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ukecantdothat
07-18-2010, 12:56 PM
I seem to be doing more and more stage work lately, and am considering biting the bullet for the Analysis-plus Pro Oval Studio cable (OOps! I spelleded it wrong in the post title... guess I can't edit that!), but at 300 bucks for ten feet of cable, is it worth it? Also, if you take the signal path to it's conclusion, am I looking at also getting the AP mic cable to go from the direct box to the PA, or is that overkill? Now I'm up to 600 clams (much more depending on how far away the PA is!). I thought UAS was bad enough. Is there such a thing as CAS?

70sSanO
07-18-2010, 05:55 PM
Yes it is overkill.

If someone is paying you for studio work, it "might" be worth it. But on a noisy stage... never.

When I played bass at Church it killed me to spend $40 a cable on Monsters, and that was 10 years ago.

One of the guitar magazines did a comparison of cables a year or so ago. See if you can find that. A good read.

John

ukecantdothat
07-18-2010, 07:32 PM
Yes it is overkill.

If someone is paying you for studio work, it "might" be worth it. But on a noisy stage... never.

When I played bass at Church it killed me to spend $40 a cable on Monsters, and that was 10 years ago.

One of the guitar magazines did a comparison of cables a year or so ago. See if you can find that. A good read.

John

I know what you mean, believe me, but I never plug in in the studio for acoustic instruments. Live, though, I've been splitting the signal from a Boss stereo reverb pedal going thru a DI to the PA and amp to fill it out a little and get some electric bite. Then my band played before Aldrine last year and I was absolutely stunned at the tone he got. I knew I was just kinda "getting by" with my set up, but holy s**t! The sound he got... Mind you, this guy could make a suitcase with strings sound better than anything I can muster, but still, the clarity was astounding. I checked out his set up, and apart the fact that he has that beautiful custom tenor, and I have a Mainland, our DI's and pickups were comparable, but the sound guy opted to go with miking my amp. Then I started researching this cable business and several people here were raving about these cables. Grumpy Coyote said he too was skeptical until Aldrine gave him a demo. He said the difference was night and day, like listening to EQ'd and un-EQ'd music. When I'm rocking the guitars thru the Marshall stack I don't care about the cable, as long as it doesn't short out, but this gig is so different. It's going to be time to upgrade, I know, but you can drive yourself nuts with purity. Jake S. has started to use the Analysis Plus Gold Oval Pro. Ready for this? A ten foot cable runs 6 grand!

This much I do know: I'm not Jake!!!

Kekani
07-18-2010, 08:06 PM
After doing research on cables, I started building my own. I've settled on Canare GS-6 and G&H connectors. I'll let you do the research on OFC used in Canare Cables and G&H connectors.

I've used George L's (still have them, still like them), but they are way too fragile for stage work.

Contact Todd at Pro Cables N Sound and he'll be able to set you up. . .
I think Bayou cables does the same setup as well - they're also a Zaolla distributor as well.

Aaron

farmerboy
07-19-2010, 09:17 AM
I do think that amount of money is over kill. Like Kekani, making your own is the best bet. It's not too difficult and you know what you're getting (and more importantly how to fix it or replace the bits if you need to. Get some decent wire from a reputable source and a couple of neutrik connectors and you're in business. I make my good ones for around 10 and have seen comparable leads for 45+ in the shops.

ukecantdothat
07-19-2010, 10:42 AM
After doing research on cables, I started building my own. I've settled on Canare GS-6 and G&H connectors. I'll let you do the research on OFC used in Canare Cables and G&H connectors.

I've used George L's (still have them, still like them), but they are way too fragile for stage work.

Contact Todd at Pro Cables N Sound and he'll be able to set you up. . .
I think Bayou cables does the same setup as well - they're also a Zaolla distributor as well.

Aaron
Thanks for the helpful info, Aaron. I'll check it out!

ukecantdothat
07-19-2010, 10:43 AM
I do think that amount of money is over kill. Like Kekani, making your own is the best bet. It's not too difficult and you know what you're getting (and more importantly how to fix it or replace the bits if you need to. Get some decent wire from a reputable source and a couple of neutrik connectors and you're in business. I make my good ones for around 10 and have seen comparable leads for 45+ in the shops.

Thanks for your input, too!

buddhuu
07-20-2010, 12:02 AM
I have seen mains "kettle" leads for amps priced at several grand...

