Brazilian Rosewood -- did I screw up?

Stevelele · Jul 27, 2011

I probably should have done the diligence before I bought it, but I just purchased this Brazilian Rosewood set. Am told that it was cut in the 60's/70's. Looks great and the seller tells me that it has a nice tone, but are there other questions that I should've asked and could there be problems in making this into a custom uke? I'm not a luthier but plan to send it to one for a custom:

joejeweler · Jul 27, 2011

Looks really nice to me,....i prefer the look of what some would call "stumpwood". Most old time guitar freaks say
straight grained brazilian has better tone, but i haven't found that to be the case. The builder is the key!
You don't show any sides in your pic,.....did you get a set with the back pieces?

I dug out some guitars i had made, that i saved the "set" pics of,......you'll feel a lot better!
By the way, just curious what a set like that ran? It should make a great sounding and looking uke.

This is the 1st Kevin Ryan Grand Abbey brazilian/engleman i had commissioned
a few years ago.

The guitar is listed at Kevin Ryan's website as a recent build, with a lot of pics here:

http://ryanguitars.com/NewsandEvents/RecentGuitars/AbbeyCTWBVL/AbbeyCTWBVL.htm

Here's the 2nd custom brazilian set i had Kevin Ryan build a Grand Abbey Parlor from, and the finished back:
The complete guitar pics can be found here: http://www.guitargal.com/content/ryan-abbey-parlor-special-custom-order-guitar

Stevelele · Jul 28, 2011

wow--that's very beautiful. I do have pics of the sides, but they pretty much look the same as the back--they match well. I paid about $225 for it, which is a lot, but it's around half as much as the upgrade charges i've seen for ukes like this. Always loved the look and just have to figure out who will make it. Thinking of asking Dave Talsma or DaSilva... any other suggestions?

RichM · Jul 28, 2011

$225 for a nicely figured set of Brazilian is a steal-- most builders would charge you considerably more than that. I think you did exceedingly well and that should make a beautiful uke. Hard to get the scale from the photo, but it looks big enough for a tenor-- is that what you're going for?

DeVineGuitars · Jul 28, 2011

Don't forget that builders charge more for using woods like BR (Brazilian rosewood) for a few reasons. Besides the fact that it's hard to get the good stuff, woods like BR need special care when building and finishing and need to be dried for much longer. I for one do an extra step of filling the pores with CA (Super glue) which is very unpleasant and time consuming. The CA pore file not only fills the pores but will fill any micro cracks in the wood and preventing it from cracking further down the road.

With that said, it is a beautiful set you have there. Let's see the sides!

joejeweler · Jul 28, 2011

syfc said:
wow--that's very beautiful. I do have pics of the sides, but they pretty much look the same as the back--they match well. I paid about $225 for it, which is a lot, but it's around half as much as the upgrade charges i've seen for ukes like this. Always loved the look and just have to figure out who will make it. Thinking of asking Dave Talsma or DaSilva... any other suggestions?

Yep, as already stated you stole that brazilian set! Ummm, just by comparison, the Ryan brazilian sets 2 years ago were
a $4,000 upcharge. (currently $5,000 as i understand it). The are bigger for sure, but still shows you "gut" is OK!

Both completed guitars were over $17K, btw. Ok while i was working and playing serious blackjack and gold trading.
Out of work for 18 months now and i'm a lot more frugal.

joejeweler · Jul 28, 2011

syfc said:
I probably should have done the diligence before I bought it, but I just purchased this Brazilian Rosewood set. Am told that it was cut in the 60's/70's. Looks great and the seller tells me that it has a nice tone, but are there other questions that I should've asked and could there be problems in making this into a custom uke? I'm not a luthier but plan to send it to one for a custom:

View attachment 26170

By the way,....do you know if the supplier of that brazilian set had more sets available of a similiar "look"?

Pass it along if you do,.....someday i'm looking to try my hand at making a concert for myself.

cheers,
Joe T

Stevelele · Jul 28, 2011

Thanks for all of your advice and encouragement. I will keep you updated. Those devine ukes are amazing--a bit out of my price range, but amazing. Maybe if I save my pennies. And thanks Joe for your comments. I'll send you some info in a bit. Here are the sides

itsme · Jul 28, 2011

syfc said:
ILooks great and the seller tells me that it has a nice tone, but are there other questions that I should've asked and could there be problems in making this into a custom uke?

