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View Full Version : Ukes for Soldiers: I need your help



mythidiot
03-09-2011, 05:48 AM
Hi Everyone,
Recently a buddy of mine was deployed to Iraq. Right before he left he was borrowing my extra uke a lot and learning to play. Later, his wife mentioned that it was his birthday and we sent him my extra uke. Well, not surprisingly, he plays it on the base all the time and everywhere he goes people ask him to play something and they all jump in with a song. He told his wife that a lot of soldiers there wanted to learn to play the Ukulele.

This got me thinking, what if I got the UU involved and we tried to donate old ukes and/or buy entry level ukes for these soldiers? So that's what I'm proposing, if you've got a playable uke that is just collecting dust or you've got $30ish bucks lying around somewhere, wouldn't it be cool to brighten up a soldier's tour?

My buddy is in the reserves and was called up for 18 months, leaving behind his cute little wife and two boys. This is a tough situation for them, but I like to think that our little Uke gift has helped a little. His boys often ask to play my uke when their around because I think that there is a little connection to Dad that way.

Anywho, this is pretty long rambling post, but I guess I'm wondering if there is any interest out there? I have no idea how many we'd need at this point, but I'm gathering info from the base of guys who would want one. We all have UAS and many of us have a uke or two that we haven't picked up in a while, wouldn't it be cool to use those ukes to spread the Aloha to those who've left their families to serve their country?

What I'm Looking For:
1. People who will commit to donate a Uke
2. People who will commit to donate money to buy and ship a uke (I'll set up a paypal donation thing and do a big bulk buy somewhere)

What you'll get:
1. A photo in this post of the soldier with your Uke (maybe I can talk them into doing a video or something!)
2. The opportunity to give back to some soldiers
2. Awesome karma vibes and a warm fuzzy feeling

joeybug
03-09-2011, 07:12 AM
I can find $30 to give to a solider...how much is that in UK ££? About £20/£25, yeah, give me a couple of weeks to save and I'll donate that. Sounds like a good plan!

hopkid
03-09-2011, 07:45 AM
Count me in for a monetary donation. Thanks for spearheading this effort.

Plainsong
03-09-2011, 07:56 AM
There used to be a program called ukes for troops. I'd like to do my bit with a uke or some money. I might need another month or so though.

http://www.ukuleleunderground.com/forum/showthread.php?26032-Ukes-for-Troops

cjensen91910
03-09-2011, 08:03 AM
Some time ago a movement called "Ukes for Troops" used to exist. I believe Joyce was involved with it. You may want to contact her and see if she has any suggestions or help with your effort. Her link is below:

http://ukuleleuniverse.com/

molokinirum
03-09-2011, 08:04 AM
For what they do for us....$30 is nothing!!!!

Gmoney
03-09-2011, 08:05 AM
DEFINITELY in. Would almost immediately donate a Lanikai LU-21 & would contribute towards some Makala dolphins to head to soldiers as well.

mythidiot
03-09-2011, 08:54 AM
I knew I could count on you guys to be awesome. I think I'll start with just those on this base and see where it goes from there. I was also made aware of a similar thing called "Ukes for Troops" which had given away over 1500 free ukuleles to the troops before the person running it became ill. That is quite a feat.

Anywho, I'll put together a paypal thing tonight and call my friend and see if he's got a list of how many troops on his base are interested and we'll start there. Thanks everyone! Oh and spread the word, the best bang for the buck is going to be if we can combine all of these ukes into as few shipments as possible, that way most of the money goes towards getting more ukes instead of shipping costs.

Tudorp
03-09-2011, 09:05 AM
I do a similar thing on my own, but for under-privileged youth in my area that show interests in learning the Uke, but don't have the means to own their own. So, that said, the couple I have on hand available are already targeted for a couple kids, otherwise I would be blessed to be able to send them to troops. But, I would like to either slate the next one I get in to be sent to one of our men or women warriors. Or at least offer a monitary contribution to buy/send one.