I wish I knew who the customers were for this stuff. I have a couple of gallons of snake oil and a bridge to sell...

ukecantdothat
07-20-2010, 08:15 AM
I have seen mains "kettle" leads for amps priced at several grand...

I wish I knew who the customers were for this stuff. I have a couple of gallons of snake oil and a bridge to sell...

Yeah, my brother-in-law sets up custom "Home Theaters" (I just call them "TV's) for the well-to-do. They routinely spend thousands of dollars on the wiring alone, gold, of course. They also routinely call him back to their homes to explain, once again, how to work the $250.00 remote! I'm not "going for the gold," to use an Olympic expression, but the "oxygen free" copper is supposed to be good for the environment, somehow. I'm no tech-weenie, but I do know that the cable does make a difference. I'm just not sure if the $300 Analysis Plus is that much better than the $300 one they have, or if I should, as suggested above, make my own. I would probably bollocks that up, but there is some satisfaction in the D.I.Y. method.

buddhuu
07-20-2010, 08:46 AM
The mains leads I mentioned are THESE (http://www.highendcable.co.uk/Nordost%20VALHALLA%20Power.htm).

I can't even look at that page without shaking my head and LOLing.

ukecantdothat
07-20-2010, 08:58 AM
The mains leads I mentioned are THESE (http://www.highendcable.co.uk/Nordost%20VALHALLA%20Power.htm).

I can't even look at that page without shaking my head and LOLing.Ouch!!! But in fairness to them, you can get "up to" 25% off when you trade in your old cable! Here's Jake S. with a demo of the $6,000.00 (yep, 6 thousand) gold cable...

http://www.analysis-plus.com/

Kekani
07-20-2010, 05:49 PM
You know what's funny about cables - it DOES make a difference to those that can tell. Question is, from a percentage standpoint, how many can actually tell? Not taking anthing away from those that listen to Jake, but really, how many of you can tell when he plays with Analysis, or if he would play with one of my Canare? Actually, bad example because he's probably sponsored and doesn't pay for cables, but you get the drift. . .

Aaron

farmerboy
07-20-2010, 08:04 PM
I still don't get how having a $300 cable makes you a better player than you were with a $30 or even $100 cable. The cable simply transfers electrical impulses from the pickup to the amp. If you want to hear more details of your playing get a compressor - it narrows the dynamic range of your instrument just enough (if setup right) for you to hear all the subtleties of your playing. Sounds like corporate BS to me. Get a good oxygen free cable (because it transfers the signal more cleanly as it hasn't oxidised inside the cable) and play some lovely music. If you still can't hear how good you are, you either aren't that good or you need to get a better amplifier or maybe even a compressor. Don't buy a stupid money wire. (sorry for the rant - bit of a bugbear for me).

salukulady
07-20-2010, 08:21 PM
Aldrine played a semi-private concert a couple years ago on my sound system. While we were setting up he showed me his fancy cable. I couldn't believe the price he quoted. He plugged in my Monster cable and played a riff. He plugged in his fancy cable and played the same riff.....big difference on the same sound system. I would never purchase a chord like his, I will never be that good of a musician and never a soloist. But for someone of Aldrines caliber, I totally get it.

UkuleleHill
07-21-2010, 04:35 AM
Cables are just like ukuleles, it makes a huge difference in what materials are used to make the cables. What metals are used in the wiring and plugs, and their conductvity all play a part. Just as Sally said, it doesn't matter to some of us, as we may never be that good, but to some pros it makes a HUGE difference for their playing.

ukecantdothat
07-21-2010, 06:20 AM
Aldrine played a semi-private concert a couple years ago on my sound system. While we were setting up he showed me his fancy cable. I couldn't believe the price he quoted. He plugged in my Monster cable and played a riff. He plugged in his fancy cable and played the same riff.....big difference on the same sound system. I would never purchase a chord like his, I will never be that good of a musician and never a soloist. But for someone of Aldrines caliber, I totally get it.This is what I'm talking about. Thanks Sally for the first hand testimonial!


