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IamNoMan
12-17-2014, 05:46 AM
This is a response and spin-off of the "Just the way it is" Thread started by Rllink.
I think that the spirit of the thread got lost fairly quickly, if I even conveyed it well enough in the first place, but it is true that where I was going when I wrote it might be a little abstract, and probably not a good subject for an internet forum. I was hoping for something a little less literal and a little more spiritual, but what the heck,a strap/no strap thread is always fun.

I am a Taoist. You can call it Unitarian or Deist or what ever you want. But I believe there are 1000 ways to God. Any form of spiritualism that makes the burdens of your life more bearable is OK by me. (Atheism is OK if it works for you but I do draw the line at Thuggee).

Tao means Path or Way or even Word, (in the Biblical Sense). More importantly it is Your Way.

I have many paths I follow but the most important, and satisfying path for me is Sound. I am a musician, singer and storyteller. One of my favorite things is to go outside at night and listen. I listen to birds, thunder, trains in the night. If its cloudy that's OK I won't be distracted by the stars. One of my other favorite sounds is the sound of snow falling. Far and away my most favorite-ist sound is Music.

Your turn.

ohmless
12-17-2014, 06:45 AM
Right on bro. I am an atheist but practice the philosophy of Dudeism which from what I understand from others quite like Taoism so we have some kindred of sorts. Still following a path of least resistance(thus the name) and trying to make the world a better place.

My recent success has been with patience and saving money for a new uke. I haven't been stressing over not being able to afford it because I have been busy enjoying the uke hunt. Therefore looking to not add negativity to the world, abiding my time patiently. TBH it doesn't really even matter when I get the uke since I am already happy.

warndt
12-17-2014, 08:20 AM
Right on bro. I am an atheist but practice the philosophy of Dudeism which from what I understand from others quite like Taoism so we have some kindred of sorts. Still following a path of least resistance(thus the name) and trying to make the world a better place.

Say what you will about Dudeism...at least it's an ethos.

PereBourik
12-17-2014, 08:25 AM
I am a professional Christian, from the mode of Christianity that is generous to the spiritual quest generally. Music is the beginning and guide of my path. The only imperatives are to keep moving on the path and be sensitive to the flow.

bonesoup
12-17-2014, 01:03 PM
When i have a plinky laminate, i play a plinky laminate.
When i have a resonant K, i play a resonant K.
Careful man, there's a beverage here.

Dan Uke
12-17-2014, 08:12 PM
I am ESL. You guys really talk like this?

buddhuu
12-17-2014, 09:17 PM
A member has reported this post and thread because of the religious angle.

To clarify: there is NO rule against talking about religion. So long as this thread remains cordial and free from the intervention of jerks (something we DO have a rule about) then it does not present a problem. There is a rule about not posting stuff that is obviously headed for destruction but, IMO, this thread does not fall into that category.

Only thing is, if it turns out to have very little uke content then it may get moved to "General Discussion".

So, carry on, play nice and have a good day.

RAB11
12-17-2014, 09:40 PM
A member has reported this post and thread because of the religious angle.



This will almost certainly break the don't be a jerk rule but that person needs to have a long hard look at themselves. Getting offended about the mere mention of religion, whether you're religious yourself or not, is pretty pathetic. Ignore the thread and get on with your life.

And have a nice day,

CeeJay
12-17-2014, 09:47 PM
This will almost certainly break the don't be a jerk rule but that person needs to have a long hard look at themselves. Getting offended about the mere mention of religion, whether you're religious yourself or not, is pretty pathetic. Ignore the thread and get on with your life.

And have a nice day,

I actually thought the moderators response to the complaint rather a rich, unneccesary and belligerent comment ......but then he and I have views ;)

She calls me Jacques
12-17-2014, 10:11 PM
Ukulele as a metaphor for life:


"...before we can even think about learning how to play it, we must first concentrate hard and learn the RULES of ukulele:

1. Music is about invention and expression, not being tied to lists of rules telling the student what is and isn't allowed.
2. That's it.

Will Grove-White, Get Plucky with the Ukulele, p15

buddhuu
12-17-2014, 10:12 PM
Don't do it, CeeJay.

CeeJay
12-17-2014, 10:13 PM
Ukulele as a metaphor for life:


Will Grove-White, Get Plucky with the Ukulele, p15


It is at best a funky little instrument..at worst, a metaphor for things that it is not.

Hippie Dribble
12-17-2014, 10:44 PM
I actually thought the moderators response to the complaint rather a rich, unneccesary and belligerent comment ......but then he and I have views ;)

That is a totally unwarranted remark. When posts and/or threads are reported the moderators have a responsibility to act on behalf of the membership. Given the nature of this topic and issues that can and do sometimes arise as a result of religious discussions, I believe that buddhuu's post was extremely sensitive,fair minded and even handed. He has given us all the benefit of any doubt, left the thread open and explained his reasons for doing so. Without people like buddhuu et.al this forum would not be the place we all enjoy. Keep on fishing but be careful what you catch.

kypfer
12-17-2014, 11:09 PM
I am ESL. You guys really talk like this?I'm guessing "ESL" is "English as a Second Language"?