Also, in many cases like this, being a veteran myself, know the USPS sometimes will ship to troops for free when pertaining with gifts and donations for our troops. Ya might want to contact your local PO and see what they say about shipping to our folks over there to save the shipping costs that could go torwards actual Ukes..

mds725
03-09-2011, 09:08 AM
Great idea! I'm in. Have you considered setting up wsomething like a Facebook page for this? I know people who aren't uke players and wouldn't see threads like this one but would love to do something like this to help the troops. I could post a Facebook ukulele donation page on my Facebook wall, it would reach people like that as well as those in the ukulele community.

freckleduker
03-09-2011, 09:30 AM
What I can do is purchase a new one on Amazon and have it shipped directly to you. How's that sound?

Hippie Dribble
03-09-2011, 11:24 AM
I'm in. Awesome idea mate. :)

redheadedali
03-09-2011, 11:39 AM
I would happily donate $ for this.

OldePhart
03-09-2011, 11:55 AM
Figure out the mechanics and I'm in. Do you want them shipped to you or what?

Several years ago a marine reservist I work with was called up for Afghanistan. Once he got over there he got in touch with us and organized "care packages" for his unit. You'd be surprised some of the stuff guys asked for most - toilet paper, sun screen, hard candies, playing cards, stationary - really basic stuff. I don't know if it's still the case but the first couple of years in Afghanistan the military supply system was really struggling to keep them in guns and rations, let alone "luxuries" like paper and envelopes to write home.

Nuprin
03-09-2011, 11:58 AM
Count me in...I'll give some money for a great cause!

Tudorp
03-09-2011, 12:05 PM
Figure out the mechanics and I'm in. Do you want them shipped to you or what?

Several years ago a marine reservist I work with was called up for Afghanistan. Once he got over there he got in touch with us and organized "care packages" for his unit. You'd be surprised some of the stuff guys asked for most - toilet paper, sun screen, hard candies, playing cards, stationary - really basic stuff. I don't know if it's still the case but the first couple of years in Afghanistan the military supply system was really struggling to keep them in guns and rations, let alone "luxuries" like paper and envelopes to write home.


Tell me about it. People over here wiith running water just dont understand what those kids do without over there. It's not intensional, but just hard to conceave. I have a good friend that was in Iraq serving as a Marine Captian. I got a bunch of friends that used to about every month or so for the year she was over there, send her troops a box of simple items we gathered together for them. It was pitiful really when I used to get messages from her telling me that the soldiers over there would gather in front of her tent every time they saw a box from the states come. And many of them were actually reduced to tears to eat a snickers bar from home. A bar of soap would put smiles on their faces. The things we take for granted safe at home..

Baseballhack
03-09-2011, 12:07 PM
Hey guys I just wanted to say that you guys are awesome. I am in the Air Force and was recently in Afghanistan. These types of gestures mean a lot. There was a program called "a cup of Joe" i believe in which we would get a gift card for a cup of coffee, if your base has a coffee place that is. Even something as small as that was a great gesture. Just wanted to say thanks to all of you for looking out for us.

Tudorp
03-09-2011, 12:16 PM
What was really really cool, that year my Captian friend was over there, it was near halloween. A local store gave up an unbelieveable amount of all kinds of halloween candy from all sorts of hard candies, fun sized chocolate bars of many types. I think we got an easy 50 or 60 pounds of candy from that store. I mentioned it to them when I was in there buying a bunch of travel hygene kits. The manager was in there and when he asked what I was doing with all those kits, he told me to hold on a minute, and went back to the back, and then I see this dolly come up front loaded with boxes of unopened halloween candy. He told to send all that too them. The USPS didn't even charge me to send it. When those guys got that month's care package, the Capt said those guys were estatic, and ran around their area dancing with faces full of candy.. lol.. Made my day that they had allot of fun with that stuff...

