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Down Up Dick
12-02-2014, 05:40 AM
Is anyone other than me interested in reading tabs like music? Or maybe some of you already read them.

I can read music notation and sing it. That sometimes comes in very handy plus it enables me to sing songs from a book. Now I'm trying to learn to do it with tabs.

It's not difficult so far. If one sees a 3 on line 1 it's a C. If it's on line 2 it's a G and so on. That's if he's on hi-GCEA of course. So if it's a C or a G then one can sing that note, and Bob's his uncle.

Anyone else do this? Or does everyone else do this? It seems like it might help me learn to play tabs more comfortably. I'm gettin' better at it, but they're still giving the yips.

It's always somethin'! :old:

Laouik
12-02-2014, 05:46 AM
The best ones for me are the ones with both, like this (http://ukulelehunt.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/11/solobuch1.pdf). You get the simplicity of the tab (I can read notation, but takes me longer so it's nice to have the tab), but also the higher precision of the notation to better interpret what's intended.

JonThysell
12-02-2014, 06:11 AM
It is completely possible to "sight-read" tabs. Start with simpler tabbed arrangements and work your way up. Chord melody arrangements (like say those from Ukulele Mike) are a great starting point. You can read the tabs and convert them to the notes in your head if that helps you "hear" the song better, or helps you learn the fretboard better, or you can just play the tabs without actively thinking about the notes and focusing on the shapes/hand movements.

Down Up Dick
12-02-2014, 06:39 AM
It is completely possible to "sight-read" tabs. Start with simpler tabbed arrangements and work your way up. Chord melody arrangements (like say those from Ukulele Mike) are a great starting point. You can read the tabs and convert them to the notes in your head if that helps you "hear" the song better, or helps you learn the fretboard better, or you can just play the tabs without actively thinking about the notes and focusing on the shapes/hand movements.

Yeah, that's what I thought. Maybe my tab reading would become more automatic like it is with music notation. If I play songs, reading music, it goes much smoother, but I guess, if one plays ukulele, he must read tabs.

Ha! A good idea! :old:

keod
12-02-2014, 08:33 AM
I've actually started to write notes/chords above the tabs. It seems to be helping me a lot to learn the fretboard, train the ear and remember the music.

itsme
12-02-2014, 08:48 AM
The best ones for me are the ones with both, like this (http://ukulelehunt.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/11/solobuch1.pdf). You get the simplicity of the tab (I can read notation, but takes me longer so it's nice to have the tab), but also the higher precision of the notation to better interpret what's intended.
I agree. And there are some tabs without standard notation that do use some of the same conventions to indicate timing and note duration which are way easier to sight read that just plain ASCII tabs.

http://pdfminstrel.files.wordpress.com/2011/12/canarios_up1.pdf

Down Up Dick
12-02-2014, 09:30 AM
The best ones for me are the ones with both, like this (http://ukulelehunt.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/11/solobuch1.pdf). You get the simplicity of the tab (I can read notation, but takes me longer so it's nice to have the tab), but also the higher precision of the notation to better interpret what's intended.

I like that too, but, when I go to next line, I sometimes go to the wrong line and get mixed up. No biggy, I guess, but it's irritating. I like music notation best. :old:

IamNoMan
12-02-2014, 10:04 AM
I use tabs to get the right chords. The tab styles Laouik and itsme posted show the timing and rhythms which I like but I find lyric-less and rhythmless tabs to be of very little utility.

I play by ear. I work out my own fingerpicking melodies. I am starting to work with movable chords so the chord stamps are less helpful than when I first started. One does not need to read tabs to play Ukulele. - It is helpful from time to time. Whatever floats your boat is certainly acceptable.

kypfer
12-02-2014, 12:07 PM
Down Up Dick asked:
Is anyone other than me interested in reading tabs like music? Or maybe some of you already read them.For the ukulele, I sight-read tab almost exclusively. I've got several e-publications (and one "real" book) that are in that format. As these supply me with the sources of lute music and clawhammer that I enjoy playing on the ukulele (yes, I know, ... weird!) I set about learning tab for that reason :)

I use some tab on 5-string banjo, again, clawhammer, play guitar mostly from chord-shapes and by ear and play mandolin and woodwind from notation ... horses for courses ... YMMV etc etc ;)

Down Up Dick
12-02-2014, 12:33 PM
kypfer, that's not what I meant by "reading tabs". I meant reading them as one reads music notation. Maybe even using them to sing or whistle with or even play some other instrument.

