HLVP paint sprayer and compressor

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mzuch

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After using aerosol cans to finish my last 2 ukes, I've decided to spring for a lacquer spraying system. Looking to spend up to $200 or so, if possible. After some research online, I'm considering this sprayer and this compressor. But I really have no idea what I'm doing! Will these do a good job? Is there something else I should be looking at? Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
 
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High Volume Low Pressure guns take a lot of air, thus the name. The gun you show doesn't say how many cubic feet per minute (CFM) it requires, so there it is difficult to tell whether the compressor you link to will handle it. Saying it requires a 2-3HP compressor is not very useful, since manufacturers horsepower ratings are notoriously optimistic, so I have my doubts.
 
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hey, just so you know, the HV stands for high volume...that means a lot of material at a low pressure. that can be adjusted to a finer mist, but it still puts it on pretty thick. Iwata Medea has a bunch of different guns that might be more of what you are looking for. maybe look at Coast Airbrush in Anaheim, Ca. i think the website is coastairbrush.com. when it comes to spraying, there is no better resource. give them a call and pick their brains. also remember to get a moisture trap for your compressor...it could save your finish even if you do buy a less expensive compressor.
 
In my opinion, or should I say based on my experience, good, consistent results are difficult achieve when spraying nitrocellulose lacquer with compressed air. With air compressors you're also introducing water into the mix which will present a whole nightmare of problems. Water filters, extra ong air hoses and proper routing of hoses all help but will not eliminate the problem. On many compressors you also have the possibility of oil contamination in your air. I'd rather avoid all of those problems and use a true HLVP system. Woodcraft has several models including the Earlux line which is pretty affordable. For years I used a Earlux 500 Pro with good results. I think the 300 model is within your budget but I haven't used it. I recently upgraded to a Fuji Q4, a four stage turbine HVLP because my new finish demands a more powerful system. At almost $1000, you get what you pay for and it sprays like a dream., as you would expect it to.
With HVLP you'll also use less lacquer since there's very little blow-back. It's only pushing material through the gun at something like eight pounds of pressure.
Having said that, the type of finish, even the brand of finish will ultimately dictate what kind of eqipment you can get by with. When McFadden was still making lacquer I had OK results using compressed air and a Husky detail gun sold at Home Depot. These are light, cheap and are the same gun Stewmac sells for almost twice the price. Last I looked they ran about $25. I think the better approach is to choose an instrument lacquer first that you can readily get your hands on and one that works well and ask others what kind of equipment they've used with it and how they've applied it. With all the variables involved it's just to hard to give you an easy answer.
Good luck.
 
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I used to have a 5hp comp with a $450 german gun... forget the name, but I sold them... bummer. Now I have a 1 hp craftsman and a harbor freight 20-50 psi mini detail gun, which worked great really once I got the gun regulated right. But if I leave the waterbase laqcuer in the gun till the next day like I read someone else did, the cup on the gun grows some kind of barnicles/crystals/something that gets into the paint and makes it look like there's dust getting in from somewhere... took me a couple of times repainting a uke to figure that one out. The gun you show has a plastic cup... I wish mine did, the cup on this gun is like chrome plated but the inside is some cheap steel that gets tarnished black n crustates n stuff.
The gun cost me like 15 bucks at harbor freight and the compressor was on sale at sears for 90 bucks. Now I wish I'd held off for a bit bigger compressor, that 2hp with the bigger tank wouldn't kick on as much. But I still like the mini detail gun for spraying ukes... just need to get a better one.
 
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I agree with Chuck - you pay for what you get.

First off, that piece of crap gun will waste more finish than you care to, especially if you're looking at pore free gloss.
Second, the compressor definitely shouldn't keep up. I have a 60 gal oiled upright, and to piggy back on what Chuck said again, yes, it throws moisture and oil. But, its quiet, and really good. Just so you know, even with my Sata Minijet 3 (about $250), it still eats enough air to turn the compressor on, yes, even with 60 gallons in the tank. As for the moisture and oil, GOTTA get an inline dessicant, and not one of those little jobs, at least a dessicant snake, with humidity indicator http://www.amazon.com/CamAir-Desiccant-Snake-DeVilbiss-Refinish/dp/B000UZPPKA

Is it worth it? Yes. I have a $90 PC, and its a piece of crap compared to the Sata, but, I'd rather shoot the PC than my conventional DeVillbiss, simply because its gravity feed HVLP.

On the other hand, if you only have $200, better to get a conventional gun, because the compressor alone to push an HVLP is way more than that.

