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AlohaKine
10-07-2017, 05:28 PM
Hello Everyone,

I know you don't know me, but I want everyone to realize my intentions are to share a situation I recently encountered with [REMOVED BY MOD], because I gave him a chance to rectify the situation in private, meaning I waited for a reply of an apology and received none.

I believe when someone is running a business as he is and being public in a place like UU and any of us faces a problem, then we should all be willing to share it, so we can becareful of who we are dealing with.

It is a fact that on the UU forum [REMOVED BY MOD] admits to lacking patience, and that is clearly something I just discoverd for myself.

I was about to purchase a Uke from him, but because 6 emails ended up being to many questions for [REMOVED BY MOD], he told me to go somewhere else.

Now for everyone reading this, find out for yourself if this is the truth I speak, because it is, no business should be turning a customer away because they ask questions.

I did no wrong, and only asked some questions.... FACT!

From what I can tell, [REMOVED BY MOD] seems to carry some respect here on UU, that's great, and I'm not here to tear that down, but if you want to continue having repsect from others, then the people who know nothing about you, that might want to consider buying from you, need to realize by even your own admission, you're a person lacking patience with people.

The moral of the story, you run a business and deal with people, you need to have patience and respect for potential customers.

I was going to be a long term customer, and I was really looking to buy your Uke...

Below is a post of [REMOVED BY MOD] admiting his lack of patience that I replied to;

[Link REMOVED BY MOD]

So you understand, this is a post by someone that was going to be a potential customer, and a business treats them wrong for asking what they believe are to many questions, and people have a right to know.

ALOHA

Jim Hanks
10-07-2017, 07:37 PM
Hmm, I don't know either of you, so I'm not going to get in the middle of this, but I will tell you a story from my experience. Fairly early in my ukulele journey I contacted a luthier about a project and we exchanged several emails. As the discussion went on, it became clear (to the builder at least) that my expectations were not realistic and he declined the commission. I have to say I was bummed about it, but later on I realized he was entirely correct in his assessment, and it was for the best that the project didn't materialize at that point.

My point is that not every luthier is a match for every customer. It is entirely possible that you "did no wrong" and that Mr. Hellman didn't either. It just didn't work out.

Pete Howlett
10-07-2017, 07:46 PM
Please take this down. If you have a personal beef with someone because you don't like their business practice which is their right to conduct then it IS a personal matter. The reputation of anyone should stand as a recommendation of their work. You therefor either want it or you don't. As it is their business, you are subject to their rules of trade - there are none that are held in stone that everyone doing business must follow. I am sorry you had this experience but am even sorrier to have read about it. Let me finish by illustrating with a true story -

I got a lot of interest as a result of a news article published by the CBS network in North America. I was contacted by a friend of a very famous person who wanted me to build a ukulele for his friend and for me to personalise the uke. He had no idea what I did and I ignored the emails because I thought it was a wind-up. In casual conversation with my well connected brother I mentioned the email and he directed me to a Wikipedia entry that confirmed the correspondent was genuine and equally very rich and famous! I immediately replied saying I'd make a nice uke but wouldn't inlay the fingerboard - instead I would write an inscription on the label. Happy with this - and all it took was 3 emails, I never had correspondence with him again. We agreed my usual price which he didn't query and my usual terms of, 'I'll put you on the list and tell you when it is ready'. He didn't even specify what style of uke I'd make for his friend, just that it would be a 'nice one'. Now he knew nothing about ukulele, my work or me - he just watched the CBS video and responded to an idea that popped into his head. He liked my story.... I made a nice ukulele, charged the usual price (no hike because he had money) and made it to my standard terms and conditions. The rest of my emails, 6 in all were with his secretary (his way of doing business) and I got a nice signed photograph of his friend playing the finished uke...

Some folks are like this. They are assured in the decisions they make and trust their instincts. Some are not.

Nearly all professionals will tell you that answering endless emails about a potential commission sucks the will to make it out of you. You don't get paid for this work and it rarely ends in a satsifactory way for you the builder - in my experience that is. I know some who like this process so I am reiteratiing remarks made to me by my fellow builders and past conversations had on this forum... I often feel when this happens, and maybe it's the case, maybe it's not, that there is a lack of trust and confidence coming from the enquirer that would manifest itself more strongly at a later stage so do like Duane, recuse myself from offering to build. There is nothing wrong with this. What is wrong is complaining about it publicly in this arena.

I see you have yet to own a commissioned piece. My advice to you, even though your disappointment is palpable: take down your original post, suck it up, find someone who will work with you and your way of doing business and move on.