One should be able to read them (after a while) and hum or whistle them to know how the tune goes as he does with sheet music. I was just wondering if anyone already does that. I'm working on it, and I think it's comin' along, but I just started it recently. It may help me to be more comfortable playing tabs with the Uke.

Don't ever stop to rest or you'll stiffen up! :old:

kypfer
12-02-2014, 01:31 PM
Down Up Dick wrote:
Maybe even using them to sing or whistle with or even play some other instrument. ... mmmm ... sounds like making a rod for one's own back! ... having said that, I have taken a tab (for something or other) and transcribed it to conventional notation so's I could use the tune on another instrument, just to see what it would be like, but to try to play ukulele tab on a mandolin or whistle directly ... I suffer enough ;)

Much as the reason I learnt conventional notation, I read tabs so's I can at least get an idea of what the tune sounds like by playing it directly on the instrument the tab was designed for.

Good luck to you, though. If you can achieve the result you're hoping for I can see it being a useful tool ... not sure I want to go to that effort :)

Down Up Dick
12-02-2014, 01:45 PM
It's not too difficult, kypfer, if one knows his fret board. I'm a big one for scales. I play them all the time on all my instruments. One can't play well, I feel, if he doesn't know where the notes are. I'm sure, if you play by ear, you know your fret board.

I still think that tabs are a bad idea, but I'm doing a lot better with them. Today I finger picked some tunes both with tabs and music notation and did well. I also played some Irish tunes on my F Irish flute--lots of fun.

Up the Irish! :old:

Jim Yates
12-02-2014, 05:24 PM
Tab, written correctly, gives as much information as standard notation. The tab in the case that you linked to is incomplete and worse than useless in my way of thinking. Proper tab has note values given using the same conventions as standard notation.
The only thing that makes tab less useful than standard notation is that it is instrument specific, so you cannot use tab written for mandolin to play on the ukulele.

Here's a complete tab for The Ash Grove
73608

http://www.banjohangout.org/photo/54010

Down Up Dick
12-02-2014, 07:46 PM
I'm sorry, Jim, but I don't understand your comment. I can't read your attachment (too small), but it looks like music notation to me. I didn't link to any tab.

No comprendo. :old:

kypfer
12-02-2014, 09:29 PM
Jim Yates wrote :
Here's a complete tab for The Ash GroveUnfortunately Jim, to my eye, this tab is another variation on tab which is just that little bit different. I'm used to reading the numbers ON the lines of a 4-string stave for ukulele, much as published by Aaron Keim, Jamie Holding, Barry Sholder et al. Trying to read between the lines on a 5-line stave I find confusing :(

Dick ... to see the tab full-size, you'll need to click on the text link below the little picture ;)

JAC!
12-03-2014, 01:26 AM
Out of curiosity, do any of you use Guitar Pro (or something similar) which gives you the tabs and the standard notation?

I am familiar with GP, but I have never used it for ukulele.

Down Up Dick
12-03-2014, 02:59 AM
Jim Yates wrote :Unfortunately Jim, to my eye, this tab is another variation on tab which is just that little bit different. I'm used to reading the numbers ON the lines of a 4-string stave for ukulele, much as published by Aaron Keim, Jamie Holding, Barry Sholder et al. Trying to read between the lines on a 5-line stave I find confusing :(

Dick ... to see the tab full-size, you'll need to click on the text link below the little picture ;)

Yeah, kypfer, I did what you said, and I agree it's certainly no easier to read than tabs. I guess tabs are tabs. I guess I'm being stubborn, but I still don't understand why strummers all insist on using tabs. They don't tell one which finger to use. They only tell one where to fret, but, after one learns to play a bit, he can fret any way he chooses. But I've had this debate a few times before, and now I'm learning tabs. Maybe I'll see the light.

No, JAC!, I don't use Guitar Pro or know anything about it.