Beautiful wood!

Are you familiar with CITES and the Lacey Act? BR is "protected" wood, and you could run into issues down the line if you ever wanted to sell it to an international buyer or travel abroad and back with it.

Stevelele · Jul 28, 2011

thanks--yes have heard of the laws prohibiting the export of that wood. Hopefully I'd never have to sell it. Any suggestions on a good top to match it with? Seems like a lot of people are using adirondack spruce with it. Or some form of cedar. Sort of opposed to any cedar bc it sounds too much like a guitar

Dan Uke · Jul 28, 2011

Spruce is very common for guitars as well!! I personally would go with any mellow wood.

DeVineGuitars · Jul 28, 2011

I usually prefer a softer wood lile redwood or cedar with Brazilian Rosewood. It makes a very well balanced sound.

Bradford · Jul 28, 2011

I have been kind of hanging back and waiting to see if anyone was going to mention the CITES Treaty/Lacey Act. BR is on appendix one of the CITES Treaty, right there with tortoise shell and elephant ivory. I know very little about these laws, but from what I heard at the GAL convention, I would not go near Brazilian rosewood. I strongly urge anyone who has any BR or is considering using it, to seek some expert legal advice on the subject. The fines that were mentioned were one to five years in jail, $100,000 to $500,000.

Brad

Moore Bettah Ukuleles · Jul 29, 2011

I'm with you Brad. I've even been offered some BR for free but I won't go near the stuff. Shoots, I might fall in love with it and then what?

Steve vanPelt · Jul 29, 2011

The fines and stuff is only a worry when trying to import or export Brz RW. Once it's here, it's here. Really excellent (and really long) threads on the issue in the Log Cabin and at the Other Luthier Forum. David Berkowitz, John Arnold, Henk and quite a few others are pretty well up on the latest. Bottomline, keep it in the country it's at. Crossing borders is possible in theory, but sheesh, probably not worth the trouble.

If I was a luthier and I had a $1000 upcharge for Brazilian, I'd probably double it to use a customers' wood, not offer a discount. I'm building a Brazilian/Red Spruce tenor now and I think it's going to be sweet. It smells sweet, anyway.

Bradford · Jul 29, 2011

Thanks Chuck, I do not want to be Chicken Little here but what I understand is happening with the US FWS showing up at the ASIA conference and the Chuck Erikson article to the GAL is the officials are giving these organizations a chance to spread the word before the hammer comes down. The fact is these laws are so complex, the people who regulate them will give conflicting information. The problem is, in the eyes of the law, they do not have to understand them- WE DO!

Brad

Bradford · Jul 29, 2011

For all of you who think they understand that this law only applies to import/export, let me ask these questions. How many of you use abalone/shell products in their inlay work? How many of you have the required US FWS permit to do so? When shipping ukes with shell products in them, do you dutifully label them " this package contains animal products" as required by law.

Brad

Steve vanPelt · Jul 29, 2011

So true, Brad. Lmi quit shipping shell out of the country. I just got some bridge pins with mop dots and they had to disclose it on the outside of the package. You have to list the species, where it was harvested and the weight..... for a 2mm dot.

Bradford · Jul 29, 2011

Again, I just urge anyone who sells instruments to spend some time researching these laws. The penalties for noncompliance can be very severe. I'll get off my soapbox now.

Brad

Moore Bettah Ukuleles · Jul 29, 2011

Even some of my suppliers and wholesalers can't/won't give me a straight answer as to point of origin. When shipping out of the country the forms that need to be filed, the fees ($91) and the processing time (6 weeks), it's convinced me to finally stop shipping internationally. As if what we do wasn't hard enough.......Sheesh. Pretty soon I'll be forced to build ukuleles from lawn clippings. Even then I'll have to show what fertilizers and weed killers have been used. Retirement can't be that far off.

Brazilian Rosewood -- did I screw up?

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