Cables are just like ukuleles, it makes a huge difference in what materials are used to make the cables. What metals are used in the wiring and plugs, and their conductvity all play a part. Just as Sally said, it doesn't matter to some of us, as we may never be that good, but to some pros it makes a HUGE difference for their playing.Here, too. Great input. I don't put myself in Aldrine's or Jake's stratosphere, but I'm getting tired of "fighting" my set up, tweaking this and that until it gets to a point where I say, "Hey. That's not bad!" and getting all excited by it. I'm starting to want, "Hey. That's great!" I know most people listening don't know the difference, per se, but Jake put it well in his demo video when he said that the subtle things he does that used to get lost in a dirty signal now comes out clear, and that having that clarity makes you a better player because it also exposes mistakes in articulating notes. I know this from my days of shredding guitars at high volumes. Make a gaffe when the Marshall is set to 11 and the whole world hears it! Again, I'm no Jake/Aldrine/Dominator/Brittni/jumpingflea/James/etc, but I am interested to hear what people's direct experience with high end cabletry is.

fumanii
07-21-2010, 07:15 AM
This is what I'm talking about. Thanks Sally for the first hand testimonial!

Here, too. Great input. I don't put myself in Aldrine's or Jake's stratosphere, but I'm getting tired of "fighting" my set up, tweaking this and that until it gets to a point where I say, "Hey. That's not bad!" and getting all excited by it. I'm starting to want, "Hey. That's great!" I know most people listening don't know the difference, per se, but Jake put it well in his demo video when he said that the subtle things he does that used to get lost in a dirty signal now comes out clear, and that having that clarity makes you a better player because it also exposes mistakes in articulating notes. I know this from my days of shredding guitars at high volumes. Make a gaffe when the Marshall is set to 11 and the whole world hears it! Again, I'm no Jake/Aldrine/Dominator/Brittni/jumpingflea/James/etc, but I am interested to hear what people's direct experience with high end cabletry is.

I talk to a friend of mine who owns a music store about this a lot. We talk about expensive boutique guitar gear. I think the general consensus that we've arrived at is that if it makes you play better and it is worth every penny. I know that when my tone isn't happening I don't play the same as when my tone is happening. Notes just don't ring out like you expect them, the dynamics are different, etc. I did not think much before about boutique guitar amps until I got one. There is a big difference in sound and feel. It was worth the extra money!!

cheekmeat
07-21-2010, 08:06 AM
After doing research on cables, I started building my own. I've settled on Canare GS-6 and G&H connectors. I'll let you do the research on OFC used in Canare Cables and G&H connectors.

I used to make my own cables, but stopped because...Well, to be honest I don't know why. But after checking yours suggestion about Pro Cables N Sound, I'm going to start again. If you can run a soldering iron, you can save some bucks--Particularly once you've got some plugs. They can be used several times if you construct/deconstruct the cable properly.

Regarding expensive equipment and sound, I heard a guy playing guitar through a small AER amp. It sounded spectacular! Blows any of the Roland Cubes I've heard out of the water. Doesn't matter. AERs start at about $1000. I have to save up to get a Cube.

lambchop
07-21-2010, 09:20 AM
As a stereo person (yes, two channel, not multi) I have seen this debate for years. I have gotten some mid-level cables on my stereo and I know my upscale (not that upscale, about $60 a pair) speaker cables made a difference, but for the quality of ukulele transducers and all that, I agree this kind of upgrade is not necessary - now, if you have the money to do it, go ahead, but a good old radio shack cable should work just fine. In fact, I did a little experimentation and using a $20 radio shack mic I got a pretty good externally mounted gooseneck mic for my ukulele that sounds pretty darn good, considering the best of these cost between $300 and $600. Also good cable, unless they are going into the highest quality board and the highest quality settings won't make a bit of difference. I audio, here is the chain of importance: speakers first, then amp/preamp, then pickups, then cables. The last thing your replace once all the others are in place.

ukecantdothat
07-21-2010, 10:28 AM
...here is the chain of importance: speakers first, then amp/preamp, then pickups, then cables. The last thing your replace once all the others are in place.Well with everything else in place, the cables are the end of the path for me. I'm no purist by any stretch. When I started to do live gigging on the uke, I dropped a Radio Shack lapel mic into the sound hole and I got a decent sound after tweaking it thru a Boss 7-band EQ. We did our first 5 or so gigs that way and I "got by," so to speak. So I got a uke with an LR Baggs MiSi and a DI, which made a huge difference, obviously, but still I was struggling to get clarity, particularly high up the fretboard. The songs we're doing (a lot of calypso and soca stuff) sound so good in the studio, that the closer I can get to that nirvana, so much the better. Alrine's tone at a show we did together wiped me way, way out. I knew I was gonna get schooled that night, but man!. I started thinking I needed a bracelet that said W.W.A.D. (what would Aldrine do). Now I know, and it's been buggin' me ever since! I'm not talking about playing style (got schooled there, too), just the tech-weenie stuff.

Great responses from all!