Yeah, I pretty much agree with your definitions. I don't care anything about composing though, it just doesn't interest me. I like to arrange (rearrange?) though. What I'm really interested in though is playing by ear. I guess that's where my interest in improvising started.

I wish I could play as well as I whistle, but I seem to have bad hand-eye (mind?) coordination--ahh, well. ld:

Are you doing any specific ear training studies? I was trying to work on that for a bit, but more important things (family and work) needed that time instead. I might be able to sneak back to it soon, though.

I was using http://www.musictheory.net/ to help, as well as an app, (I think it's called Trainer, and you have the option of buying the ukulele version.) Some vacation time from one job is coming up, so maybe I'll get back to it then.

Down Up Dick · Aug 17, 2016

Joyful Uke said:
Are you doing any specific ear training studies? I was trying to work on that for a bit, but more important things (family and work) needed that time instead. I might be able to sneak back to it soon, though.

I was using http://www.musictheory.net/ to help, as well as an app, (I think it's called Trainer, and you have the option of buying the ukulele version.) Some vacation time from one job is coming up, so maybe I'll get back to it then.

I just fingerpicked lots of scales and arpeggios to learn where the notes are. Then I pick a simple, familiar tune/song, and, when I can play it pretty good, I can add grace notes and/or little runs that sound good to me. Then one can just build from there. I do that with my flutes too. I have two or three banjo books that say that one should use tabs or music to learn tunes and then stop and play by ear.

It's very nice to just sit, maybe outside (I usta play my fifes and tinwhistles in the park) and noodle away.

ld:

Ukejenny · Aug 18, 2016

Down Up Dick said:
Some time ago I bought a book called "A Guide to Non-Jazz Improvization" (for flute), and began doin' the exercises and scales and tunes. I also had some other improvisational stuff which I added to the book in a loose leaf binder. Anyway, the lessons and tunes were interesting and fun to play (and sing) so I enjoyed doin' them.

Well, here I should say that I whistle a lot (all the darned time, others say), and suddenly I noticed that I was improvising my whistle music a lot. I also noticed it on my flutes too, and playing them by ear also improved and became easier to "just do!"

Improvisation is big on banjo music too, so I'm also working on it with them.

And what has all this to do with ukuleles? I'm just wondering if any of you finger pickers (especially Jazz players, I guess) or even singers are working on it too. Do you add stuff to tunes that you play or sing? Do you make a tune "yours"? I find all this stuff very interesting

I've been lookin' at "Just A Closer Walk With Thee" (the Dixie funeral march), and I love to whistle it. I usta try to play it on my cornet. It's the one that's very serious and sad on the way to the graveyard and joyous and exultant (with lots of great Improvization) on the way back.

I just wondered if anyone else was interested or working on it and would enjoy a thread about it. ld:

Pete Fountain was laid to rest this week, and this reminds me of watching some videos of his Second Line. I've always wanted to improv. with my clarinet, and have a few jazz books. Never have given it the serious time and study it deserves. This is a great idea for a thread!

Down Up Dick · Aug 18, 2016

Ohhh, I'm sorry to hear that, Ukejenny. I liked Pete Fountain a lot. I really like Dixieland. I always had dreams of playing tuba with a band. I played a little in high school, but just a little.

One thing about being old is that all your heroes pass on. A lot of mine have . . .

ld:

BearMakingNoises · Aug 19, 2016

I have been recording an album of improvised tunes for a while. It is a nice break from composition for me and it is an excellent way to keep sharp and become more fluent on any instrument. I'll be releasing it for free when I decide which tracks make the cut and which are getting tossed.

Improvisation

CeeJay

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Down Up Dick

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