In answer to your question, from my personal experience, yes, there are people who "really talk like that"! Any further comment could be seen as inflammatory, so I'll leave it there ;)

buddhuu
12-17-2014, 11:28 PM
This will almost certainly break the don't be a jerk rule but that person needs to have a long hard look at themselves. Getting offended about the mere mention of religion, whether you're religious yourself or not, is pretty pathetic. Ignore the thread and get on with your life.

And have a nice day,

I don't think the person was offended, I think it was just a misunderstanding about the rules.

No matter. All is calm.

CeeJay
12-17-2014, 11:31 PM
I don't think the person was offended, I think it was just a misunderstanding about the rules.

No matter. All is calm.

Is it Bright ??....

CeeJay
12-17-2014, 11:33 PM
Don't do it, CeeJay.

Eh? Don't do what ?

oh hay.......not fair .....Is pulling your leg off limits now? :confused:

DownUpDave
12-17-2014, 11:51 PM
The Tao of Ukulele.......or path or way.....is an interesting concept. If the the ukulele makes a joyful noise then the way would be one of giving. I am also very much in tune with the vibrational qualities of a well made uke held against your body while playing. An old hippie singer/uke player said it healed the heart and soul. I know it makes me feel better as it resonates through out my body.

Hippie Dribble
12-18-2014, 12:27 AM
For me, whatever faith one professes, music brings us closer to the Truth than anything else.

MUSIC

The skin we wear.
The masks we hide behind.
Lives spent building fortresses
guarded by pleasantries
and feigned smiles

are nought but a house of cards
buffeted by the wind.
Icebergs
at the sun's mercy.
The bark of trees
Layers of onions
Sliced, diced
Stripped to the core.

A kind of perfect death is
the epiphany of life itself;
that expresses what language
cannot:

For truth begins where words end -
and, when the music plays
is captured in the phrase of a melody,
a perfectly struck single note.

CeeJay
12-18-2014, 12:52 AM
That is a totally unwarranted remark. When posts and/or threads are reported the moderators have a responsibility to act on behalf of the membership. Given the nature of this topic and issues that can and do sometimes arise as a result of religious discussions, I believe that buddhuu's post was extremely sensitive,fair minded and even handed. He has given us all the benefit of any doubt, left the thread open and explained his reasons for doing so. Without people like buddhuu et.al this forum would not be the place we all enjoy. Keep on fishing but be careful what you catch.

It was actually a robust and off the cuff quip, but intended as humourous ...and as I pm'd you .....that has perhaps evaded your attention....sorry if it offended you.

UkeCan1
12-18-2014, 02:15 AM
1) I absolutely love this thread. I'm not quite sure yet what I want to add to it, but I love it ... especially the Dude quote and even more especially the uke-playing "rules" ... which are a much shorter encapsulation of the philosophy I've been espousing for the last 16 months to anyone who'll listen.

My expression for it: "Let the Fun Drive".

Following that philosophy has helped me learn surprisingly fast, have a fabulous time, discover that I could write original songs, some of which have been quite entertaining and/or moving to others, learn all sorts of stuff I never expected to be interested in, and so forth.

Every time I forget, and try to "make" myself do something I think I "should", I stop having a good time, and start finding myself not wanting to play. So I quickly remind myself and get back to the fun, and all's well after that.

Okay, I guess I had something to add after all.


2) I had to read CeeJay's comment about 12 times before I finally got the joke. He didn't actually mean that the moderator's comment was unnecessary and belligerent ... he was jokingly playing at being the kind of flaming poster who would say a thing like that on a thread dealing with religion. Now that I get it, I actually do think it's quite funny ... but it sure sounded to me like he meant it the first 11 times I read it.

CeeJay, love you to pieces, but I do sometimes wish you'd find a clearer way to let us know when you are pulling our collective legs. Buddhuu, your comment was spot on, and your moderation of this thread is quite excellent. I'm pretty sure CeeJay thinks so too ... now I get that he really was making a joke. So, let's all breathe, have a laugh, and remember that we love each other. Which is part of the point of the thread to begin with, I think. Group hug!

buddhuu
12-18-2014, 02:17 AM
From the rules:

2) General Conduct - Please do:
2.1 Stay on topic.
2.2 Post when you have something to say rather than to just make noise. A cluttered forum is more difficult to manage and moderate.
We are introducing noise into this thread. Please stay on topic.

(This is a general note, not directed at any specific member.)

buddhuu
12-18-2014, 02:19 AM
[...] Group hug!

I'm in. :)

(Apologies, I just contributed to the off topic noise.)

IamNoMan
12-18-2014, 03:08 AM
Wow, talk about thread drift!

Nice poem hippie dribble. Just the sort of thing I was hoping for.

Tao can be spiritual or philosophical, or not. Zen is just the same way. It about dualism and considering all side of an issue. There are ukers that play by ear and there are ukers that have to read the music. Both points of view are valid. Some ukers are in it for the fun. Some take it seriously. Or not, these are all valid points.

I engage in both aspects of ukulele. When I am jamming with folks I try to immerse myself in the flow and not stick out or shine out. I like to listen and play what makes everybody else sound better. Doesn't always work.