To think I started out just wanting to strum to my singing--Ahhh well . . . :old:

Laouik
12-03-2014, 03:17 AM
I like that too, but, when I go to next line, I sometimes go to the wrong line and get mixed up. No biggy, I guess, but it's irritating. I like music notation best. :old:

When it has both tablature (tab) and notation, I approach it as a multi-instrument page and focus on "mine", glancing at the other for precision :)

Jim Yates
12-03-2014, 03:35 AM
Jim Yates wrote :Unfortunately Jim, to my eye, this tab is another variation on tab which is just that little bit different. I'm used to reading the numbers ON the lines of a 4-string stave for ukulele, much as published by Aaron Keim, Jamie Holding, Barry Sholder et al. Trying to read between the lines on a 5-line stave I find confusing :(

Dick ... to see the tab full-size, you'll need to click on the text link below the little picture ;)

I'm sorry, I forgot that I had used 5 line staff paper and so used the spaces rather than lines. I write tabs both ways and the folks who I write them for don't seem to have trouble adapting. I'm so used to it that I don't even notice the difference.
The point I was trying to make is that the time values are shown in this tab, eliminating the need for a parallel staff of standard notation.

I find this type of tab which doesn't show timing, not very useful:

______________7__7__6__5__7__7__6__5__4__5__7_____ 7__5___
__0__1__2__3__8__8__7__6__8__8__7__5__4__5__5__8__ ___4___
__0__2__3__4__9__9__8__7__9__9__8__5__4__5__5_____ ___5___
__________________________________________________ _______

Down Up Dick
12-03-2014, 03:39 AM
Yes, of course, Laouik, that's what I do too, but sometimes I look from the tab line to the next notation line and get mixed up.

This kind of music is more useful because one can sing or play a different instrument with it.

Beware the tabs . . . :old:

JAC!
12-03-2014, 03:59 AM
(snip)...

No, JAC!, I don't use Guitar Pro or know anything about it.

To think I started out just wanting to strum to my singing--Ahhh well . . . :old:

I don't wish to derail the thread, but Guitar Pro may be of interest to some of you.

It is a notation program, which allows you to insert many kinds of instruments, each on their own track, and can play back the music. It contains tabs, chords, and regular notation. It also you to mute or solo certain instruments so you can play along to the correct timing.

There are thousands of transcriptions available for download online (although the program itself is not free), and you can transpose from one instrument to another etc.

Sorry if this is unwanted information, it is not my intention to hijack the thread, and I am in no way affiliated with GP, but it has helped me a lot to learn bass, and I think it will also help me to learn ukulele.

Here is a video on youtube which explains about the program.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=in5u28_jKTc

Down Up Dick
12-03-2014, 04:02 AM
I'm sorry, I forgot that I had used 5 line staff paper and so used the spaces rather than lines. I write tabs both ways and the folks who I write them for don't seem to have trouble adapting. I'm so used to it that I don't even notice the difference.
The point I was trying to make is that the time values are shown in this tab, eliminating the need for a parallel staff of standard notation.



I find this type of tab which doesn't show timing, not very useful:

______________7__7__6__5__7__7__6__5__4__5__7_____ 7__5___
__0__1__2__3__8__8__7__6__8__8__7__5__4__5__5__8__ ___4___
__0__2__3__4__9__9__8__7__9__9__8__5__4__5__5_____ ___5___
__________________________________________________ _______


Well, Jim, I only bother with tabs because some uke books don't have music notation, and many ukeists don't read music. To communicate with them, I feel that I need to know tabs. I'm gettin' better using tabs, but playing with music is better yet. I strongly prefer music notation. It has everything a good musician needs to play and sing, and I'm usta it. I just don't see the attraction for tabs.

Give me that good ol' fashioned music! :old:

kypfer
12-03-2014, 04:32 AM
I'm sorry, I forgot that I had used 5 line staff paper and so used the spaces rather than lines. I write tabs both ways and the folks who I write them for don't seem to have trouble adapting. I'm so used to it that I don't even notice the difference.
The point I was trying to make is that the time values are shown in this tab, eliminating the need for a parallel staff of standard notation.

I find this type of tab which doesn't show timing, not very useful:

______________7__7__6__5__7__7__6__5__4__5__7_____ 7__5___
__0__1__2__3__8__8__7__6__8__8__7__5__4__5__5__8__ ___4___
__0__2__3__4__9__9__8__7__9__9__8__5__4__5__5_____ ___5___
__________________________________________________ _______
Jim, point taken, I'm sure I'd adjust with a little practice, it was just a little confusing at first glance.

