Ukes and endangered woods.....shouldn't we care more?

Thank goodness wood is a renewable resource, eh?
 
Would certainly love to see more of these around...so I could play one before I pull the trigger- coolest idea ever I think
TallGrass Ukuleles

I pulled the trigger and pleased that I did. Have had mine for almost a week now. It is not a fancy uke, but I think there is beauty in simplicity. Well made, bright, resonant, good sustain, perfect intonation to the 7th fret and loud, with the side sound port, I can really hear what I'm playing. And the price, more than reasonable. I would recommend it, especially to anyone that likes the idea of using a smart renewable resource wood. One caveat, there are only side fretmarkers at the 5th, 7th and 10th fret.
 
Again, cattle is why koa isn't as plentiful as it should be. Want to save a koa tree? Give up eating beef. Cited from several sources on the Internet:
Koa in NOT an endangered wood. While Koa grows only in Hawaii, it is still the second most common tree in the State. There are presently over 100,000 acres being grown commercially. Current projections of Koa industry consumption require less than 6,000 acres on a sustainable basis. Hence, there are currently significantly more acres of Koa available than the industry will use. That being said, much of the original Koa forest land from old Hawaii had been converted to cattle pastureland in the past century.
All of the growers/harvesters I know are also required to replant.
Anyone want to try playing an uke made of cow leather?

Chuck is right on. When in Hawaii last month I talked to many high end wood workers about the scarcity of KOA. The answer was the same, KOA is very plentiful but the "GOOD" KOA is very scarce. When I asked what that meant, they all replied 100% the same. The high end woodworkers (artists who make the very expensive bowls, furniture ,etc) are all after the old, very curly (compression curl if they can find it), high grade wood. That stuff is what is very scarce as that is the stuff that has so much beauty that when made into a bowl someone is willing to pay $3K for it. As an artist who will spend the same amount of time and effort making a KOA bowl no matter the grade, they obviously want to make it out of the best wood possible to get a premium for the final object. So I think every time you hear about the scarcity of KOA that is what you are hearing about.
 
It may be the conditions all over Asia but remember that is their culture. It's not ours.

But I understand the whole "abused" thing:)

Who is this 'we' we're talking about?
I'm Asian-American, so yeah, I'd consider Asia that to be part of 'my culture.' Thanks for assuming that, I guess? Moreover, I don't buy cultural relativism in general, and I'm not even sure how that excuses the insane double standard we have going on here. But really, I'm fine with accepting the fact that working conditions abroad are awful. However, what others seem to be doing is NOT recognizing how bad it is over there and write it off as, 'oh, they're not REALLY abused.' That's abhorrent.
 
If you are concerned about deforestation in general then you should boycott any and all products containing palm oil. It's used in food, and cosmetics, and many other places. The demand for palm oil is the driver for large scale deforestation, see e.g. http://www.orangutan.org.au/palmoil.html
It's also just about the most unhealthy oil you can ingest so you shouldn't really eat any food containing palm oil in the first place. The problem is that most of the time food or other products are not even labeled as containing palm oil - so the other thing you could do would be to support such labeling to be required by law.
 
Who is this 'we' we're talking about?
I'm Asian-American, so yeah, I'd consider Asia that to be part of 'my culture.' Thanks for assuming that, I guess? Moreover, I don't buy cultural relativism in general, and I'm not even sure how that excuses the insane double standard we have going on here. But really, I'm fine with accepting the fact that working conditions abroad are awful. However, what others seem to be doing is NOT recognizing how bad it is over there and write it off as, 'oh, they're not REALLY abused.' That's abhorrent.

You can't assume working conditions are always horrible either. For example, I personally know that the workers at our factory get several paid weeks off for Chinese New Year and are appreciated for their expertise.
I think large corporations like Nike who have alot of unskilled labor are more likely to abuse their employees. I have a sisiter-in law that worked at a Nike factory for about $4.50 a day.
 
So far so good - but watch the judgmental posts folks. Be respectful of each others opinion or I will shut this thread down.
 
So far we have covered, conservation, deforesting, exploiting labor, exporting jobs, education deficiencies, and I'm sure a few more.

I figure we're a page or two from tackling world hunger and then hammering out a middle east peace plan.

Good work!

John
 
Who is this 'we' we're talking about?
I'm Asian-American, so yeah, I'd consider Asia that to be part of 'my culture.' Thanks for assuming that, I guess? Moreover, I don't buy cultural relativism in general, and I'm not even sure how that excuses the insane double standard we have going on here. But really, I'm fine with accepting the fact that working conditions abroad are awful. However, what others seem to be doing is NOT recognizing how bad it is over there and write it off as, 'oh, they're not REALLY abused.' That's abhorrent.

I agree with you. It isn't good, but are we (the general popualtion) willing to make the sacrafices that it would entail to change it?
But it is funny b/c most of us that think things need to be changed in Asia are against the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan which are in essence changing things over there. That is the double standard that I am talking about.
 
So far we have covered, conservation, deforesting, exploiting labor, exporting jobs, education deficiencies, and I'm sure a few more.

I figure we're a page or two from tackling world hunger and then hammering out a middle east peace plan.

Good work!

John

Good Point, hopefully we get that resolved before the lock happens:)
 
So you would rather have koa, mahogany, ebony, and rosewood trees rot in the jungle untouched rather than make them into ukuleles and guitars, or violins and clarinets and oboes?

What separates humans from animals is we harness the environment to improve our quality of life. We don't just sit there and let it go to waste.

I'm all for conserving and farming rare woods and exploring alternative woods, but not to the point of letting those resources just sit there. I can't think of a better use for those woods than to make high end musical instruments.

And if roads need to be cut through a jungle to get at them, so be it. There's nothing sacred about a jungle, and if there's easier transportation and communication, there would be a lot less starvation and poverty in those areas.