I wondered why the thread disappeared for a while.

bonesoup
12-18-2014, 03:25 AM
I am ESL. You guys really talk like this?

Ive taught esl so let me explain. In my post the first two lines are a lao tzu parody, for fun and good smiles. The last line is a quote from the movie The Big Lebowski. There are other quotes from it in the first several posts, which out of context could sound confusing. Hope this is helpful!

bonesoup
12-18-2014, 03:27 AM
The Tao of Ukulele.......or path or way.....is an interesting concept. If the the ukulele makes a joyful noise then the way would be one of giving. I am also very much in tune with the vibrational qualities of a well made uke held against your body while playing. An old hippie singer/uke player said it healed the heart and soul. I know it makes me feel better as it resonates through out my body.

Awesome point. Ive been holding the uke away from my body for a better sound but maybe i should knock that off!

Hippie Dribble
12-18-2014, 03:31 AM
Wow, talk about thread drift!

Nice poem hippie dribble. Just the sort of thing I was hoping for.

Tao can be spiritual or philosophical, or not. Zen is just the same way. It about dualism and considering all side of an issue.

Thankyou brother. This is a wonderful thread. Music is all to me.

Language is sinewy, slippery and loose enough for the truth to evade. Not so with music.

bonesoup
12-18-2014, 03:33 AM
1) I absolutely love this thread. I'm not quite sure yet what I want to add to it, but I love it ... especially the Dude quote and even more especially the uke-playing "rules" ... which are a much shorter encapsulation of the philosophy I've been espousing for the last 16 months to anyone who'll listen.

My expression for it: "Let the Fun Drive".

Following that philosophy has helped me learn surprisingly fast, have a fabulous time, discover that I could write original songs, some of which have been quite entertaining and/or moving to others, learn all sorts of stuff I never expected to be interested in, and so forth.

Every time I forget, and try to "make" myself do something I think I "should", I stop having a good time, and start finding myself not wanting to play. So I quickly remind myself and get back to the fun, and all's well after that.


Thats a great way of looking at it, let the fun drive. A small example from myself is the four finger strum. Ive struggled to do it with the right technique, leading with the pinky. But leading with the pointer is much more natural and smoother for me. So the heck with it, ill have fun and do it wrong.

DownUpDave
12-18-2014, 04:33 AM
Thats a great way of looking at it, let the fun drive. A small example from myself is the four finger strum. Ive struggled to do it with the right technique, leading with the pinky. But leading with the pointer is much more natural and smoother for me. So the heck with it, ill have fun and do it wrong.

I just tried your leading with the pointer method and it works quite well, nice one.

You said "I'll have fun and do it wrong" I like that. I just realized that if you are having fun you can't be doing it wrong. Thanks for the perspective, this is all good stuff.

UkeCan1
12-18-2014, 06:01 AM
Thats a great way of looking at it, let the fun drive. A small example from myself is the four finger strum. Ive struggled to do it with the right technique, leading with the pinky. But leading with the pointer is much more natural and smoother for me. So the heck with it, ill have fun and do it wrong.

There is no "wrong" ... there is only innovation. :-)

philpot
12-18-2014, 08:26 AM
For me, whatever faith one professes, music brings us closer to the Truth than anything else.

^ This. I think it's because music is transcendent. It's something overwhelmingly beautiful that we have a hand in creating, or at least participating in, that I believe points to an ultimate source of creative beauty. It's why psalms and hymns are such an integral part of my faith. Through poetry set to music, we pour out our deepest thoughts, griefs, and praise.

IamNoMan
12-18-2014, 08:54 AM
I do not consider myself to be very creative. Now recreative is another thing.

I am not sure that I know the four finger strum. When I do a fanstroke I improperly use all four fingers and lead with the middle. It is my strongest finger so I get the best volume. The other fingers are all in sync and benefit from the momentum as well.

Bonesoup: I appreciated the parody, sounded more like Chung Tzu to me but i'm glad you clarified the Coen Brothers remark. I hadn't a clue.

tattwo
12-18-2014, 10:47 AM
Im a Dudeist Priest. I was ordained :cool:

bonesoup
12-18-2014, 12:08 PM
I do not consider myself to be very creative. Now recreative is another thing.

I am not sure that I know the four finger strum. When I do a fanstroke I improperly use all four fingers and lead with the middle. It is my strongest finger so I get the best volume. The other fingers are all in sync and benefit from the momentum as well.

Bonesoup: I appreciated the parody, sounded more like Chung Tzu to me but i'm glad you clarified the Coen Brothers remark. I hadn't a clue.

I bet we mean the same strum, but are calling it two different names. And i wonder if the proper technique is the stone in the river, and personalized playing is the water that encounters the stone, and goes around.


Im a Dudeist Priest. I was ordained :cool:

Must be exhausting :)

IamNoMan
12-18-2014, 01:55 PM
Yes we are talking P'u here bonesoup. My imagery is different of course but the uncarved block in the river is what I was referring to.

Tattwo: I am an ordained in the Church of Bob. My religious name is Sister Mary Agony.

