PDA

View Full Version : Difference in Phil Jones Double4 and BG75 bass amp



Patrick Madsen
07-11-2015, 03:36 PM
I've been looking at the PJ double 4 bass amp. There seems to be two designations; the Double4 and the BG75 which states it too is a double4.

Is the BG75 a newer model? There is a 5watt difference.

kohanmike
07-11-2015, 04:46 PM
From what I could tell when I bought my D4, BG75 is their product number, as far as I know they're the same.

Patrick Madsen
07-11-2015, 05:49 PM
Thanks Mike I thought so too but some sites I went on had the two posted, same price but the BG75 being 75wts rather than 70. I'll contact Phil Jones Monday and check it out.

Jon Moody
07-13-2015, 02:15 AM
Yeah, Mike is correct; the part/model number for the Double Four is BG-75 and the PJB site confirms the 70w rating.

http://pjbworld.com/product_doublefour_spec.html

Just as an FYI, Phil is probably coming home from Summer NAMM, so he may or may not be in the office today (although I'm sure Freda is).

Patrick Madsen
07-13-2015, 05:40 AM
Did anyone get a chance to see the Quantum400 coming out or is out? If so, what are your thoughts on it versus the BG-75

Jon Moody
07-13-2015, 06:55 AM
Did anyone get a chance to see the Quantum400 coming out or is out? If so, what are your thoughts on it versus the BG-75

I don't think it's out yet. I saw it and the Quantum800 at NAMM in January, but didn't have a chance to try either of them.

Patrick Madsen
07-13-2015, 08:16 AM
Thanks. I called the PJ Showroom on the Q400. He said it should be coming out around Thanksgiving. It'll be the same wattage but half the size of a Double4. Bluetooth will also be a new feature meaning you could play a song thru it and play the bass along with the song.

I'm having a hard time grasping to the concept of a good 75wt. bass amp being so small. Incredible stuff coming out now a days. So to wait for the Quantum to come out or get a D4 now is the question. I'm in no really big hurry but still the new bass amp syndrome is kickin' in.

Jon Moody
07-13-2015, 08:37 AM
You probably talked to Mike Albronda then, if you called the showroom. Mike is good people.

The Q400 is adorable; I got to hold one at NAMM and yeah, it's just adorable. You can play a song through the Double Four already, using the AUX IN and a 1/8" cord.

You will not be disappointed with either the BG-75 or the Q400. I've used PJB stuff for about five years now, and it's superb. It's hard to wrap your head around the concept of an amazing, sub-compact bass amp, but once you hear ANY of the PJB stuff, you're sold.

Patrick Madsen
07-13-2015, 08:47 AM
Thanks, I always respect your opinion.

kohanmike
07-13-2015, 10:47 AM
Wow, smaller and the same power! I've been toying with the idea of adding a powered speaker or second D4 to get more output, but size is an issue, so the Q400 would be a perfect choice to plug into the D4, or visa-versa, 140 watts and super compact. (I'm already thinking about a small gig bag that will fit both.)

Patrick Madsen
07-30-2015, 11:44 AM
I wrote Mike at Phil Jones re the differences between the Double 4 and Quantum 400 coming out. Here's what he wrote back. Will probably end up with a Double 4 but am concerned there'll be a price drop on the D4 when the 400 comes out. I wrote back on that concern and will wait for his response before making the decision.

From Mike: Thanks for your interest in our products. Based on the information you have provided. I would highly recommend you purchasing
the Double four combo. If your more in to classic rock and soul music, the double four provides more of a deep richer bass tone than the Quantum 400 combo. The real difference between the two is the speaker size. The Double four (2) four in speakers, and the Quantum 400 has 4 2.5 inch speakers. How this answers your question. Please feel free to call me if you have any questions.

kohanmike
07-30-2015, 05:26 PM
That's an eyeopener. I definitely prefer a deeper sound. I actually tried the line out of my D4 to my Crate Limo, but that cut out the D4 speaker. Isn't that supposed to be the way to add one of the Phil Jones powered speakers?

Patrick Madsen
07-30-2015, 06:28 PM
It was an eye opener for me too Mike. From reading the reviews on here and the net, I think I'll order a D4 from PJB tomorrow.

Jon Moody
07-31-2015, 02:12 AM
That's an eyeopener. I definitely prefer a deeper sound. I actually tried the line out of my D4 to my Crate Limo, but that cut out the D4 speaker. Isn't that supposed to be the way to add one of the Phil Jones powered speakers?