Point is, theres allot of mom and pop stores that will leap at a chance to give ya stuff if you can get it over there..

Ronnie Aloha
03-09-2011, 02:35 PM
I'm in for $.

FreakyBob
03-09-2011, 03:29 PM
I'm in for bucks too! See if the Ukes for Troops handle can be gotten going again. Can't beat that name. Thanks for your effort.

Steve vanPelt
03-09-2011, 03:43 PM
Count me in. I'm building one right now that should be done in a couple of weeks. I can't think of a better home for it. I'll order a case and a tuner and ship it off to you as soon as it's ready. Let me know where to send it. Thanks so much for doing this! :bowdown:

Steve

mythidiot
03-09-2011, 07:45 PM
Wow, this is rad. I knew that this was a generous community, but I've gotta be honest, I'm pretty overwhelmed by three pages of responses in just a few hours. I really think that this will brighten up a lot of troops. I'm very excited. Thanks again everyone, I know that these small gestures will makes a huge impact. It was cool reading some comments with experiences that you've had regarding the impact that stuff like this has.

Nuts and Bolts Stuff:


Name: I'm thinking G.I. Uke for a name. Somehow it didn't feel right to use Ukes for Troops since that wasn't mine to begin with.
Nonprofit: After talking with a few friends today, I've ascertained that I've gotta run this through a nonprofit so that none of the donations get taxed as income. That way ALL of the money will go to stuff for the troops. Give me a week or so on this one and I'll work something out.
Facebook: As suggested, I've started a Facebook Page (http://www.facebook.com/pages/GI-Uke-Donate-Ukes-for-the-Troops/172222272824906) for this. Currently there isn't anything on it, but it would be cool if a few people could "like" that page because some features are not available until you have a certain number of fans. So if you have a Facebook account, jump over there real quick and "like" that page.
Paypal: they have a very simple donation button set up that will work really well for this, but I want to make sure we have our ducks in a row before we start collecting anything.
Shipping: There have been several questions about whether to ship stuff to me or directly to them or what. Honestly, I'm not really sure what the best thing to do, but I have a buddy at UPS that I'm going to talk to. I'll have more information on that later. So for right now, hold onto everything until I can figure out the best course of action for logistics.


Help:
It has also occurred to me that this thing is much bigger than I can handle alone. If I do it alone, it will be quite limited, but I think that there are probably some of you out there that have skill sets that might be helpful. Here's a short list of things that could be useful (once we get those ducks to line up right)


Writers: Every good enterprise needs to be explained well if it is to grow. If you have a mind for writing, I'd like you to join up on the P.R. team. I noticed that the Ukes for Troops got some great press online and on the air mostly due to people getting the word out.
Graphics: We may want some stuff designed at some point
Callers: We may want to contact Uke and music companies for donations. They get great exposure and our troops get more ukes. It is very likely that many of you have contacts that are closely connected to these companies.
Smarter People Than Me: We'll definitely continue to need great ideas. Already we've seen some very good advice in the this thread.

The Most Important Thing...
Please be patient with me as I get things set up, I kinda got ahead of myself and posted right as I had this idea without thinking everything through. So I'm going to get a lot ready this weekend and get in touch with Seth (my deployed buddy I mentioned earlier) and iron out some details.

Thank you all so much, this really means a lot.

Plainsong
03-10-2011, 01:16 AM
No offence, but I think I'd rather give a uke to one of the thousands of Iraqi children orphaned as a result of the 100,000 civilian deaths that have been caused by US aggression in Iraq.

They'd need some lessons and starter tips though. Does anyone have any contacts to help make this happen?

seoulsister
03-10-2011, 02:23 AM
Thank you so much for putting this together. It's one thing to brainstorm it, but another to put legs to the idea. I know they would be so appreciative and it would definitely put a smile on their face. Ukes are so small and are the perfect instrument to travel well. ;)

Fulhamjim
03-10-2011, 02:37 AM
No offence, but I think I'd rather give a uke to one of the thousands of Iraqi children orphaned as a result of the 100,000 civilian deaths that have been caused by US aggression in Iraq.