I am also a Jongleur de Notre Dame. We are armed with a Swiss Army Knife - corkscrew required. Our obligation is to protect Our Lady, The Gipper and the Pope. I am authorized to sell indulgences that permit you to feel good about whatever you do.

The best part of this is I'am not making it up.

UkeCan1
12-18-2014, 02:16 PM
Wait - you have to pay for the indulgences?!

IamNoMan
12-18-2014, 03:10 PM
Wendy we all pay for our indulgences but I am authorized to dispense them at a buck a pop. I have to see if I have any laying around. Otherwise I have to obtain them from the chapterhouse in Philadelphia.

Bonesoup I think we are talking about the same strum too. Fan Stroke as I employ it is something I developed to get certain sounds of feelings out of the banjo. I was trying to emulate things I experienced hearing Doc Boggs and Uncle Dave Macon perform. The technique I developed was based on the sound flowing around me. As it turned I achieved the effect I was looking for but was "censured" for improper technique. It had no name, it was something I did unconsciously when the impulse hit me. I did not lead with the middle finger though! In exploring the ukulele way I saw consciously ways to use this technique playing the ukulele, and to the same effect. I have recently become interested in Formby stylings. Various members of UU pointed out the way, and I discovered George like Doc and Uncle Dave used similar techniques to achieve similar ends. Formby is credited with naming the Fan Stroke, I guess. My version is more like Uncle Dave's although it was inspired by Doc Boggs. As I consciously studied the Formby materials I became aware that my technique was incorrect vis a vis Formby Fan Stroke but I was getting the effect I desired and it was close enough to what George did under similar circumstances. To take this one step further: I am not accustomed to the lower volume output of the ukulele. I unconsciously (and consciously to be honest), started to do things to increase my volume. My years of using my middle finger for Clawhammer; which is not usual but not unconventional either; lead me to employ it on ukulele. My volume increased and I started to use my ring finger to lead in the fan Stroke. Not proper technique; as I understand Fan Stroke doesn't use the middle finger at all. I also decided that fluorocarbon strings were better for these purposes than Nylgut.

Friends this little rant is a very good explanation of the concept of P'u. If bonesoup hadn't mentioned it, I wouldn't have thought about it. It occurs to me I could write a book about this. (Some of you doubtless think I just did). But what would be the point. We all discover our own ways to the ukulele.

Ramart
12-18-2014, 06:38 PM
I'm still wondering about the OP's juxtaposition of athiests and murderous robbers (Thuggees) in the same sentence.

Ukuleledad
12-18-2014, 09:11 PM
So, with reference to Taoist Philosophies, which part of a ukulele would be the most essential?

IamNoMan
12-18-2014, 09:28 PM
I have no problem with folks who meet their Spiritual needs outside of the conventional creator concepts. Thugs go out to murder travelers in honor of the God. I have a problem with that sort of behaviour. One of my dearest friends, who lives over a hundred miles away. We socialize and perform together and general spend as much time together as possible; is an Evangelical Atheist. It annoys me no end but it doesn't hurt anybody in any way I can tell. My politics, spiritualism, performance style is all based upon acceptance, and inclusivity of others. Murder by definition excludes people from life. I don't accept that at all.

Actors in particular have a tradition of creating a fourth wall between themselves and the audience. The earliest actors wore masks for three reasons. 1. There were only one two or three actors on stage plus a chorus. The mask was used to create other personas, often caricatures and stereo types which were easily recognizable to the audience. 2. For amplification. 3. To maintain a distance or create a wall between themselves and the audience. There was some sort of spiritual purpose to this but unless it was to honor the diety I have no idea why.

When I am performing on stage I tear down the fourth wall. I want to interact with them and have them interact with me. A lot of my attention goes into situational awareness of the audience. I would doubtless be a better musician but perhaps not such a good entertainer if I ignored the audience. I employ all the means at my disposal to include the audience in the show. Wether it be by schtick, sing along, choice of repertoire or novelty. In the age of the guitar the banjo and ukuleles are somewhat novel and attract the attention of the audience. This is my way.

My acting friends and I discuss, debate and argue about this frequently. When dualisms interact they change each other usually for the betterment of both parties.

Ukuleledad: that's a good one. Part of the philosophy is to do or pursue things consciously and unconsciously. The interaction of the opposites changes each of them in some way or another. As to the ukulele the most essential role is to create sound or perhaps music is a nicer way of putting it. Therefore I choose to consider the sound hole to represent this.

bonesoup
12-19-2014, 05:53 AM
Iamnoman, i like how you described the way you flowed in your playing from banjo to uke. Thinking about that, i find i didnt do the same when i went from guitar to uke. It may be because i always played guitar with a pick, and never do on the uke. So i didnt have technique to transfer. I dont think similar chord shapes or basic strumming falls under this for some reason, not sure why. maybe its too elementary to be a flowable skill. But, what if they were examples of effortless action? Huh.

As for how all this applies to performing, ill have to give it more thought. I performed music for seven years, mostly on guitar, and almost always as a fourth wall performer. But thinking back, one of my best gigs was a halloween show where i interacted with the audience a lot.

ichadwick
12-19-2014, 08:46 AM
Pondering on Book 64 of the Tao Teh Ching, and the inevitable UAS we all seem to catch:

A journey of a thousand ukes begins with a single plink...

;-)

IamNoMan
12-19-2014, 09:32 AM
i didnt have technique to transfer. I dont think similar chord shapes or basic strumming falls under this for some reason, not sure why. maybe its too elementary to be a flowable skill. But, what if they were examples of effortless action? Huh.

As for how all this applies to performing, ill have to give it more thought. I performed music for seven years, mostly on guitar, and almost always as a fourth wall performer. But thinking back, one of my best gigs was a halloween show where i interacted with the audience a lot.I agree about the chord transfer. There is dualism there however. When one moves from the chord shapes used on one instrument to another instrument we are contrasting the differences between the two. This changes how we approach the new forms. As I learn the ukulele I find certain chords difficult to form or progress to. D7 2223 was hard at first so I used D7 2020. Certain chord I do not have good intonation on Bb and B in particular. It may be disability related. My hands have gotten mangled over the years but people with small/large hands have similar issues. When I am performing as opposed to practicing I will make the Bb and B chords with an open A string. This is conscious.

I do not strike the A string. This is unconscious. - I've checked this deliberately to verify.

This not plucking the A string is something that transferred from banjo. The Banjo is an open G tuning, G 00000. As you might intuit playing in the Keys of F F# and F#m are the most difficult to play. But there are only 7 tones in a major Key I,IV,V progression. There are 12 tones. By not playing the wrong tones, even if you are not playing the correct notes it is still harmonically pleasing. 7/12 chances of being OK or 5/12 chance not played right means that you have a better chance of sounding good if you avoid the 5 wrong tones. only 3/12 chances will be correct. (This is about playing in the Key of F on banjo).

One half line typed - unconscious to say what it took 3 1/2 lines to consciously type. Capeche?

Ichadwick: "I threw I Ching out the window. Now we are unanimous" - I get more insight from The 36 Stratagems - Still six sixes though.

Another time for effortless action. Something seems buggy there but I can't consciously figure it out.

Nickie
12-19-2014, 04:34 PM
I don't think I wanna get involved in this....I believe in the Separation of church and uke....

CeeJay
12-19-2014, 04:53 PM
I don't think I wanna get involved in this....I believe in the Separation of church and uke....


That would be Chrch then and -5 for the K and -1 for the E that were left over ....across to the don't drop this om...sorry on, my tao---ists....Your turn.


Drifting a bit noisily childish .:nana: we'll be gone in a sec...

IamNoMan
12-19-2014, 05:13 PM
Twas the Friday before Christmas, Twas guiet as a ....?

Nickie you don't have to worry about religion in this thread. We are talking about philosophical approaches to learning the ukulele.

Nickie
12-19-2014, 05:40 PM
Twas the Friday before Christmas, Twas guiet as a ....?

Nickie you don't have to worry about religion in this thread. We are talking about philosophical approaches to learning the ukulele.

I know, I was kidding....somebody eluded to Christianity....and Atheism....the only philosphy to learning that is going to help me is "Getoffmyassandplay".

warndt
12-19-2014, 05:56 PM
Getting kind of philosophically ridiculous...please let this tread die. Psuedo religious agenda really does not have a place here.

bonesigh
12-19-2014, 06:05 PM
My philosophical approach to learning the ukulele...U...Kould...Use...Kommon...Love,..Empty. ..Lives...Elevated. (: There is no wrong way, just play!

IamNoMan
12-19-2014, 06:10 PM
Oh I see. I said my buddy, Charlie Miller is an Evangelical Atheist. He is. He tries to convert folks to his point of view. It annoys me because I don't like being told what to do. I don't care what spiritual beliefs anybody has that's their way. My way is different. I have similar views on sex. Do it however you want. Its only a wee and everyone has one. Charlie is not only my friend hes my boss at the Philadelphia Folk Festival. We operate the campfire sings and open Stage. We have a nice Stage that is powered sound and lights by four bicycles - When volunteers aren't available for this we have standby power. Charlie is a great performer but a closet musician. We do a lot of British Musical hall and I'm repairing a no name baritone uke for him as a gift. It will work. A lot of drift here, but it is a slow Friday night and I'm listening to Formby songs learn them. "It serves me right" at present.

Edit: I like that approach bonesigh. My life is elevated by playing the ukulele. My way is to play. I'm trying in this thread to investigate more effective ways of learning and understanding ukulele. I look at some of the remarkable ways the Hawaiians approach teaching ukulele. Ever tried Ukulele Boot Camp or watched some of Aarons Vids? I'm also interested in Chinese ways. Literature,food, culture, history. Philosophy - in this case Tao. Funny thing about Hawaii. There's more Chinese live there than there are Polynesians.

warndt
12-19-2014, 06:13 PM
Oh I see. I said my buddy, Charlie Miller is an Evangelical Atheist. He is. He tries to convert folks to his point of view. It annoys me because I don't like being told what to do. I don't care what spiritual beliefs anybody has that's their way. My way is different. I have similar views on sex. Do it however you want. Its only a wee and everyone has one. Charlie is not only my friend hes my boss at the Philadelphia Folk Festival. We operate the campfire sings and open Stage. We have a nice Stage that is powered sound and lights by four bicycles - When volunteers aren't available for this we have standby power. Charlie is a great performer but a closet musician. We do a lot of British Musical hall and I'm repairing a no name baritone uke for him as a gift. It will work. A lot of drift here, but it is a slow Friday night and I'm listening to Formby songs learn them. "It serves me right" at present.

Geez...really?

Hippie Dribble
12-19-2014, 06:34 PM
I have absolutely no idea what this thread is even about.

IamNoMan
12-19-2014, 06:46 PM
Its about the Ways of ukulele. I picked Tao as a topic name because Tao is a Chinese word and philosophy that means the thousand ways. All the people who respond to this thread know about ukulele. bonesigh's way to approach ukulele is to play it with love and nothing goes wrong. That's cool! Tao is a lot like Zen. It is and it isn't. I Ching is one of the 1000 ways too. It talks about duality. I like to talk about Tao and ukulele. The forum is called uke talk?... Oh and my brand new ukulele exploded yesterday. Bummer.

bird's eye view of my ukelele
12-19-2014, 07:35 PM
Pondering on Book 64 of the Tao Teh Ching, and the inevitable UAS we all seem to catch:

A journey of a thousand ukes begins with a single plink...

;-)
this

is truth

and.........


the vibrational qualities of a well made uke held against your body while playing.

even quite cheap ukes can vibrate very beautifully against one's chest or tummy

i have cheap ukes

i know they can do this

IamNoMan
12-19-2014, 08:04 PM
Iamnoman, i like how you described the way you flowed in your playing from banjo to uke. Thinking about that, i find i didnt do the same when i went from guitar to uke. It may be because i always played guitar with a pick, and never do on the uke. So i didnt have technique to transfer. I dont think similar chord shapes or basic strumming falls under this for some reason, not sure why. maybe its too elementary to be a flowable skill. But, what if they were examples of effortless action? Huh.

As for how all this applies to performing, ill have to give it more thought. I performed music for seven years, mostly on guitar, and almost always as a fourth wall performer. But thinking back, one of my best gigs was a halloween show where i interacted with the audience a lot.I've considered your comments regarding flowable skill and effortless action. Certainly transferring one's knowledge from one sort of endeavor to another is flow.

Tranferring the concept that chord shape A on object x works so chord shape A1 or Chord shape B works on object y takes too much conscious effort for me to consider it as effortless action. I was speaking of a reentrant 5 string banjo the translation to uke could be effortless but what if I were to transfer my knowledge to the Tanpura a 4 or 5 string fretless lute. ( I know this wouldn't work). We need to explore other avenues to discuss "Effortless Action".

Birdseye that is a wonderful notion. I never considered it. Not only that but Down up Dave's comment got lost in the shuffle too. I've been considering sound as traveling outward not inward.

Luke El U
12-20-2014, 12:16 AM
I have absolutely no idea what this thread is even about.

Keep going; you're half way there.

DownUpDave
12-20-2014, 12:26 AM
this

is truth

and.........



even quite cheap ukes can vibrate very beautifully against one's chest or tummy

i have cheap ukes

i know they can do this


Any vibration is good. I have cheap ukes as well they just don't resonate as much as the all solid thin walled ones do.

IamNoMan
12-20-2014, 01:27 AM
Any vibration is good. I have cheap ukes as well they just don't resonate as much as the all solid thin walled ones do. Buzz is bad. Resonation (sp) is good. How do we change one to the other? Maybe a good Set-up?

UkeCan1
12-20-2014, 02:47 AM
So, with reference to Taoist Philosophies, which part of a ukulele would be the most essential?

(I love this question! I hope more folks answer it.)

The vibration

All of it

Every part is essential to the whole

They are all one

The ukulele

The air around it

The listener

The player

All of the above

None of the above

If a ukulele is plucked in a forest and there is no one there to hear it, does it make a sound?

Chop wood, carry uke

UkeCan1
12-20-2014, 02:47 AM
Which prompts an additional question I hope to hear some interesting answers to:

Uke koans, anyone?

CeeJay
12-20-2014, 03:11 AM
Any vibration is good. I have cheap ukes as well they just don't resonate as much as the all solid thin walled ones do.


...am I missing something ...being a bit dim ?....."all solid" ....but with "thin walls".........help me :confused: Drowning NOT waving;)

IamNoMan
12-20-2014, 01:52 PM
This is way beyond my expectations.
Excellent poem ukecan1.

Chop wood, carry ukeGroan.

When you hear the hoofbeats... Think of the Zebra

ohmless
12-20-2014, 02:10 PM
was patient and found a uke that was much under my budget. Going to celebrate this energy out by ukeing more tonight.

TjW
12-20-2014, 02:48 PM
...am I missing something ...being a bit dim ?....."all solid" ....but with "thin walls".........help me :confused: Drowning NOT waving;)

Just a common nomenclature.
Most inexpensive ukuleles are made from plywood. More expensive ones tend to have soundboards made of a single thickness of wood. Those are a "solid" top as opposed to ply.