You might have an issue with the D4. It shouldn't cut out the sound at all, since the LINE OUT is basically a straight signal for a DI box (which I've used in that capacity regularly). What input did you use on the Crate Limo?

And yeah, the Double Four speakers are based around Phil's Neo Speaker design which is a more traditional sounding speaker. The Quantum speakers look to be based more on Phil's Pirahna Speaker design, which I personally prefer for the attack and punch.

kohanmike
07-31-2015, 07:44 AM
What input did you use on the Crate Limo?

It has two channels, I used the first channel that has both 1/4" and XLR connectors, I used the 1/4" one. At this point I'm not planning on using a second amp, it was just a casual test. So far, the D4 has plenty of volume for my gigs, plus I'm all ready to either patch into a PA or mic the amp with my own mic and 50 feet of XLR/1/4" cables.

http://www.kohanmike.com/uploads/On-Stage with amp & mic.jpg

Jon Moody
07-31-2015, 08:24 AM
It has two channels, I used the first channel that has both 1/4" and XLR connectors, I used the 1/4" one. At this point I'm not planning on using a second amp, it was just a casual test. So far, the D4 has plenty of volume for my gigs, plus I'm all ready to either patch into a PA or mic the amp with my own mic and 50 feet of XLR/1/4" cables.

If you used just the standard input on the Crate Limo, my guess is that you're going to have the same issue with the D4 cutting out if you use the line out to go to the PA. Does the D4 cut out with just a cable in the line out plug?

Another thought; did you use the D4/Crate Limo combo with the portable battery power or the supplied adaptor?

kohanmike
07-31-2015, 08:53 PM
If you used just the standard input on the Crate Limo, my guess is that you're going to have the same issue with the D4 cutting out if you use the line out to go to the PA. Does the D4 cut out with just a cable in the line out plug? Another thought; did you use the D4/Crate Limo combo with the portable battery power or the supplied adaptor?

I used batteries for both. I'll have to run another test, but I discovered earlier that the cable I'm using for the Crate is having problems, need to pull out another one.

Patrick Madsen
07-31-2015, 09:17 PM
Well ordered the Double 4. Won't get it til the 23rd as it'll be a B'day present. My wife puts things like this up high so I can't snoop and find them. I used to be able to put my young daughter on the ledge to search thru the shelves but she grew up and starting siding with her mother about my snooping out the gifts.

Thank you guys for your help. I'm sure Mike will have no idea who "Bad Monkey" is cause I forgot your real name but told him you are the GHS social media Manager.. I'm sure this amp will work out fine for the stuff I do. I trust it'll be better than the Fender Rumble 30 I have now.

Jon Moody
08-01-2015, 03:28 PM
Thank you guys for your help. I'm sure Mike will have no idea who "Bad Monkey" is cause I forgot your real name but told him you are the GHS social media Manager.. I'm sure this amp will work out fine for the stuff I do. I trust it'll be better than the Fender Rumble 30 I have now.

Ha! It's Jon Moody; Mike and I have worked together for a bit, as I used to write press releases for PJB for a bit, and help with the NJ Showroom Facebook page.

Patrick Madsen
08-23-2015, 01:27 PM
Just tried out my Double 4 for the first time today. Not impressed by the volume at all. My Rumbler 30 wt. puts out three times what the Double 4 does. I'm going to send it back if possible. Real let down and thought it was too good to be true, seems it was.

Jon Moody
08-23-2015, 03:20 PM
Just tried out my Double 4 for the first time today. Not impressed by the volume at all. My Rumbler 30 wt. puts out three times what the Double 4 does. I'm going to send it back if possible. Real let down and thought it was too good to be true, seems it was.

Can I ask what bass you used and what both volume settings were at, as well as the input switch? I just want to see if we can troubleshoot this first before a return (and like I said, I used the DF for a large orchestral gig and was asked to turn down).

Patrick Madsen
08-23-2015, 03:40 PM
Hi Jon, I spoke with Mike from PJB today and he'll call back on Tuesday.

Both volumes up all the way, Bass dial on full, mid and treble set close to 0. I placed on floor close to a wall. Input switch set to high(passive)

The bass is a Jazzbox, Toby Chennell, acoustic archtop uke bass. I'm not sure on the quality of the passive pickup. I have a suspicion if anything, it may be the pickup used. I think Toby said it may have been an Aztec(?) pickup. I have an email in to him seeing if he remembered the make.

My wife thought it was loud for sure and much cleaner than the faunky Fender Rumbler 30. It may be I am just not used to such a clean sound and the size of the room and acoustics make a difference. the room size is around 14x16' with vaulted ceiling.

Mike said it could be the amp but doubted it and will make it right.

