Same old Kerfing argument probably

Janko

Janko

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If ukulele sides do not contribute to the sound of a Uke it won't matter what wood type glued to it for kerfing right? But what about the top and bottom?
I have lots of Bass wood but then it apparently does nothing musically . Would it act like a sponge if it was glued to the top? Would the affect of kerfing be so small one couldn't detect it anyway? I'm sure you guys have probably been through this before but those are the questions I was left with after researching kerfing wood.

If Bass would does nothing wouldn't it make excellent bracing? It's really light. It wouldn't take away from the sound? Some times all the technical stuff gives me a head ache. Sometimes I think "ignorance is bliss".
 
Janko, please understand that there is no consensus among the so called experts as to how much the sides and back contribute to the sound of an instrument. Some think it is a lot and others are of the opinion that they contribute very little. I have used bass wood for kerfing many times, and it seems to work fine, although it is hard to cut cleanly.

Brad
 
yeah all of that... I use any wood for linings - recently pine bought at the local hardware but always quartered spruce for brace wood. One thing I have noticed is my sopranos with their solid linings are quite powerful...
 
Janko, I've used all kinds of material for linings and I like koa. Keep in mind that the linings can be a part of shaping the tone, but it's not going to be a make or break factor in the build. Kind of like using the best tires, versus really good tires on a high performance vehicle. My advice is to build two or more identical ukulele, with the liner as the only differential factor. If you can't hear or feel a difference, use the one that's easier to mill.
 
Pete Howlett said:
yeah all of that... I use any wood for linings - recently pine bought at the local hardware but always quartered spruce for brace wood. One thing I have noticed is my sopranos with their solid linings are quite powerful...
Click to expand...

I've noticed that my vintage Kumalae has solid linings. Could be one of the factors, along with very domed back and paper thin top that make this small soprano so powerful.
 
Janko:

If you look at some of the early (1970s) guitar building books you will find that basswood was the preferred material for kerfed linings for exactly the reasons you stated. I have built a tenor ukulele with basswood linings and the sound is good. I like the clean look of solid linings and will use unkerfed linings on my next instrument.

Konala
 
There are a bunch of components in an instrument that can be manipulated to reach a tone. It is possible that two builders can reach the same tonal goal but by doing it in different manners. I think its an issue of how a builder evolves which is usually dictated by his skill and personality. A friend of mine used mahogany kerfing when he first started building and he clearly overbuilt his instruments. Over time, he learned that he needed to take some of the mass out of the instruments to get the tone he was after. As he built instruments, he refined them by thinning the tops, backs and sides. When he started to see the tops sag then he backed off on thinning the tops and beefed up the bracing. He still wasn't where he wanted to be tonally, even though his instruments sounded excellent, he then began to play around with different species and designs for the kerfing. To him, this was the final step in dialing in the tone. He finally settled on reverse basswood kerfing.
 
Thank you gentlemen. I was tired of sorting through endless threads and arguments about this. I tried bending some Bass wood today. It doesn't bend that well, and ya...it doesn't cut very clean. Lots of fuzz to sand off. It does smell real nice though. So I will use spruce linings. It's plentiful, bends nice, it's cheap, it's all good.
 
Use solid linings.. I've read a lot on it and my head says yeah, solid is the way to go. Pick a wood that bends easy for you and make a ton of them.
I've been making kerfed mahogany and it's a pita, and most likely the solid linings do the same with less mass and you can't screw up the top or back with less mass on the sides., just enhance.
A common thought on the lining is that lining lining from the same wood as the sides gives you a better continuous tone.. I have no experience but I'd have to say that sounds about right... but what about linings of the same wood as the top and back? hmmm... even so, i'm gonna pick one soon and do a bunch, probably spanish cedar solid linings.. cause that's what i have on hand... and it's light...
 
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I agree, Vic. I like solid linings, plus they're easier. But I guess I'd have to double them up for purfling or binding.
 
two dogs plucking said:
I agree, Vic. I like solid linings, plus they're easier. But I guess I'd have to double them up for purfling or binding.
Click to expand...

I like the idea of solid linings too after messing around with a kerfing jig on my band saw :/
Doubling up sounds like a pain to but I have never done it so I don't know. It might be better than cutting kerfing. How much meat do you guys think should be left over on the lining after cutting in a binding chanel?
 
Please know that I'm just trying to understand things. I have zero experience with building ukuleles. Please check me here.
The purpose of the linings is to provide a good glue joint between the sides, top and bottom.
The purpose of kerf cutting the liner is so it will bend and follow the form of the uke.
If you want to pre-bend the liner, you don't need to cut kerfs.
If you can follow the form with no kerf cuts, you don't need to kerf.
In the above two instances the only reason to cut kerfs would be to reduce weight/mass and/or affect the tone.
Is my understanding correct?
 
I'm not 100% sure if I get what you're thinking. But I would nonetheless want to add yet another reason for linings and a difference between solid and kerfed.

Reason: If you want to add binding and purfling you need to route a channel exactly where the glue joint is. Without linings you would route the uke apart.

Difference: Depending on the depth/width of your preferred binding, a solid lining strip might be too thin. You need a thicker lining strip. But since you can't bend a too thick strip of wood without creasing it, breaking it or have strange stepped bends, you cut kerfs in it. It will then bend easily and provide you with the possibility to route your binding channel.

If the kerfs themselves affect tone I'll eat my hat. No salt.

Sven
 
Sven said:
If the kerfs themselves affect tone I'll eat my hat. No salt.

Sven
Click to expand...

If you have to end up eating your hat, can we watch on Youtube?

My opinion? take it for what it's worth. I have no experience with tone woods or uke building ...but! I think simply, the more binding you glue on, the less free floating sound board you have, which will make a difference in tone or volume or something. Let's face it. You don't spend all that time thinning the top for nothing.

I also think that because sound travels through mediums, that some sound vibrations travel from the top through the kerfing into the side wood. It may not be significant, I don't know. A sponge lining wouldn't transfer the vibration. That's just my thoughts. I even wonder if glue soaked into top would change the way the top vibrates?
But that's just me. Some times I don't know where to stop fretting over something.
 
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