CeeJay
12-20-2014, 02:50 PM
Just a common nomenclature.
Most inexpensive ukuleles are made from plywood. More expensive ones tend to have soundboards made of a single thickness of wood. Those are a "solid" top as opposed to ply.

Ahhh ..well you do live and learn ...Thanks.

IamNoMan
12-20-2014, 02:58 PM
...am I missing something ...being a bit dim ?....help me :confused:


"all solid" ....but with "thin walls"This is close.


Drowning NOT waving;)Yeah! I think your starting to get it. :cool:

CeeJay
12-20-2014, 03:25 PM
This is close.

Yeah! I think your starting to get it. :cool:

Big Question Mark ....

and a question ...is it alright to like your taoist slightly burned with marmite on it ...?

IamNoMan
12-20-2014, 03:44 PM
Which prompts an additional question I hope to hear some interesting answers to:

Uke koans, anyone?
My philosophical approach to learning the ukulele... (: There is no wrong way, just play!This is not a bad start.

Marmite? yuck! I prefer my Taoist On the Rocks with a splash of water on the sides.

ohmless
12-20-2014, 05:45 PM
I was thinking vodka, kahlua, and creme on the rocks should be the drink of choice.

IamNoMan
12-20-2014, 06:10 PM
I was thinking vodka, kahlua, and creme on the rocks should be the drink of choice.Try this is a pewter mug. You will be astonished.

Rock-A-Hula
12-20-2014, 07:46 PM
Try this is a pewter mug. You will be astonished.

Try this in an antique pewter mug. You will be astarnished...

aamiikaa
12-21-2014, 06:45 AM
Awesome thread! The way of ukulele is definitely one way to happiness! :)


Which prompts an additional question I hope to hear some interesting answers to:

Uke koans, anyone?

If there is an ukulele that makes other ukuleles sound bad, is it better not to play at all?

Is there a place where ukulele is inappropriate?

Down Up Dick
12-21-2014, 06:58 AM
Try this in an antique pewter mug. You will be astarnished...

Ha! Good one! My kinda humor. :old:

CeeJay
12-21-2014, 07:01 AM
What is a Uke Koan ?

Down Up Dick
12-21-2014, 07:12 AM
A Jewish ukulele? :old:

IamNoMan
12-21-2014, 07:43 AM
A Koan is a story, dialogue, question, statement or conundrum, which is used in Zen Buddhism to provoke the "great doubt" or confusion and test a student's progress in Zen practice. Zen is a Chinese adaptation of Buddhism that incorporate Taoist Thought. The whole is-isn't thing is taoist as well as zen. Both Tao and Buddhism developed about the same time ~ 500 BC. This also corresponds to the period when Athenian Democracy and western philosophy were developing. Maybe something in the water? Consider Zen Buddhism to be Tao without the meat.

The best Koans reflect the influence of many minds. Folkwisdom and memes are reflections of this. Memes? "Beam me up Scotty" or "We don't need no badges" are typical memes. Sooo... you can say a Uke Koan is folk wisdom, a meme or cliche about ukulele that provokes confusion and thought. Should be right up your alley.


Try this in an antique pewter mug. You will be astarnished... Mine too Dick. The Black Russian in pewter is interesting. A Dark and Stormy in pewter or better in copper is another flavor treat... Man does not live by uke alone. - I think that might be a uke koan.

Spangles
12-22-2014, 03:24 AM
This thread in its entirety answers the original question for me:

Not everyone gets it (the uke and the comments in the thread)

Some think it lacks appropriateness (not a 'proper' instrument and the discussion full of pseudo religious meaning)

It brings joy (goes without saying for the instrument and this thread had me laughing)

Opens the mind (I grew up watching Formby on TV and thought that was the ONLY sound a Uke made and this thread introduced me to Dudeism and new poetry)

It takes all sorts (to be uke players and to be thread contributors)

I'm subscribed :D

IamNoMan
12-22-2014, 03:35 AM
Yes! Welcome!

Edit: I've re-written this a couple of times to get right. Maybe this time it will work.


examples of effortless action?One of the regular contributors to this site is the perfect example of effortless action. Namely CeeJay.

CeeJay as many of you know is a funny guy. He is funny when he tries to be serious. And sometimes when he tries to be funny people take him seriously and get upset.

English is his first language. Unfortunately for the rest of us English is his second language as well. I suspect he may be a little daft but he is earnest and always funny whether he tries to be or not.

That is Effortless Action.

CeeJay
12-24-2014, 01:45 AM
Yes! Welcome!

Edit: I've re-written this a couple of times to get right. Maybe this time it will work.

One of the regular contributors to this site is the perfect example of effortless action. Namely CeeJay.

CeeJay as many of you know is a funny guy. He is funny when he tries to be serious. And sometimes when he tries to be funny people take him seriously and get upset.

English is his first language. Unfortunately for the rest of us English is his second language as well. I suspect he may be a little daft but he is earnest and always funny whether he tries to be or not.

That is Effortless Action.

What a derl-- aghtful and glowing tribyoot .

Ah feel ah should say a few words in self deprecating protest at this glowing and yet almost backhanded compliment..........but as evah Ah am confyoosed .....so ...I shall restrain myself to a somewhat daft and baffled "Wha' ?"