I'm with you all the way on tabs with no timing or phrasing. Just about acceptable as a personal note for a tune one knows well, but virtually pointless if one doesn't already know the music!

dxdydz
12-03-2014, 05:46 AM
I still don't understand why strummers all insist on using tabs. They don't tell one which finger to use. They only tell one where to fret, but, after one learns to play a bit, he can fret any way he chooses.

Of course one can play the notes however he chooses, but then you're not playing the tab. I think part of the argument for tab (besides its clearer mapping to the instrument) is that the same note played in two ways does not always sound the same. An open string note has a different quality to that same note played fretting another string. Sure, the pitch is the same, but there's still a difference.

Down Up Dick
12-03-2014, 06:30 AM
Of course one can play the notes however he chooses, but then you're not playing the tab. I think part of the argument for tab (besides its clearer mapping to the instrument) is that the same note played in two ways does not always sound the same. An open string note has a different quality to that same note played fretting another string. Sure, the pitch is the same, but there's still a difference..

If one doesn't like the way a note sounds, he should play it the way he likes it. But we're way far away from the subject of this thread. And stuff about tabs vs. notation has been done to death :deadhorse:.

Tabs for all and all for tabs! :old:

Kayak Jim
12-03-2014, 12:40 PM
If anyone comes to this thread wondering HOW to read tabs, Tonya has a lesson on that. Scroll way down to, um, tablature lesson. http://ukuleletonya.com/blog/files

Down Up Dick
12-03-2014, 01:53 PM
If anyone comes to this thread wondering HOW to read tabs, Tonya has a lesson on that. Scroll way down to, um, tablature lesson. http://ukuleletonya.com/blog/files

Sorry, but that's not what I was commenting on. I want to read the tabs as one reads sheet music when singing, or maybe to hum or whistle it, to see how the tune sounds. I'm playing lots of scales and tunes to learn the fretboard. Learning how to read the tabs should help me to fingerpick and maybe play by ear. If one sees a tab note and knows what note it is, he should be able to sing or whistle it. It works with music notation; I do it all the time.

Don't stop learning! :old:

Jim Yates
12-03-2014, 03:59 PM
One advantage to tab is that it is much easier to learn. I have a number of students with a number of different learning styles. Those who wish to learn by tab, usually adult students, can learn to read a basic tab in one or two lessons.
Those who wish to learn using standard notation take much longer to read simple melodies.
I also have students who do not wish to rely on any written music. I encourage these students to record the main points of the lesson using their phone or a recorder of some kind. Actually, this is a good practice for all of my students.

katysax
12-03-2014, 05:42 PM
Because I started out on wind instruments, I've found reading standard notation to be pretty easy. But tab is even easier for uke or guitar because I don't have to make so many decisions about where on the neck to pick the note or notes. Once you get used to reading tab it's pretty much the same as standard notation. I've got hundreds of songs in tab and playing from the tab is one of my favorite things to do. It's much faster and easier to learn songs from tab than from watching videos.

Down Up Dick
12-28-2014, 07:00 AM
Well, I've got the notes on the low part of the keyboard and some further up learned. Also, I can slowly fumble through a song reading tabs too, so I think it can be done.

I dunno, but i'm agonna keep tryin'! :old:

phil hague
12-28-2014, 08:21 AM
With re-entrant tuning on the uke it is easier to folow tab than notation ( well it is for me ) but I like the notation as well as it gives a better timing of the notes. So lets have both together please.

Down Up Dick
12-28-2014, 09:55 AM
Well, ubulele, I, and many, many choir members and other singers, can read music and sing it. I can also hear it in my head most of the time.

What I'm trying to do is do the same thing with tabs. I can also fingerpick tabs, so I guess I could sight read like that, but I thought (think) it would be a benefit to be able to read tabs like music.

The problem I'm having now is playing the chords, singing the melody and reading/remembering the words. :old:

Down Up Dick
12-28-2014, 12:40 PM
That's next, I suppose, ubulele. Old age is really a trial. One breaks his/her head trying to learn something, and two days later, he/she can't remember it. Ahhh, well . . . :old: