The Tone from the Wood - Is it Real or hype?

I read on sites that certain wood provides a tone to it and some woods have different or better tone than others.

Is that real?

Has there been studies on it?

I would think its basically the acoustics involved with the body cavity that is more important. If that's so, I would be interested to see if BOSE can design a Uke.



I'm a nooby if that matters. Maybe you can say I don't have any experience with different setups but I play the harmonica and I have read many people who say its wood comb or nothing else and yet there are expert harmonica musicians who say it makes no difference be it plastic/metal/composite/wood and studies show no difference in music tone shape. This is my basis for proposing this topic.

From my experience, I have several custom ukes from the same builder and I can say tonewoods definitely sound different. I think it's not only about what wood is the top or the body, but it's really about the combo of woods that you use that give you a particular signature sound.

Also, how well the uke is build will give you the particular sound from the woods. A uke made of a certain wood can sound amazing in one's luthier hand and sound poor build by another one using the same woods.

there are many things that can affect the sound of an instrument. acoustics is definitely one thing. the wood is another. if you want to see what the tone of many different woods is like go to Mya Moe's website and check out their instruments. they give you a run-down on how each wood sounds tonally. strings also affect the sound of a stringed instrument.

yes, there have been many studies on how different woods sound. it's like bassoon: traditionally bassoons are made from maple. it gives the best "bassoony" sound, but even different types of maple sound different and it's all personal preference for what people buy. however, there are plastic bassoons and they sound awful and is why those are uber beginner models and super cheap (same as ukes, i guess). the way you make your reeds can affect the sound as well by making it brighter or darker or fuller and is why i have 3-5 reeds in my bassoon case all the time--it's like strings on the uke.

i know my uke sounds good and it's cheap, but i can tell a definite difference between my uke and a good solid one made with good wood.

as for harmonicas, i'm not versed enough to say what is better, but if people play, i can tell a difference tonally between the different materials. it just depends what the person playing wants people to hear.

It's definitely not a myth.
The sound of a uke (or guitar) is affected greatly by how the wood vibrates, especially the soundboard (top).
Different woods vibrate differently. Over the years, people have found some trends for certain woods (eg: Mahogany is supposed to sound a bit mellow and deep.. Spruce is supposed to sound bright and open... etc).

But it is more complex than the simple choice of wood. As others have mentioned, there are many factors at play.

Its what they said. Sound is nothing more than "vibration" or frequincy. Sound travels through different mediums at different rates, and freqs. Sound travels farther in water than it does air. Sound waves travels at different rates, and freqs though wood than it does concrete. Different woods, and densities have huge effects on that wave of sound vibrations. If a tree in a forest falls, and there is no one to hear it, does it make a sound? Yes it does, because the vibrations are present, if there is an eardrum to be vibrated and processes or not.

I am no luthier, but I have been around guitars and ukuleles, especially guitars, for a long time.

Personally, I think differences in tone woods are somewhat over-rated and those differences diminish with the size of the instrument. The tonal impact on a dreadnaught guitar will be much greater than a soprano ukulele. There is just so much more area in a guitar for the sound to reflect and build up to be able to develop the harmonics and overtones of different types of wood.

I imagine going from soprano to baritone, there are distinguishable differences in two identical built ukuleles, but the construction, may have more of an impact.

I have 2 koa tenor ukuleles made by the same person. Their designs are completely different and even though they have a similar sound, one is brighter and the other is warmer. I have messed around with different saddle and nut combinations and have been able to make subtle changes, but one will always be brighter than the other.

If you check out ichadwick's web page, there is some really good info on this.

John

Well. yes and no because, as many have already said, there's lots of other factors here too.

However the build style must have something to do with it too. Every Larrivee soprano I've played, regardless of whether it's spruce and mahogany, all mahongay, or all koa (all solid wood ukes) have a certain characteristic sound that I really like. I think the signature tone lives in the third string... That signature is there regardless of whether the uke is strung re-entrant or with a low G. They have a kind of darkness lurking there that I love. I use Aquilla strings.

Every Ohana soprano I've played - whether they have solid woods or laminate, or a solid spruce top with laminate back and sides - sounds very much the same. Extremeley responsive, super LOUD, and very very resonant and bright toned! And I am wuite sure the Makai ukes are made in the same factory with the same sort of build because they sound just like Ohana's in my experience. However, there seem to be more tonal difference in the concert Ohana's with different materials.

The ukes where I've noticed the greatest tonal differences due to wood, I think, are LoPrinzi's. In my expereince, an all hog gloss concert sounds different than a srpcue and maple concert, and different from a spruce and hog concert. Same with the soprano ukes of those same configurations, but a little less difference than in the concerts.

So yes, I tkink wood does make a difference. But I think the builder and design probably make a bigger difference.

As to harps, I don;t think wood or plastic or metal or hybrid combs make that much of a difference - they either make for a more efficient or less efficicent isntrument in terms of breath. It's the reeds - they're what make the big difference. I've played around with replacing a harp's reed plate of different thincknesses or materials and that has made significant differences to the tone. The comb material didn;t seem to make that much difference. I was doing a physics experiment with my nephew and we used an oscilliscope as well as our ears and recording equipment to analyze different sound signatures. Of course there's a chance we were playing them a little differently, especailly on the draw. So we repeated the experiment using a mecahnical harp blower that our neightborhood music store let us use. Similar results both ways! That was a lot of years ago we tried that.

I've also wondered how much the material and design of the cover plates make a tonal difference in terms of phatness and so on. Blah, blah, blah...

Different ukuleles of the same build and same wood type sound different. Until people can recognize the wood from the sound they hear..... I will assume that it is a bit of an overstated religious debate.

It is always better to buy a specific instrument, rather than one of a type.

I agree that instruments made from the same wood will invariably sound slightly different... however, instruments made from different woods (say spruce vs cedar) will ALWAYS sound VERY different.

Yes, wood makes a difference. And yes, wood makes a big difference. Is it as big a difference as some people say it is? Eh, idk about that one. The shape, construction methods, hell even the finish all make a difference. I'd say Construction is First, Wood is a close Second.

As stated by others, there are many variables. I'm of the camp that the wood makes a big difference in tone. Different types resonate and decay differently. I also believe in the idea that wood instruments break in over time in relation to the amount of vibration they receive from play and the atmospherics they're subjected to.

THanks all for your input. I thought I was going to be burned at the stake; but, I am of the opinion that art is art; but, when that art has a story behind it, then it has more value.

And I see that in how ukuleles are marketed as well as harmonicas. You go to any site and they state how the wood makes it unique.

I did not factor in any resonating or vibrating wood, nor the frequencies that could be absorbed or "passed through".

THere is no doubt to me that the reflections inside the cavity will dictate the tone.

The Harmonica is a straight passage and the wood may not have enough resident time to affect the tone of the harmonica. But some of the oldtime harmonica guys swear that they need wood. I was able to change my oldtimer friend to switch from Hohners which he swore by for 30 years. Once I gave him a Suzuki, he said he'd never buy another Hohner.

I see some guitars holes are placed in some rather odd areas. I ask myself why a violin has no holes.

THe use of laminates, any finish on the woods, any moisture on the wood. THese are interesting; but something tells me it is cavity design foremost.

So, here's another question and I hope somebody has some experience for input. Has any company or person used inserts inside the soundhole to change the tonal quality?

SuzukHammer said:

THanks all for your input. I thought I was going to be burned at the stake; but, I am of the opinion that art is art; but, when that art has a story behind it, then it has more value.

And I see that in how ukuleles are marketed as well as harmonicas. You go to any site and they state how the wood makes it unique.

I did not factor in any resonating or vibrating wood, nor the frequencies that could be absorbed or "passed through".

THere is no doubt to me that the reflections inside the cavity will dictate the tone.

The Harmonica is a straight passage and the wood may not have enough resident time to affect the tone of the harmonica. But some of the oldtime harmonica guys swear that they need wood. I was able to change my oldtimer friend to switch from Hohners which he swore by for 30 years. Once I gave him a Suzuki, he said he'd never buy another Hohner.

I see some guitars holes are placed in some rather odd areas. I ask myself why a violin has no holes.

THe use of laminates, any finish on the woods, any moisture on the wood. THese are interesting; but something tells me it is cavity design foremost.

So, here's another question and I hope somebody has some experience for input. Has any company or person used inserts inside the soundhole to change the tonal quality?

Click to expand...

Is this what you are thinking of?
http://www.lutehole.com/lutehole.php
I don't know if they have them in ukulele sizes. I hear that you can use these to reduce feedback when performing on stage.
–Lori

Arashi,

THanks for the Mya Moe site.

They state they do tests to prove wood has different tone. I gotta believe them. They don't publish any test data but qualitatively describe it has warm vs. bright and discuss methods to design to get the best response for the intended purpose of the wood.

Interesting they state the top wood may be different than the back wood. I assumed they were the same wood.

I don't know how they get the top wood to vibrate or "beathe" because I can see they have a heavy shellacing coating process. Or does the shellacking help?

Do they do the tests on the top wood before shellacking or after shellacking?



ANd nooby me reinventing the resonator cone. I told you I'm a nooby!!!

Interesting. I am learning alot by asking what likely is simple questions.

THanks for your input.

SuzukHammer said:

So, here's another question and I hope somebody has some experience for input. Has any company or person used inserts inside the soundhole to change the tonal quality?

Click to expand...

I think what your talking about is similar to what a Virzi does with mandolins. I haven't heard of anyone doing anything like that to a Uke but its an interesting idea.

BashfulPuppet said:

I think what your talking about is similar to what a Virzi does with mandolins. I haven't heard of anyone doing anything like that to a Uke but its an interesting idea.

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THe resonators I see are all metal design. If wood makes such a big difference, I think I would have read up on koa inserts or resonators. Of course, I 'm sure its been done.

If you wanted to "flare out" the tone into uke's body, it'd have a soft outside wood and maybe a dense cone in the middle for amplification.

Just kicking about ideas.

It could be fun to buy a couple of cheap sopranos and mess around a bit.

THe cones I'm thinking about are like the ceiling cones you stand under where it amplifies and delays your voice with some slight echo. YOu can find these ceiling cones in department stores. ok, not all department stores. I know of 2

SuzukHammer said:

I see some guitars holes are placed in some rather odd areas. I ask myself why a violin has no holes.

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Violins have holes. Shaped like Fs. F-holes. Very important. I'm wracking my brain for a string instrument with a hollow body without holes. Can't think of one.

pulelehua said:

Violins have holes. Shaped like Fs. F-holes. Very important. I'm wracking my brain for a string instrument with a hollow body without holes. Can't think of one.

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Another oversight on my part. I did see those F holes but they don't use round holes.

How can a F hole provide a better tone than a round hole? WHy not the round hole for violins? WHy not the f holes for ukes?

Exciting questions. I wanted to go buy some cheap ukes and start cutting into them or adding things to the cavities.

Its a good thing I had other things to do and I got sidetracked.

SuzukHammer said:

Another oversight on my part. I did see those F holes but they don't use round holes.

How can a F hole provide a better tone than a round hole? WHy not the round hole for violins? WHy not the f holes for ukes?

Exciting questions. I wanted to go buy some cheap ukes and start cutting into them or adding things to the cavities.

Its a good thing I had other things to do and I got sidetracked.

Click to expand...

i'm pretty sure the placement of the f-holes on a violin are for the timbre (color of the sound). it's like the sound difference between strumming your uke over the sound hold and over the fretboard. totally different timbre.

I used to work in a violin shop, building violins. The size, shape and positioning of the F holes in the top are absolutely critical to the sound the instrument produces. Keep in mind that the violin top is not uniform in thickness; it is arched and carved in contour internally to make parts of the top thicker, some thinner. This makes the location of the F holes and the bridge very important. A round hole in a traditional violin top just wouldn't work....