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wwc
02-17-2018, 08:36 AM
I am building my first baritone uke. I have a metal fret ruler with four fret markings for different guitar scale lengths which I have used to build guitars. Since the baritone is tuned the same as guitar, can I use the shortest scale for guitar to mark the fret positions for the uke?

Next question. If for instance I wanted to make the scale length shorter than a 24 guitar scale, could I start marking frets from the second fret mark on the ruler; making that second fret the same as the nut. Would the rest of the frets be in the correct position?

Any help how to use a guitar fret ruler to mark baritone uke frets would be appreciated.

Jim Hanks
02-17-2018, 10:09 AM
Yes, you can start marking frets from any point - otherwise a capo wouldn't work. But note that baritone scale is generally 19" - 20.25" so that may be shorter than your shortest guitar markings.

Allen
02-17-2018, 10:56 AM
Decide how many frets you want, and the approximate scale length. For instance lets say 20".

Now use that ruler and find one of those scale lengths templates that will fit those numbers, keeping in mind that you can start at anywhere along the scale and making the first mark your nut position.

So just take a ruler and measure out 10" and check each of those scale lengths and pick the one that most closely matches 12 frets for 10".

Joe King
02-18-2018, 03:48 AM
Would it not make sense to

1. decide first upon desired scale length

2. and then figure out from that measurement divided by 2 where your 12th fret would be.

3. then find that fret on the fret scale starting from the bridge-side of the fret scale

4. and then count back and measure towards the nut-end of the fret scale to determine the nut placement and first fret position?

Next, when you go to place the bridge and saddle, you can measure 2x from the nut, which should be equal to your original scale length, and equidistant from nut to 12th fret, as from 12th fret to saddle, also allowing for compensation if necessary?


OTOH, If you started from the nut-end of the fret scale, and then arbitrarily place that and cut frets for something shorter than 24" and then also just pick whatever fret is # 12, and then double-that didstance and place the saddle, I'd expect that your intonation is going to all screwed up, or am I missing something?

ripock
02-18-2018, 05:46 AM
all this math is above my head, but I can tell you that visually my baritone ukulele and my tenor guitar have appreciably smaller frets than my cigar box guitar which has a guitar fretboard. I'm not a builder so take my observation for what it is worth

Allen
02-18-2018, 10:14 AM
Would it not make sense to

1. decide first upon desired scale length

2. and then figure out from that measurement divided by 2 where your 12th fret would be.

3. then find that fret on the fret scale starting from the bridge-side of the fret scale

4. and then count back and measure towards the nut-end of the fret scale to determine the nut placement and first fret position?

Next, when you go to place the bridge and saddle, you can measure 2x from the nut, which should be equal to your original scale length, and equidistant from nut to 12th fret, as from 12th fret to saddle, also allowing for compensation if necessary?


OTOH, If you started from the nut-end of the fret scale, and then arbitrarily place that and cut frets for something shorter than 24" and then also just pick whatever fret is # 12, and then double-that didstance and place the saddle, I'd expect that your intonation is going to all screwed up, or am I missing something?

Your solution is definately going to cause intonation problems as you haven't taken into account compensation. Your scale lenght is ALWAYS measured from nut to 12th fret X 2. Saddle is place that distance from the nut PLUS compensation.

You can pick any scale length from a specialized ruler or template as the OP is talking about and use any set of consecutive marks to make your up your scale length as it's a mathmatical relationship that is constant across all scale lengths. Many ukulele builders use one of the standard Guitar scale length templates and pick a set of marks to make their Tenor fret boards for instance. They don't end up with exactly 17" scale, but something very close.

sequoia
02-18-2018, 05:59 PM
Your solution is definately going to cause intonation problems as you haven't taken into account compensation. Your scale lenght is ALWAYS measured from nut to 12th fret X 2. Saddle is place that distance from the nut PLUS compensation.