Wow, there's always one.

1014
03-10-2011, 03:47 AM
not to be all habuts, but is this really endorsed by UU?

http://www.ukuleleunderground.com/forum/showthread.php?4720-Ukulele-donations

Tudorp
03-10-2011, 04:37 AM
Ya know.. In light of the recent post in this thread. I need to chime in on that UU friend's behalf. Altho the comment may not be a popluar one, especially with the masses that support our troops and/or efforts. But, I am a veteran and served overseas myself. I did my job and duty to God and Country, right or wrong in the eyes of the public. But I did my duty as I saw I should to help contribute to what we call life, and freedom. I am not looking for Kudos, because I personally didn't do my job for that. I did my job for what I percieved was right, and I know most if not all our current troops do it. The word Hero is so thrown around these days, it really doesn't mean much any more. When in fact a true Hero would never, and do never consider themselves as such. In fact, most true heros despise that word. A true Hero does the right thing. But that siad, the right thing is to do our best to preserve our freedoms. One of those freedoms is the right to feel, think, and say as you feel is right in your own mind. Our troops are fighting currently and paying the ultimate price to preserve that, and give those of us that right to think on their own and as they feel is right from their perspective. As well as make it an option for the rest of the world that doesn't have those same rights. So, agree, or disagree with any comments, it is the fundiental reason our troops do what they do, so they can feel as they do without persicusion, or fear of rebelion and separation. Like it or not, it is their God given, and soldier given right. You don't have to agree with it, but you should at least respect it, or you risk belittling what our troops are trying to preserve. Just sayin..

ok..Im off my soap box.. ;)

Plainsong
03-10-2011, 05:17 AM
Yeah what's not to agree with there. I know it was an obvious troll post, because if the poster was serious they could ask about starting their own "Ukes for Iraqi Kids!" program. But kids need ukes too, so I figured why not respond seriously to it.

To say that ukes for soldiers is awesome isn't to say ukes for kids wouldn't be awesome. But then I think the poster knows that already. ;)

PrestonM
03-10-2011, 05:31 AM
1- Great idea Athos... if you beleive in it run with it.
2- Trolling politics belongs on an other thread.

I hope you have the privilage to befriend a soldier or a vet. in your life.

Lori
03-10-2011, 06:45 AM
I would be happy to provide some Uke Leashes for the cause. PM me when you get the details figured out.

–Lori

greg_usa
03-10-2011, 08:30 AM
Maybe this organisation could help.

http://www.iraqiorphanfoundation.com/index.html

I bet they can help! Are you going to follow up with them and try and get it organized or did you just want to make clear you have no interest in helping get ukuleles to our troops?

I agree with Tudorp 100% about freedom to speak your opinions. Sometimes it's helpful to have ______ like yourself around to remind us that these freedoms go for everyone, no matter how full of _____ your opions might be.

You can fill in the blanks or I can gladly fill them in for you if we ever have the pleasure to meet in person :o) Have a loverly day Athos.

And Mythidiot and Athos - you both can count me in for a monetary donation for your respective causes.

greg_usa
03-10-2011, 09:38 AM
As for what you'd do if we met, I guess we'll never know. My experience of internet tough guys is that they're somewhat less forthright in real life.