BTW I note you have just joined UU in August... so you are new here relatively speaking. I am a crusty old, self opinionated English dude, can't spell, battling with Parkinson's each day with a wife who is to go into cancer surgery wednesday next week - now you know. Does it help you in any way understand further my posts? Does it better inform you? If it does then that is sad. It shouldn't matter to you what is hapening in my life but I'll tell you something - it matters a lot to me! Therefore be understanding - there are reasons why we are the way we are and this is not a perfect world waiting to dance to our tune.

sequoia
10-07-2017, 08:29 PM
Hello Everyone,

I know you don't know me, but I want everyone to realize my intentions are to share a situation I recently encountered with (name here)

No I don't know you Alohakine, but one of the unwritten rules in the Lounge is that you don't call out luthiers by name. Ever. Not cool. I'm sorry you were unhappy with your ukulele. Say, (the builder) did such and such and I don't like it. It should be anonymous. ... As far as Aloha goes, some people just don't get the concept. Many don't. Sigh...Aloha...

DPO
10-07-2017, 08:32 PM
This is and should be a private matter between you and the luthier concerned, you should ask the moderators to remove your post immediately while you have any "Mana" left.

kohanmike
10-07-2017, 09:42 PM
I just read the thread that you point to as a reason to post this thread. I don't see anything that would justify you replying to him as you did on the other thread, and certainly not here. I totally agree that this is entirely a private matter and you should have used Private Message with your reply there and here.

hawaii 50
10-07-2017, 10:24 PM
Hello Everyone,

I know you don't know me, but I want everyone to realize my intentions are to share a situation I recently encountered with [REMOVED BY MOD], because I gave him a chance to rectify the situation in private, meaning I waited for a reply of an apology and received none.

I believe when someone is running a business as he is and being public in a place like UU and any of us faces a problem, then we should all be willing to share it, so we can becareful of who we are dealing with.

It is a fact that on the UU forum [REMOVED BY MOD] admits to lacking patience, and that is clearly something I just discoverd for myself.

I was about to purchase a Uke from him, but because 6 emails ended up being to many questions for [REMOVED BY MOD], he told me to go somewhere else.

Now for everyone reading this, find out for yourself if this is the truth I speak, because it is, no business should be turning a customer away because they ask questions.

I did no wrong, and only asked some questions.... FACT!

From what I can tell, [REMOVED BY MOD] seems to carry some respect here on UU, that's great, and I'm not here to tear that down, but if you want to continue having repsect from others, then the people who know nothing about you, that might want to consider buying from you, need to realize by even your own admission, you're a person lacking patience with people.

The moral of the story, you run a business and deal with people, you need to have patience and respect for potential customers.

I was going to be a long term customer, and I was really looking to buy your Uke...

Below is a post of [REMOVED BY MOD] admiting his lack of patience that I replied to;

[REMOVED BY MOD]

So you understand, this is a post by someone that was going to be a potential customer, and a business treats them wrong for asking what they believe are to many questions, and people have a right to know.

ALOHA





another strange thread from you Alohakine....


not sure why you decided to post this on the luthier/builder site.....
each builder is different and do their own things.....but they are a brotherhood at the end of the day

not sure you did yourself any favors or made many friends with the builders that read your post on this part of the forum....good luck

my 2 cents

mm stan
10-07-2017, 11:35 PM
Aloha Aloha kine,
Not sure of your intentions of airing your dirty laundry pubically as I think k it makes you pubically known as a picky customer and can ruin your reputation as well as the builders. There are alot of eyes watching you, please remove this post, I don't know you so I will not make any judgments on you nor do I know the whole story. I hope you well in your quest to find a luthier to build your uke of your dreams. Good luck and happy strummings

Debussychopin
10-08-2017, 12:12 AM
I'll just say it. I'm amused reading it and the op is petty, and narrow minded in op's way of dealing w the pettiness.

Croaky Keith
10-08-2017, 01:51 AM
Please Be Professional And Considerate To Others - Besides Building

Works both ways, in my opinion.

Graham Greenbag
10-08-2017, 03:34 AM
Works both ways, in my opinion.

Most things do but I really can’t see that this thread shouldn’t just be deleted. To me it serves no constructive purpose, is destructive, and is entirely a personal matter between two individuals. There are ways to build forums and ways to damage them, I believe this thread is one of the latter and doesn’t respect those that give their expert contributions here for free.

Had the OP expressed their frustration in more general terms and not named a Luthier then I believe that the forum would have given them some helpful comment. If there is a way for them to start again and do just that then a poor situation would be improved somewhat.

Disclaimer: I know neither party involved.

buddhuu
10-08-2017, 05:52 AM
With all due respect to the OP, I'm closing this down and removing the name of the luthier mentioned in the opening post.

Fine to make a general point about service, but I'm not comfortable with the way this was expressed in personal terms.