When to let clients go?

Pete Howlett

Pete Howlett

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At what point do you give up? At the third email where they change their mind or when a fellow luthier tells you, "They weren't happy with the first neck set so I did it again"... this from one of the top guys in the UK. I think I've got my radar pretty much attenuated now.
 
If I get a customer who loves everything about the uke except for this one little thing, that's it for me. You ain't gonna make em happy! I move on.
 
Come to think of it, you'd be better off canceling the sale, then selling a custom uke because your time would be minimal and spent on the next custom order, while you waited for a buyer who would fancy a no-wait custom built instrument. From a strategy point of view, if the fix was not definite (file down the nut, etc) you'd be better off time-wise.
 
It's all about expectations. In a former life, I built custom homes. Actually, I subcontracted out most of the work, but I was ultimately responsible to the customer. There were times when I inspected work that a sub had done and was so embarrassed by it that I insisted it be corrected. I didn't even consult with the customer. The luthiers who post here maintain similarly high standards for their work. But, I'm certain that every now and then they encounter, as I have, a customer whose expectations are impossible to meet. Unfortunately, this is often only recognizable when your deeply into a job. In my experience, the worst approach you can take when you realize you are dealing with such a customer is to continue to try to please them. They are bottomless pits and will never be satisfied. You will run yourself ragged getting nowhere. Cancel the deal. Buy out if you have too. It's not worth it. Especially when there are so many customers out there who would be delighted with your wares.
 
You are all right - any inckling of a problem now and it's "Whoa buck!" I am not taking 'em on any more. There are other makers in the world they can go to and we would never be the right fit.
 
In a former life, I had a business that involved selling pricey items to cutomers who were comfortably well off. For the most part my customers were a joy to deal with. Those that were not, basically ran me like a rented mule and then shopped out my hard work to a lower bidder. I'm not sure why they did that, but I began to take pains to weed out customers who might be a problem. One was tough, in that I really liked him and he always showed a lot of interest, but after close to 4 years of running me around he finally stepped up to the get a piece of work and then tried to hit me for a discount and a long payment schedule. I sold the item to another customer and he got the hint. I still wish I had a found a more diplomatic way of cutting him off, but I was not thinking straight at that time.

So, all that says is that if you think a customer is not working out figure out a kind way, if possible, to sever your relationship. Hard to do good work when your aggravated.
 
aaronckeim said:
Some customers and luthiers are just the wrong match. It's hard to give up a sale, but the wrong kind of customer can cause more harm then good.
Click to expand...

+1. I was just in the process of doing a "distributor" order, sort of a basic "we'll see how the first one goes". Fortunately, we've had a long peer relationship & both waiting to get together on a project. I started based on " I think we'll do this and that.". You already know where this is going.

Bottom line, he wanted me to do something that anyone else could do, some better than I, so I was going to refer him out and end it.

FORTUNATELY, he understands that the builder should want to do the build, and be comfortable with the client, and vice versa. Based on our past history, and my newfound appreciation of his understanding the builders' perspective, the project continued.

Just because I was going to cut the build, the fact that we would've remained friends anyway helped the build continue. Communication was key.

Speaking of communication, I just cut a build when there were no return calls or emails. But that's basic.

Aaron
 
I have had several customers where I've simply stated that it has become clear that I am unable to meet their expectations and the best thing to do would be for them to find someone else to complete the project. If they had the instrument then I sent a call tag to them to have it returned to me at which point I'd refund all their money. Its important to me to get out cleanly so that they can't say that I took advantage of them. If I already had the instrument, or it was in process, then I simply gave them a full refund. Once you make that decision you can't back down from it. I made that mistake once too and let them sweet talk me back in to the deal at which point it became a real nightmare and got nasty on both sides. I've been down that road three times in about a hundred instruments.
 
I don't do commision work, for just those reasons...I just sell them on e-bay...and I still get the odd customer coming back with things they arn't happy with....Slight intonation at the 10th fret 3rd string, was one:(.... another was (after he had bought it ?) "dont like the gold tuners with black buttons can you please change them to chrome and white , and can you restring it left handed with side dots before you send it with a spare set of strings" :mad:....this is after listing it with full detail description and 10 close up pic's.
 
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I just flicked one this afternoon. My hackles went up at the first phone call. Very demanding and felt that I should drop all my other work, because they were much more important that anyone else. Then the line that really closed the discussion was...."Didn't I know who they were?" ....I said, sure do, your the guy still looking for a builder, as I'm not interested. Felt good too. :D
 
Great stuff Allen - I think when that happens "Let's double the charge and see where this goes...." if they take it thenn you are being paid for the hassle and if it gets worse I take a 50% non-returnable deposit!
 
The best time you can ever spend in the shop is in the time you spend researching your customers. They do it to you. They know everything about you before their first contact. Find out about them. That's what the Internet is for. My first few emails are always "conversational" before even discussing the details. You can talk about anything you want, it doesn't matter. Just like going out on a date (for those of you who can remember back that far), you're just trying to establish whether or not you are compatible. Be selective!
 
You wouldn't believe some of the stuff a few of my clients obsess over. Several times a year I wind up ranting and swearing in my office wishing that more real musicians and fewer anal-compulsive collectors were interested in my work. Whether is the type of plating on the tuners, a tuner being maybe crooked by .020" of an inch, a slight anomaly in the grain of the wood, or... And I never get them complaining about sound or playability. Good thing my assistant Eliza doesn't mind four letter words. I make musical tools. They're good ones and they're well made, but some folks have expectations that are just more about art objects than about musical instruments. And the ones who complain are the worst musicians...

On the other hand, my best clients are the ones who trust me to take designs beyond where I've gone before and who appreciate being a part of that journey.
 
Having recently been flamed by a customer I turned loose, I will be a lot more diligent in the future in choosing who I build for.

Brad
 
Brad, I know the truth and that's all that matters to me. I suspect that many others feel the same.

Cheers,
David
 
Bradford said:
Having recently been flamed by a customer I turned loose, I will be a lot more diligent in the future in choosing who I build for.

Brad
Click to expand...

I think that "flaming" on the UU boards, did more FOR your reputation than dozens of positive testimonials could. I've never dealt with you, but you're now on the short list of builders I'd want to purchase from (in my next life when I have both talent and money to afford many customs). :)

-Gary
 
I'd like to think that when I buy my first custom ukulele, I will be an easy customer. I'll choose my woods and let the luthier do what they do best. Seems to me that piling on a bunch of crazy requests or nitpicking will result in a not so great ukulele- or no ukulele.
 
Bradford said:
Having recently been flamed by a customer I turned loose, I will be a lot more diligent in the future in choosing who I build for.

Brad
Click to expand...

That thread should be a reverse intent, basically, how to NOT be a potential client. I absolutely love how you responded. I pray none of us have to go through that, but all of us get the positive results. I agree, your response did more for your rep than anything else.

Aaron
 
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