I think you misunderstood me, friend. I was just offering to fill in the blanks from my post. I thought it would be fun. I'm not sure what you think I had in mind for those blanks, but I'm sure you're mistaken. And I completely agree with your theory about internet tough guys - I encourage you to test that out as soon a possible! Now that we have all that miscommunication cleared up, I think it would be a hoot to meet in real life. I'm located in New York and would love to catch up if you live in the area or are passing through? I'd be happy to pick a nice spot to meet where we can educate each other on ukes, politics, charitable organizations and such. No need to side-track this thread with our pleasantries, so why don't you private message me if you'd be interested. :o)

mythidiot
03-10-2011, 11:55 AM
not to be all habuts, but is this really endorsed by UU?

http://www.ukuleleunderground.com/forum/showthread.php?4720-Ukulele-donations
Thanks for pointing that out, that would be one of those ducks I need to get in that row.

mythidiot
03-10-2011, 12:11 PM
After being made aware of this comment from Ryan:
Please read the rules before asking for stuff. NO UNSOLICITED requests for money or donations without approval of the UU staff. The reason for this is because, the UU community is a very giving community that it would be very easy for someone to take advantage of their generosity. Letting anyone ask for donations sets a bad precedence and give the impression that anyone can come in and ask for things.I totally agree with the logic behind this rule. I have emailed for permission and will not be doing anything else until I hear back from UU. All politics aside, I really appreciate the generosity expressed in this thread and generally by the users of this forum and I would hate for anything I do to open a door for that to be taken advantage of. So sit tight everyone and I'll be back when I have news from UU

Plainsong
03-11-2011, 12:57 AM
Athos, it's not about agreeing or disagreeing. Don't act all butthurt that just because people called you out, that somehow means we're all jingoistic war mongers, and how no one gets you you're the only one for peace. That ain't it, and I think you know that. Or you should be smart enough know that. Nor are all soldiers the stereotype you seem to think they are. They're people, and people are different from one another.

But the nature of your post was a troll, plain and simple, and you know it. If you were serious, your manner of writing would have been different, and probably its own thread. Come on.

johntz
03-11-2011, 04:03 AM
I hope this thread does not deteriorate. Lets stay true to the original post. I'm in for the $ donation.

70sSanO
03-11-2011, 04:34 AM
I hope this thread does not deteriorate. Lets stay true to the original post. I'm in for the $ donation.

I agree... work out the details and approvals. Once you get it set up just let us know the PayPal account or where to ship the ukuleles.

I think it is a great idea.

John

Tudorp
03-11-2011, 04:49 AM
Agree. I made my soapbox speach in hopes that any conflicting opinions would just go away and agree to disagree in respect for each argument. That said, I was arrogant myself as an American, in thinking that we ALL are American and have a patriotic American mentality. Many times I myself forget that we have a diverse global community here. Our soldiers fight to preserve our American freedoms. If you aren't American, that doesn' mean a whole lot, and thats ok. But we also try to liberate other cultures so they can enjoy the same freedoms we enjoy. Sometimes that is confused with trying to force our ideals on others, but truly it is not. It is simply the desire to give other cultures the same opertunities, and options Americans enjoy. Political motives? I can not comment on because I am not a politician. But, in the mindset of the average soldier, our motives are generally to just do the right thing for human kind.

Lets agree, and/or agree to disagree, respectfully, and get back to topic.

God Bless

Ukulele JJ
03-11-2011, 05:24 AM
Nonprofit: After talking with a few friends today, I've ascertained that I've gotta run this through a nonprofit so that none of the donations get taxed as income. That way ALL of the money will go to stuff for the troops. Give me a week or so on this one and I'll work something out.

I'm no tax attorney, but a few thoughts spring to mind.

First of all, setting up an official non-profit (a 501c3 corporation) is a pretty big deal. It can take a fairly significant amount of time, effort, paperwork, and money. You'll need to form a board of directors and that sort of thing.

If it were me, I'd go ahead and just get things rolling as it is. Run it for, say, a year first. See if the idea has legs and turns into something big enough to justify creating the corporation.

Yes, this would mean that any cash gifts and donations would be taxable income for you in the meantime. But there might be ways around that.

For example, instead of giving the ukes directly to the troops, for the time being you could donate them to an existing non-profit organization that is involved in military aid. They would then pass them on to the troops and receipt you for the value of the donation. You could then deduct that amount from your taxes, which would offset (perhaps completely, depending on your other deductions) the extra income you would have to claim on your return.

Alternatively, you could just run it like a for-proft business for now. "Mythidiot's Ukulele Purchasing and Shipping Service." File a Schedule C like any other sole proprietorship. You only get taxed on your net profits, not the total amount of your "sales" (the donations). After buying and shipping the ukes, which are costs to your business, your actual profits might only be a few dollars. So what if you get taxed on that? You might even post a loss of a few bucks. (There are probably more IRS landmines to navigate with this technique than the first one though.)

Just to restate: I am not a qualified advisor for any of the above. Be sure to check with an expert before going down any of these roads.

JJ


Edited to add: Another thought: If the lady that was doing "Ukes for Troops" incorporated as a 501c3 and if the corporation is still technically an ongoing concern (they haven't liquidated the assets and distributed them according to the charter), maybe you could just talk to her and have her pass the reins on to you? Instant non-profit!

1014
03-11-2011, 06:07 AM
no need further topic derail. `onipa`a.

OldePhart
03-11-2011, 07:01 AM
As UkuleleJJ said, setting up a non-profit can be expensive and time-consuming - and let's not even talk about the continuing nightmare of paperwork, etc., to comply with IRS regulations in perpetuity.

You might try contacting a local affiliate of an existing charitable organization with similar goals - VFW or one of the existing charities that assist military and military families. You can still expect some paperwork to be involved so they can meet their reporting requirements for the IRS, but running something under their existing charter and processes will probably be much easier than going it alone. They'll also have more experience with what it takes to get ukes to deployed soldiers. I'm assuming you want these to go to guys in forward units where access to recreation and facilities is extremely limited - most of those assigned permanently to support roles in rear echelon areas have reasonable access to some recreation and shopping.

John

Plainsong
03-11-2011, 09:38 AM
I wasn't trolling, and didn't accuse anyone of jingoism or war-mongering. Nor did I make any negative comment about soldiers, or peddle any stereotype about them. I disagree with you, that's all. I'm happy for others to disagree with me; I don't consider that being "called out", and I'm certainly not "butthurt". I've made my point, though, and don't intend to labour it, and derail this thread.

Yes, the point you made is that your posts aren't worth reading. Welcome to my ignore list.

I mean seriously, what was your point? If you were serious you would have started your own thread about really getting it going. Instead, you grandstanded on the backs of Iraqi orphans, using their pain so you could feel superior. Disgusting. Do grow up.

greg_usa
03-11-2011, 11:50 AM
internet tough guys.. aren't they're the worst? going around calling people names. i always wonder if they're so forthright in real life. Edit - implied insults and excessive profanity removed. - seeso.

this is all hypothetical of course. nothing like this could possibly happen on a forum about ukuleles. :o)

OldePhart
03-11-2011, 01:48 PM
Putting me on your ignore lis is the internet equivalent of putting your fingers in your ears and shouting "I'm not listening".

No, more like the internet equivalent of closing your window so you don't have to listen to your neighbor's ill-mannered brats playing outside.

:biglaugh:

surfink
03-12-2011, 01:22 AM
Great idea, good thread, sorry one person got ruffled feathers..People complain about Walmart putting stores out of business, yet want the low prices offered by Walmart...
Ukes can put smiles on faces of soldiers and kids, wherever they are...
Some soldiers even play uke with the kids...God Forbid...
If not for soldiers, those in UK could be speaking german now...

ricdoug
03-12-2011, 02:05 PM
I wasn't trolling, and didn't accuse anyone of jingoism or war-mongering. Nor did I make any negative comment about soldiers, or peddle any stereotype about them.

Yes you did:

[
I didn't post merely to explain that I have no interest in sending ukes to your troops, but rather in the hope that people might consider sending their spares to a more worthwhile cause.