-Aaron
 
Don't skimp on the compressor. You may want to add other pneumatic tools down the line. I couldn't live without my sanders. I have an 80 gallon compressor and I plumbed an additional tank into the system to increase the amount of volume. The compressor doesn't have to cycle as often, but this would be overkill for a small shop but you could do the same with a smaller compressor to increase your volume.
 
Thanks, everyone, for the great advice. You've frightened me sufficiently about compressors and moisture and the like that I'm taking Chuck's recommendation of the Erlex Spraying System. I found the Erlex 5000HV at on sale at Highland Woodworking for $270. While it would have been nice to have compressed air for other uses around the shop, its main use would have been in spraying finishes. If the Erlex works for Chuck, it is "Moore Bettah" for me!
 
They are a British company aren't they? Anyway, unusually, they have a well staffed office here in the UK so I ohoned to day and I've ordered the 1 mm recommended tip for nitro...
 
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mzuch said:
Thanks, everyone, for the great advice. You've frightened me sufficiently about compressors and moisture and the like that I'm taking Chuck's recommendation of the Erlex Spraying System. I found the Erlex 5000HV at on sale at Highland Woodworking for $270. While it would have been nice to have compressed air for other uses around the shop, its main use would have been in spraying finishes. If the Erlex works for Chuck, it is "Moore Bettah" for me!
Click to expand...

For spraying most lacquers, you need the smallest tip available. The one that comes with the outfit is too big, buy the oprional one, next size down.
Whether the earlex works for you or not is dependent on what kind of material you're spraying and how you reduce it. I had to stop using the Earlex because I was forced to change brands of lacquer.
 
Well honestly if it were that good I wouldn't have replaced it with the Fuji. If your lacquer is thinned sufficiently and you've got some retarder in it to aid in flow-out, it's an OK intermediate HVLP. The sucker is loud though, like a vacuum cleaner. And just know that it doesn't atomize as finely as you might be used to. As with any sprayer, there's a learning curve to it.
There's a good youtube video comparing it to the Fuji system that convinced me to try it. My new computer's not here yet and I'm stuck on an old PC POS that I can't handle so you'll have to search yourself. Do a search for "Wood Whisperer Earlex review.
 
Moore Bettah Ukuleles said:
Well honestly if it were that good I wouldn't have replaced it with the Fuji. If your lacquer is thinned sufficiently and you've got some retarder in it to aid in flow-out, it's an OK intermediate HVLP. The sucker is loud though, like a vacuum cleaner. And just know that it doesn't atomize as finely as you might be used to. As with any sprayer, there's a learning curve to it.
There's a good youtube video comparing it to the Fuji system that convinced me to try it. My new computer's not here yet and I'm stuck on an old PC POS that I can't handle so you'll have to search yourself. Do a search for "Wood Whisperer Earlex review.
Click to expand...

I think the key here is you said it's good enough, and we like the price.
 
Boy, this could be a lengthy answer but I'll try to keep it short. It's a sad tale.
For years Lawrence McFadden made a instrument lacquer that was pretty much the gold standard for many guitar companies both big and small as well as many custom builders. The stuff applied well, sanded well, buffed out well and most importantly, dried hard within a relatively short amount of time. Last summer they filed for bankrupcy and closed their doors. Everyone I know has been scrambling to find a sutable substitute since. A lot of us switched over to Mohawk lacquers (they badge many brands you might be familiar with including Behlens) with mixed results. A lot of people have had problems associated with it including clarity and hardness issues, pinholing, fisheyes, blushing, in short, all of the nightmares a lacquer can have. I have had all of these issues to some extent and I am finally able to work through them, it's just more work.
There may be hope however. Seagrave Coatings in NJ bought the propritory rights to the McFadden lacquers at the end of last year. I have talked with the president of Seagrave Coatings many times and he "hopes" to be producing the old McFadden lacquers sometime. He keeps telling me "in a month". I've heard that for 6 months now. We need to mount a campaign to gets this stuff back into production. We need Fretboard Journal to do a story on this problem. We need YOU to hound your local paint retailers to get Seagrave Coatings Guitar Lacquer. We need to call out the National Guard!
I've heard it mentioned before that all instruments in the future will be catagorized as either "Pre-McFadden" or "Post-McFadden". That's how serious the situation is.
If any good comes from this, maybe we'll get the guys who make the water borne "lacquers" to finally give us some good stuff that we can work with. The days of nitro are coming to an end anyway I'm afraid.
 
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