learning materials recommendations - theory / design vs actual building

Hello all,

hopefully this is not a clone of recent thread (https://forum.ukuleleunderground.com/showthread.php?139083-Recommended-reading) but rather narrowed down/extended query...

There's huge amount of existing materials, tutorials, videos etc.
I wonder, whether there are good books/materials addressing the shaping part of the instrument creation (uke/guitar/other stringed instruments in general).

I do not need tool/woodworking related info for actual instrument construction, which seems to be majority of content in many books/sources - information on how to build ukulele/guitar for specific plans.
They do not explain why specific components are shaped like they are. Why isn't the ukulele body e.g. 5 inches longer/wider (Helmholtz)? etc.

Is there some good source You could recommend (e.g. one of the books listed in the above references thread?), explaining e.g. bracing types, neck/body joint type comparisons, flat/rounded fret-boards or body fronts, etc.

My goal is to get some information that i could apply generally, both to wooden, cigar-boxed, 3d printed manufacturing/design.

(of course the plastic vs wood is a whole different universe, but i assume some knowledge will apply as well - jokingly, like fret distance from bridge does)

I understand that i might be looking for a philosopher's stone here, but any extra guidelines or references to less known hidden gems are more than welcome

edit: re-reading the above referenced thread, it feels like i might have the same goal like the author (Johni) in there, if admins feel the same, please either move this inside or feel free to delete this so i'm not cluttering...

Although this may seem rather blunt, all the written information on the planet isn't going to substitute for the actual building process. It is my experience that you learn by doing. Good luck.

UkePyrate said:

Hello all,

hopefully this is not a clone of recent thread (https://forum.ukuleleunderground.com/showthread.php?139083-Recommended-reading) but rather narrowed down/extended query...

There's huge amount of existing materials, tutorials, videos etc.
I wonder, whether there are good books/materials addressing the shaping part of the instrument creation (uke/guitar/other stringed instruments in general).

I do not need tool/woodworking related info for actual instrument construction, which seems to be majority of content in many books/sources - information on how to build ukulele/guitar for specific plans.
They do not explain why specific components are shaped like they are. Why isn't the ukulele body e.g. 5 inches longer/wider (Helmholtz)? etc.

Is there some good source You could recommend (e.g. one of the books listed in the above references thread?), explaining e.g. bracing types, neck/body joint type comparisons, flat/rounded fret-boards or body fronts, etc.

My goal is to get some information that i could apply generally, both to wooden, cigar-boxed, 3d printed manufacturing/design.

(of course the plastic vs wood is a whole different universe, but i assume some knowledge will apply as well - jokingly, like fret distance from bridge does)

I understand that i might be looking for a philosopher's stone here, but any extra guidelines or references to less known hidden gems are more than welcome

Click to expand...

Why not hunt out and go on an instrument building course?

You will learn far more by doing especially under the guidance of someone who knows their art.

I would suggest that an Acoustic Guitar building course would be far more informative.

BlackBearUkes said:

Although this may seem rather blunt, all the written information on the planet isn't going to substitute for the actual building process. It is my experience that you learn by doing. Good luck.

Click to expand...

I was going to say the same thing.
If you want to manufacture an instrument, learn how to make one.

I don't think cigar box instruments need to be re thought. Lastly, many luthiers don't really have time or a care to talk about 3d printed instruments.

No arguments there, i agree with you that actual building is the key in the process.

However strange it may sound, my main interest is to get some theoretical knowledge only, and i do not aim for building instruments myself.
With books, i aim to get some rough knowledge for sake of the knowledge and curiosity.
It's easier to get a 100$ book from other side of the world, compared to finding a good luthier/course reachable geographically - even if just as a starting point.

This IMHO would help me to ask questions on a better level when i have a change to talk with experienced craftsmen.
It can be useful even when asking for a custom build ukulele from experienced luthier,
or when trying to make myself a rough / very low cost / terribly sounding - weird material ukulele just for experiment/fun purposes.
(tin/wood box, 3d print, cardboard, non-luthiery wood, etc. - could save me from some obvious cul-de-sac

E.g. articles I found on http://www.acousticmasters.com/AcousticMasters_TRK_writing.htm - about guitar body, headstock, etc. are sort of what i had in mind
- no woodworking info that i currently feel I do not need.
They state some, from my neophyte point of view, interesting facts about e.g. soundhole in body location, bracings, headstock shapes etc.
Most of it will be probably not applicable with my skill set or plans, but is exciting to know, just in case...

Some of the books listed in related "recommended reading" thread seem interesting and i will follow the tacks from there.
(though Amazon has talent to include usless pages into "look inside" examples - many times not even single actual content page)...

To answer one of your original questions- I don't know of any book which goes into why components are the shape they are- but all instruments have the same/similar head/end block.
The only two books I know of that go into what you seem to want are

1-The Gilet/Gore book is the best for what you want I think- it has a lot of scientific info in it proving its made points (and math which you don't have to understand). Stew mac sell it and its cheaper (1/2 price) if you join StewMAX for $40.

2-The Somogyi book is also good.

You won't find a lot of theory, except in the Gore/Gilet books, because most builders don't use a lot of theory. Traditional body shapes are the way they are because they are known to work well.

If you want to depart from the norm, you need to understand the basic physics (which is quite basic):

1. Your string needs ends (nut and saddle), and you place the frets to create the scale (basic maths).

2. Soundhole size modifies the Helmholz resonance frequency of your body. This can be calculated (hard), or you can estimate the body volume and then pick a traditional size with similar body volume and copy its sound hole. Fine tune the prototype using bits of card to change the size.

3. The top has to vibrate, so it needs to be stiff (i.e. not rubber) and light enough for the string energy to make it vibrate. Back of the envelope maths (using a wood soundboard as the comparator) will get you in the right ballpark, or there are complex calculations (Gore/Gilet again). Putting the bridge in the centre of the largest uninterrupted portion of the soundboard transfer most energy, but moving it slightly can change the tone (largely trial error as to where is precisely best).

4. The whole instrument has to resist folding up under string tension, which the body shape, doming and bracing all help it to do. If you know how your chosen materials differ from wood you can approximate what you need in other materials.

A cigar box shape is pretty easy to approximate for all these, and you wouldn't dream of putting a theoretical specification straight into production, so the prototyping process would be where you do the fine tuning.

Believe it or not, most instrument shapes have been "standardized" because most builders want to use ready-made cases rather than invest in having them specially made. All the internal parts should be as small and light as possible without letting the instrument self-destruct. The "theory" is just that simple. How each builder goes about their work (design) is a matter of experience and moxie. The attempt to improve instrument through higher science has not amounted to much so far, and I suspect that most luthiers like it that way.

All great points and tips! thanks a lot for inputs

I see learning more theory as a way to prevent doing "obvious" mistakes when trying variations from standards.
(i wouldn't dream about discovering something new - but would like to experiment with aestetics of non-wooden instruments)

ProfChris - extra thanks for helpful sum-up and guidepost - points 1&2 i got nicely covered, getting to know Gore/Gilet materials seems as great recommendation forward for points 3/4.