Neither cause is more "worthwhile". They are equal. It's about spreading the joy of music. Here's two fine examples:

http://ukulelesforpeace.com/

http://www.spokesman.com/stories/2006/feb/07/ukes-for-troops-brings-music-to-combat-zones/

Shirley is the owner of:

http://www.ukuleleparadise.com/

and she has several ukulele groups on her property throughout each week.

If you had started a "Ukes for Iraqi Kids/Orphans" thread, many here might have viewed your intent in a more positive light. Your vernacular clearly brought politics into this forum, where we get together to enjoy the ukulele and it's musical character.

Like some others in this thread, I'm also a vet. Myself and many others I know taught people on many foreign shores how to play music. I left many a guitar with them when I left. Ric Douglas, USMC Retired

ricdoug
03-12-2011, 02:21 PM
mythidiot, you don't need to start a 501c3. In California, there are non profit associations that have a one time setup fee of about $20 bucks. These are much simpler and more cost effective. Ric

ricdoug
03-12-2011, 09:36 PM
No I didn't. To say I prefer one cause over another does not disparage US soldiers.




I disagree, obviously.

It proves you are biased and do NOT see both causes as equal. This thread was not started with any political bias. You are the first and only one to add that. Your comments totally put the United States Military as less deserving of ukuleles and music. In your own words, you put one cause over another and see the United States Military as less deserving of the gift of music. Your last post is nothing but your political views attempting to segregate the Ukulele Underground community. Take your politics to a forum where they're expected and accepted. If you want to start a ukulele charity for Iraqi children/orphans, stay here and do so - without any political tripe.

Ric

rasputinsghost
03-12-2011, 09:55 PM
It is simply the desire to give other cultures the same opertunities, and options Americans enjoy. Political motives? I can not comment on because I am not a politician. But, in the mindset of the average soldier, our motives are generally to just do the right thing for human kind.


God Bless

I appreciate your heartfelt words but I'm pretty sure lots of people on this forum probably have different ideas about what it means to have their culture 'liberated' by the US military. The wars fought in American history, or really, the history of any nation weren't started because a bunch of soldiers, sailors and airmen huddled around and decided, "Let's liberate X country!" Other interests were at play. But that's another discussion.

I'll leave you with this, since we're a ukulele forum:

"On January 17, 1893, the last monarch of the Kingdom of Hawaiʻi, Queen Lili'uokalani, was deposed in a coup d'état led largely by American citizens who were opposed to Lili'uokalani's attempt to establish a new Constitution. The success of the coup efforts was supported by the landing of U.S. Marines, who came ashore at the request of the conspirators."

With the result:

"This guaranteed a voting monopoly by the landed aristocracy. Asians who comprised a large proportion of the population, were stripped of their voting rights as many Japanese and Chinese members of the population who had previously become naturalized as subjects of the Kingdom, subsequently lost all voting rights. Many Americans and wealthy Europeans, in contrast, acquired full voting rights at this time, without the need for Hawaiian citizenship."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overthrow_of_the_Hawaiian_Kingdom

ricdoug
03-12-2011, 09:59 PM
Wrong again, Athos. You recently posted a totally political biased response:

"With respect, I think a call to support the military is political. Whilst I'm sure that the original poster intended it as a humanitarian gesture, such initiatives reinforce a climate in which criticism of military action is considered taboo for being unpatriotic. This is used to stifle criticism of immoral and illegal wars.

The simple fact is that, whilst US soldiers may believe that they went to Iraq to deliver freedom to the Iraqis and protect America, this in not why they were sent.

If the US government was interested in protecting civilians it would have acted to prevent massacres in Bosnia, Rwanda or Darfur.

Similarly, if it was interested in spreading freedom, it would not ally itself with brutal and despotic regimes around the world. For instance, its closest ally in the middle east is Saudi Arabia: a country where a woman has to ask a man's permission to leave the house, and then can only do so covered from head to toe, and where she might get stoned to death for having an affair.