By the way, once those roads are no longer used, a jungle will take over the area within just a few years.
 
So you would rather have koa, mahogany, ebony, and rosewood trees rot in the jungle untouched rather than make them into ukuleles and guitars, or violins and clarinets and oboes?

What separates humans from animals is we harness the environment to improve our quality of life. We don't just sit there and let it go to waste.

I'm all for conserving and farming rare woods and exploring alternative woods, but not to the point of letting those resources just sit there. I can't think of a better use for those woods than to make high end musical instruments.

And if roads need to be cut through a jungle to get at them, so be it. There's nothing sacred about a jungle, and if there's easier transportation and communication, there would be a lot less starvation and poverty in those areas.

By the way, once those roads are no longer used, a jungle will take over the area within just a few years.

I recently went on a guided tour of our local water catchment area, which is basically a large valley that has been cordoned off, has active pest control etc but is otherwise untouched native forest. There are trees there that are thousands of years old. While we were walking along I noticed that a large Kauri tree had fallen across the track and they'd simply cut and moved a section out to the side of the track, simply in order to clear the track. I asked why they hadn't harvested it because it was absolutely beautiful wood just waiting to be used for producing similarly beautiful things. The answer was that because the area had been relatively untouched by man and, as such places are far and few between, the legislative mandate had come down that no flora or fauna was to leave the catchment area.

There was a Department of Conservation ranger from another area of the country there who was keen on gathering some seeds to transplant onto the island that he looked after, and he was denied by his own colleagues, the rules are that strict. One of the other rangers piped up and said that there were fellow rangers who were not too fond of the rules, because to their eyes there was perfectly good firewood going to waste.

Further along we saw another tree, a Pohutukawa, that had fallen over in a storm a few years ago. Its carcass was teeming with life with all sorts of saplings and ferns growing out of it. That was given as a reasonably good example as to why trees that fall over were left to rot - in order to encourage and sustain new growth, and to foster the wildlife that lived in the area.

Yes, harvesting deadfall is a sensible way to gain endangered wood resources, but at the same time you're still breaking that chain in the ecosystem (I didn't want to say "circle" for risk of invoking choruses of "The Circle of Life", I'm too hungover for Disney tunes :) ), you could say that you may as well just cut the trees down because the end result is the same.

I can appreciate your point of view, and on any other day I'd agree with you, but there's another side to the coin here :)
 
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Please Buy Endangered Woods!

I have a rather intimate knowledge of this situation. I have spent most of my career in furniture, a decade of it overseas, including a bit of work in timber exports. I have ridden through forests, selecting the trees we would saw, mill and dry for our furniture exports. I have negociated with landowners and loggers.

Although I was offered a contract in China, I never went. What I'll say here is from a Latin American perspective. I know enough about other markets, however, to be able to say it applies in most other places as well.

First, wood products of any kind have almost nothing to do with deforestation. As others have suggested, it is conversion to agriculture that has done away with so much forest land.

You can, however, make an argument about not using certain endangered woods in the name of biodiversity. Boycotting them, however, is the best way to drive them toward extiniction.

The best way to keep forests is to keep value in forest products. Whether it is a wealthy landowner, or a poor campesino, if the forest cannot generate an income for him, then agriculture or cattle land, even the poorest sort, is where most will turn.

Prized timber is one of the valuable resources of the forest. It should not be cut wholesale, of course, but managed. Good forestry practices can make it a constant source of income.

Our small countries are trying to promote other sources of income as well, but without much budget or success. Probably can't find Iguana meat anywhere near, I imagine. Yes, I said Iguana. They live in the natural tropical forests, not cleared land or timber plantations, are much tastier than beef, and would be another substantial source of income for forest owners if we could develop a market. Every little piece of income means less chance of conversion to farm or pasture.

So please, look for Iguana steaks, bugers or whatever you can find (serious), and try to buy all your ukuleles made from rare tropical woods. That way you'll really be doing something to save our forests.
 
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You can't assume working conditions are always horrible either. For example, I personally know that the workers at our factory get several paid weeks off for Chinese New Year and are appreciated for their expertise.
I think large corporations like Nike who have alot of unskilled labor are more likely to abuse their employees. I have a sisiter-in law that worked at a Nike factory for about $4.50 a day.

I'm quoting Hoosier because the people who built this new Mainland I just got did a great job. It beats the pants off of other ukes I've had. We know that in such a factory, they don't get paid US scale, but my hope is that it's a nice place to work, conditions are what you expect from a nice place to work, and the hours are reasonable for a human being to tolerate, and it's generally the kind of place where you get an honest day's pay for an honest day's work in conditions that are not sweat shop slave labor.

As far as it is possible to do, would it be possible to post information on the Mainland site as to how the ukes are made? Obviously I know you wouldn't want to give anything away, or overlap with any other brands. It would be something that the competition isn't doing, if you want to look at it that way. I know Ko'olau has talked about it openly though. I can't find anything on Kala though. It's easy enough to see on sites like Alibaba who is possibly making some brands of ukes, but that's never the whole story. Another way to look at it is: These people are building us fine ukes, let's recognize them.

I realize the factory or the other brands involved in the factory may not allow it, but why sweep things under a rug if there's no need to. That's my thinking. And cheers for bringing us these fine ukes. :)
 
I agree Whetu I was going to post similar. A rotting tree in a forest is far from a waste in my eyes, its the breakdown of the nutrients it holds that feeds the forest. Been some interesting points/views raised in this discussion! Dont want to set an arguement lol but im pretty sure other animals 'harness' their environment also? I do agree they dont make such nice instruments out of their environment though :) And I agree the power of jungles to retake areas as you say, as long as they arent damaged too critically.
 
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