Jon Moody
08-23-2015, 03:48 PM
Biggest thing I found with PJB stuff is, instead of a directional volume (like many amps, where the loudest part is directly in front of it), it sounds more omni-directional. And yeah, it's super clean. You're hearing your instrument and not the *insert amp manufacturer* version of what their amp sounds like with your bass.

If you have a second bass - or instrument with a pickup - I'd give it a shot to see if that was the culprit. As said by others, the PJB stuff is so clean and clear that any weaknesses in your instrument will be amplified.

Patrick Madsen
08-23-2015, 05:52 PM
Good idea, I do have an old Klira Beatle bass I played in the '60's. Will try that. It is very clean and clear for sure.

kohanmike
08-23-2015, 06:57 PM
I have active preamps in most of my bass ukes and I have to be careful not to overdrive the amp. The Les Paul electric guitar conversion to bass puts out real well, but my custom Telecaster bass with cheap Chinese electronics I provided does not. I'm planning on replacing the electronics with good quality, which I'm told by my repair guy should make a big difference.

Patrick Madsen
08-23-2015, 08:50 PM
I'm sure the passive pickup in the Chennell is cheap. The Chennell is a wonderful handcarved archtop so putting in a good pickup is a no brainer. Will try the D4 with another bass.

katysax
08-24-2015, 06:46 AM
I use my Double 4 in a good sized restaurant with 20-35 ukulele players and my u-bass. Most of the time I can't turn the volume up past 3 or 4. When I play at home in my living room, it is a very large room in a house with an open floor plan and a high ceiling. There is plenty of volume. BUT. If the battery is wearing down on my bass OR if there is an issue with the instrument cable, sometimes volume has been an issue. I also have Bass Cub which is 100 Watts but not much louder. The Cub has different speakers and is deeper with less relative midrange. The midrange on the Double 4 is so strong it does make it easier to hear.

With a decent passive pickup the Double 4 is plenty loud. But I have plugged in a bass with a bad pickup and had very little volume. Have you tried toggling the high low switch. The high adds about 15 db.

Patrick Madsen
08-24-2015, 07:54 AM
Hi Katy, Yes, I've done that. Low is for an active pickup and hi is for a passive. I just tested the D4 out with one of my old big basses and it works fine. Must be a cheap pickup Chennell put in. So will be on the lookout pronto for a good passive pickup. Perhaps one here may know or Mike from PJB. Will also contact my luthier guy. I wonder how much of a pain it'll be to change out as the bass is an archtop with f holes.

Jon Moody
08-24-2015, 08:49 AM
Hi Katy, Yes, I've done that. Low is for an active pickup and hi is for a passive.

I actually use HI for a couple of my active basses, as it gives it more headroom. But yeah, that's it.

Glad we were able to diagnose the problem.

Patrick Madsen
08-28-2015, 08:40 PM
My tenor has a Misi and played it thru the D4. Holy Moly, I couldn't believe the clarity and volume. I had to turn it way down. It showed me I need an active pickup on the bass that doesn't require cutting into the side and back.I wonder if a Misi would work on a bass. I imagine it would take some skill and unique tools to get it thru the f holes. I'll be taking it down to my luthier once the school instrument repair slows down.

Shadow wrote saying they don't have anything suitable other than the active for the Ubass.

kohanmike
08-29-2015, 04:51 AM
I had a Fishman passive with strap button outlet added to my first mandolele with f-holes by U-Space, he said he uses a long nose angled forceps to get in there. The passive was too quiet for me so I gifted it and ordered a black custom mandolele.

I always install active preamps with tuners, have no concern what-so-ever cutting the side, but haven't done that yet in the mandolele. I've done so in my custom bass uke and custom gypsy uke, a cheap Chinese preamp that sounds really good, and replaced the preamp with a larger properly oriented one in my Gold Tone. I especially like having the built in tuner in all my preamps.

strumsilly
08-29-2015, 05:35 AM
how about using an external preamp like the LR Baggs gigpro. I just got one but haven't used it yet .

Patrick Madsen
08-29-2015, 05:46 AM
You do a really nice job retrofitting your instruments Mike. An active pickup would be the way to go if I can find the right one. Perhaps a Misi would work. I'm sure my guitar guy can figure out something.

I've thought about and external preamp and just came here to ask about them. Thinking about it, the Artec PP417 p/u he put in cost around 6 to14 dollars so am thinking I'd want to replace it anyway. I'll take the bass down to a music shop and try one out with the D4.

It sure is a nice amp befitting a wonderful bass; just need to get the p/u situation done.