Not only does it ally itself with such countries, the US often arms them, in the same way that it did in the 80s with Saddam Hussein (at a time it was clear he was committing atrocities against his own people), and Al Qaeda before that (because they were fighting the Soviets).

The idea that the war in Iraq is protecting America is ridiculous, too. The IAEA concluded that Saddam had no WMDs; it did not pose a threat to the US. Rather the invasion has damaged the US's reputation throughout the Arab and Muslim world, and, almost certainly has made it more of a target for radical islamist terrorist atrocities, like the terrible events of 9/11.

The real reason for the invasion of Iraq is that it suits the financial interests of those in power (politicians, media, financiers, industrialists etc). Haliburton has made billions of dollars from the war, and the Bush family's oil interests have been protected. All at the cost of well-intentioned and brave US soldiers being killed.

The government peddles myths of patriotism and a glorious death in defence of America to distract attention from what's really happening. Anyone really interested in helping US soldiers would be better off rejecting such myths, taking the power back, and bringing their sons and daughters home.

That is why all the flag-waving and drum-beating for US troops irks me: not because I dislike US soldiers, but because I think it plays into the hands of those who lie to them, and send them to die, for their own financial ends. I'm sure that, as men and women, their sincerity and courage deserves a lot more than a uke , but I fear that such initiatives create culture in which unswerving support of troops is perverted into a fear of criticising the US's often appalling foreign policy.

I accept that I may have bought some of the flak on myself by not setting out my thinking more clearly right from the start, but I didn't want to derail the thread. Maybe that was a mistake. The responses I received required me to explain my position in more deatail, now, however."

Your post is both devisive and trolling. Stick to the ukulele and music, or find another venue to vent your political view. The Ukulele Underground is politically neutral. Your posts are not. Ric

rasputinsghost
03-12-2011, 10:07 PM
Supporting a charity that sends ukuleles to American soldiers is intrinsically political, as are posts on Veteran's Day asking God to bless our troops, etc. I have absolutely no problems with those things, but don't pretend as though people don't post political things on UU. They may not be questioned or debated since they might reflect the views of lots of posters, but they're still political.

ricdoug
03-12-2011, 10:10 PM
Yes, my post was more overtly political

Get off the Ukulele Underground's plane, Athos. Your politics have zero business here. This community is about the musical appreciation of the ukulele and nothing about divisive politics. Ric

ricdoug
03-12-2011, 10:13 PM
Supporting a charity that sends ukuleles to American soldiers is intrinsically political, as are posts on Veteran's Day asking God to bless our troops, etc. I have absolutely no problems with those things, but don't pretend as though people don't post political things on UU. They may not be questioned or debated since they might reflect the views of lots of posters, but they're still political.

Religion has zero place on the Ukulele Underground either, rasputinsghost. Let's stick to the ukulele and music. Ric

Plainsong
03-13-2011, 05:06 AM
As I scroll past all the empty Athos boxes, ahh the bliss of ignore, people stop quoting him! :spam: :cool: ... He's too self absorbed to figure out that it's not that people do or don't agree with his viewpoint, it's about context and tone, which anyone past 8th grade understands.

I'd like to let the OP know that I'll be able to join up in a week or so. And if a soldier wants to give a child a uke, well that's no bad thing in my book! Music can be about peace and harmony if you let it. :o

bazmaz
03-13-2011, 05:26 AM
What a sad way for a well meaning thread to go - Thanks for that Athos - you have brought argument and animosity to a rare thing - a forum that never has those things.

seeso
03-13-2011, 06:35 AM
I really don't think I need to explain why I'm shutting this down, do I?

Check the forum for the new thread - "G.I. Uke." Please keep it on-topic. (http://www.ukuleleunderground.com/forum/showthread.php?43774-G.I.-Uke)