IamNoMan
12-24-2014, 01:47 AM
Almost backhanded? Isn't that like being a little Pregnant?

CeeJay
12-24-2014, 01:57 AM
Almost backhanded? Isn't that like being a little Pregnant?

Little pregnant ....Heavily pregnant ...the slippy sliding scale of the Pregnant Sea.

Nickie
12-24-2014, 02:24 PM
CeeJay, you are just too clever....

IamNoMan
12-29-2014, 12:35 AM
CeeJay, you are just too clever....With CeeJay's sharp wit I would say Cleaver.

I recently ran into this site: chordie song lyrics with chords and a tab sidebar. You can set your account to C or D tuning for ukulele. There seem to be some interesting tools for transcriptions/Chord identification too. Haven't had the time to try those yet so read the fine print. -its Free.

http://<a href="http://www.chordie.com/">Chordie Guitar Chords</a> (http://<a href=&quot;http://www.chordie.com/&quot;>Chordie Guitar Chords</a>)

A bunch of uke songbooks too!

http://www.chordie.com/publicbooks.php?cat=Uke+collections

"The Laid Back Moderator" is clearly a student of Tao. His signature:
“Music gives a soul to the universe, wings to the mind, flight to the imagination, and life to everything.” -Plato
Growing old is mandatory; growing up is optional.
We don't stop playing because we grow old; we grow old because we stop playing. (George Bernard Shaw)
Do, or do not. There is no try. (Yoda)Yoda's comment is a meme.

IamNoMan
01-01-2015, 04:55 PM
This doesn't have much to do with Tao or Ukulele, but I think it deserves to be posted here. wee_ginga_yin posted this in Season 150 - New Year, New Jersey! (http://forum.ukuleleunderground.com/showthread.php?103165-Season-150-New-Year-New-Jersey%21/page2)
It is somewhat long, there is no music. It says something of the benefits of passing along what you know to others. Take the time to watch it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2n3SQTx9-Wc

kkimura
01-02-2015, 08:30 AM
What is a Uke Koan ?

maybe;

If a uke strums in the forest but there was no one there to hear it, would it sound as sweet?

CeeJay
01-02-2015, 08:33 AM
maybe;

If a uke strums in the forest but there was no one there to hear it, would it sound as sweet?

Not if I were the player ..!!

kkimura
01-02-2015, 08:37 AM
Not if I were the player ..!!

No one there to hear it, not even you Grasshopper

CeeJay
01-02-2015, 10:56 AM
No one there to hear it, not even you Grasshopper

...Then who strums the Uke for it cannot strum itself unless a zephyr of wind blow eerily across the strings ...and that is a bit too Zen for me in a Tao to Tao contest .:o

Rock-A-Hula
01-02-2015, 09:38 PM
Do you walk to work or carry your ukulele?

Is it colder when you strum than in the Fall?


...in a Tao to Tao contest...

Bwah-Hoohoo! Thass a gud 1! :rotfl:

Pat: How's the chicken at that new Chinese restaurant?
Mike: It's just Tso-Tso...:smileybounce:

kkimura
01-03-2015, 03:54 AM
...Then who strums the Uke for it cannot strum itself unless a zephyr of wind blow eerily across the strings ...and that is a bit too Zen for me in a Tao to Tao contest .:o

Yeah, all this Eastern stuff tends to blur in my mind like zen and now.

CeeJay
01-03-2015, 01:06 PM
Yeah, all this Eastern stuff tends to blur in my mind like zen and now.

Nice one mon ami , nice one ....bows in admiration....oh look here's a thingy:bowdown: Good'un...

drbekken
01-03-2015, 10:33 PM
The Dadaist Ukulele Approach.

IamNoMan
01-15-2015, 04:02 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&amp;v=e2KlIzXYrAU
Such lovely juxtapositions. Minor key rather than Major, took me a while to realize what I was listening to. Day and Night. I saw the salt flats and the mountains. I thought Utah: but suspect this is Burning Man, Nevada right? With the dancing and fire it could have been the Outback. From a guy in Finland no less.

This is poetry Rob. And a suitable tribute to Ukey Dave.

Pukulele Pete
01-15-2015, 05:23 AM
Wait , . . . . what ?

kkimura
01-15-2015, 07:19 AM
Is that Nevada? I thought Taos was in New Mexico.

IamNoMan
02-05-2015, 02:30 PM
I found this in a thread about excuses.
The Japanese have 2 concepts, that at first may appear to be at odds, but are not.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kaizen

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wabi-sabi

In Kaizen, the goal is constant improvement. Small steps, or big ones. The goal is to be better than yesterday.

In Wabi-sabi, the concept is to accept and appreciate things for their imperfections.

These things may seem to be at odds. But if you think about life, they're not really.

We can't live our lives perfectly, we can't be perfect humans, we can't play everything perfectly, etc.

But if we don't try, don't play, or don't share in the human experience because we are afraid we are not good enough, we live our lives the poorer for it.It seems to me that striving for continual improvement is a chimaerical if one does not reflect on what one is striving for. All to often I have achieved my goals only to find they weren't what I was seeking at all.

greyghost
02-05-2015, 04:12 PM
Be the uke.