You can pick any scale length from a specialized ruler or template as the OP is talking about and use any set of consecutive marks to make your up your scale length as it's a mathmatical relationship that is constant across all scale lengths. Many ukulele builders use one of the standard Guitar scale length templates and pick a set of marks to make their Tenor fret boards for instance. They don't end up with exactly 17" scale, but something very close.

I use fretboards that are cut using a "guitar" template (SMD) of 17 3/32 inch scale length rather than the traditional 17 inch of a "tenor" ukulele. This scale length requires a nominal compensation of a further 3/32 inch compensation making the final compensation 17 3/32 + 3/32 = 17 6/32 or 17 3/16 overall distance from nut to saddle. Keep in mind that the old "3/32" compensation off a 17 inch scale length is approximate and will never give perfect intonation across a non-re-entrant stringing system. It only gets you closer. Sort of.

Minor Adjustment
02-21-2018, 07:54 PM
Maybe a stupid question? Below the soundhole lies the sweet spot where the bridge should be fixed to get the best out of the soundboard.......

If you were to prepare a working plan

(i)How does one determine the sweet spot on the tone wood or is it an approximation, and

(ii) Does the designer start from that point (sweet spot) to draw the neck details afterwards that conform to the scale of the instrument ?

OR

Is there a ratio (magic) of the total body length eg my Bruko Soprano (235) to the bottom of the bridge (65) 3.61 : 1
and for my Bruko Baritone (355) to the bottom of the bridge (95) 3.73 : 1
or does one tap the wood ?

In ending, to determine where the frets go on the neck, do you build the instrument first, and measure from the nut twice the scale length and glue the bridge on to the soundboard (not necessarily on the sweet spot) .

OR

Do you start with a built body (bridge is on the sweetspot) and work towards the headstock using the Baritone scale length to build the neck?

OR

Do you fit a neck and add some ( 1 or 2 ) frets, as the strings will perform still with 20 to 30 mm additional fret board ?

Too many variables :confused:

sequoia
02-21-2018, 08:25 PM
Maybe a stupid question? Below the soundhole lies the sweet spot where the bridge should be fixed to get the best out of the soundboard.......

If you were to prepare a working plan

(i)How does one determine the sweet spot on the tone wood or is it an approximation, and

(ii) Does the designer start from that point (sweet spot) to draw the neck details afterwards that conform to the scale of the instrument ?

OR

Is there a ratio (magic) of the total body length eg my Bruko Soprano (235) to the bottom of the bridge (65) 3.61 : 1
and for my Bruko Baritone (355) to the bottom of the bridge (95) 3.73 : 1
or does one tap the wood ?

In ending, to determine where the frets go on the neck, do you build the instrument first, and measure from the nut twice the scale length and glue the bridge on to the soundboard (not necessarily on the sweet spot) .

OR

Do you start with a built body (bridge is on the sweetspot) and work towards the headstock using the Baritone scale length to build the neck?

OR

Do you fit a neck and add some ( 1 or 2 ) frets, as the strings will perform still with 20 to 30 mm additional fret board ?

Too many variables :confused:

Too many questions! Over thinking here. You want the saddle to fall at your sweet spot and you do this by measuring the desired scale length from the nut to the center of the saddle. The intervals of the frets are fixed and was figured out about 6oo years ago. This is fixed and does not enter into your calculations. Remember it is your saddle and not your bridge that dictate where things go. Your fret board is set first and than the measurement where to put your saddle come off of that. Then you glue down the bridge at the correct spot. The bridge is glued down last. You must provide compensation because the mathematical distance will be incorrect due to the stretching of the stings during fretting. Thus you increase the distance slightly to take this into account. Bach figured this out a long time ago and it made everything sound better.

Beau Hannam Ukuleles
02-26-2018, 05:29 AM
id suggest to buy a pre cut FB- LMI do them and the cost is $9 + FB material.
Fret slotting isn't something you want to do by hand.