Fretboard Spacing

Hello all! I'm new to the forum and am about to embark on my first build. Just so you know a little more about me I have been making primitive longbows for about six years so that is the extent of my wood working experience and my first build will be using laminated veneers.

I think I have a decent understanding of the build process but one thing I don't quite have a grasp on is scale length and determining fret spacing and all that jazz. I feel as though this is vitally important to having the instrument and all the notes be in tune so I want to make sure I get it right. I've seen a site that calculates all the fret spacing for you but I wanted to get some more info as I'm not quite sure if I know how to use it correctly. How does one calculate fret spacing and how does it fit into the distance between the nut and saddle?

Hi. I know that others will give much better answers, but here are some basics...

The distance between the front edge of the nut (against the fretboard) to the point on the saddle where the strings make contact is the scale length. It is the active length of the string. Your twelfth fret will lie at the midpoint. Theoretically. But the strings stretch when you push them down to the fretboard, making them a little longer. So while the scale length is what it is, to place the bridge you can measure from the nut to the twelfth fret, then go that distance away from the twelfth fret and add a little to compensate for the stretch of the strings, and that is the location of your saddle.

Hopefully that (and I'm others will and should add to and refine this) will give you a general sense when approaching a fret calculator. I don't know the math involved in determining fret position, but it is always going to be relative to the scale length.

Alternatively, there are pre-slotted fretboards out there. And templates if you want to slot your own but don't want to figure it out. If you go either of these roads, the template or board you buy will determine your scale length.

But you're right a out getting the fret positions right - if you don't get that right then little else is going to matter.

Here is a sweet link... It is a customized Google search page that will search only this site to find previous threads on fret spacing, or whatever you want - it is better than the in-site search bar
http://www.google.co.uk/cse/m?cx=006086160372685481724:y43bmh-bwgc&cref=&theme=ESPRESSO

Nut to saddle = scale length + compensation.

Scale length = nut to 12th fret x 2.

Compensation depends on string type, action, playing style etc. For tenors I go about 3mm. You've got the thickness of the saddle for some adjustment after the fact.

Fret spacings are measured either each from the nut or; from fret to fret, starting at the nut. IIRC the stew mac fret calculator gives you both sets of measurements.

Thanks for the info. That definitely clears up some things. Is there a way to measure the proper amount of compensation?

The compensation is added because it accounts for a string stretching longer. A search of old threads would really give you a lot of facts and different ways of explaining this - examples, too.

ryoon4690 said:

Thanks for the info. That definitely clears up some things. Is there a way to measure the proper amount of compensation?

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There may be something in Trevor Gore or David Hurd's stuff but for the majority of us the answer is no.

I remember being all worried about it when I started. It was always a bigger problem in my head than in the real world (like so many newbie issue tend to be).

The proper amount of compensation is dependant on quite a few factors. Scale length, string type, action, playing style, phase of the moon, if your having meat loaf on Sunday.....well, you get the idea.

Use StewMacs fret spacing calculator and go by it diligently. Then if something isn't quite right to your ears, you will have some room to play with at the saddle end. If you botched it up more than that, build another.

Thanks for the info guys. I'll probably add just a little bit of compensation while calculating the fret spacing. One last question for now. How do you guys accurately measure the spacing on the board? I'm thinking there must be a way to print it out so the computer does it for you with nice clean lines but I guess I lack the knowledge to figure out how to do that on my own.

I'm not a builder so I'm a little reluctant to answer anything here but your compensating the saddle position only. Not the fret positions. Fret positions are measured to 3 decimal places(thousandth of a mm). You probably should place them to at least 2 decimal places of accuracy(hundredth of a mm). Maybe more?

My two bobs worth is unless your setup for cutting fret slots and know exactly what your doing then don't take it on unless its just an experiment. Buy a pre made or pre slotted finger board. Then your just talking about placing the nut accurately and compensating the bridge accurately.

Anthony

There is a freeware program called wfret that will calculate and print out a template for fret spacing. I've used it on many builds but I'm an amateur.

for the amount of time that I would spend measuring and checking the precision, if I were 'freehand' cutting fret slots , a template pays for itself in one shot

ryoon4690 said:

Hello all! I'm new to the forum and am about to embark on my first build. Just so you know a little more about me I have been making primitive longbows for about six years so that is the extent of my wood working experience and my first build will be using laminated veneers.

I think I have a decent understanding of the build process but one thing I don't quite have a grasp on is scale length and determining fret spacing and all that jazz. I feel as though this is vitally important to having the instrument and all the notes be in tune so I want to make sure I get it right. I've seen a site that calculates all the fret spacing for you but I wanted to get some more info as I'm not quite sure if I know how to use it correctly. How does one calculate fret spacing and how does it fit into the distance between the nut and saddle?

Click to expand...

You need to understand much more than just the compensation issue when building ukes. Perhaps it might not be a bad idea to get some good books or get into a building class before you proceed.

Liam Ryan said:

There may be something in Trevor Gore or David Hurd's stuff but for the majority of us the answer is no.

I remember being all worried about it when I started. It was always a bigger problem in my head than in the real world (like so many newbie issue tend to be).

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Trevor compensates his nuts (so to speak) and saddles, rather then just have a 3-4 degree slant to the saddle (this is for guitars). There is a formula somewhere in the books.
ABOUT
2mm tenor
3mm concert
4mm soprano
String brand and action height play a part in it all.
Use David Hurd's string compensation checker jig or two nails, a 12th fret and a fake saddle

just buy the metal stewmac fretting template. if you get the - i think it is the Fender guitar scale template, you can make from that all the uke fingerboards, depending on which fret you start on.

Beau Hannam Ukuleles said:

just buy the metal stewmac fretting template. if you get the - i think it is the Fender guitar scale template, you can make from that all the uke fingerboards, depending on which fret you start on.

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I use the Fender 25.5

Moore Bettah Ukuleles said:

I use the Fender 25.5

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Hmm, that 25.5" scale "could" be used for Soprano, Concert, Tenor, and Baritone. It would require carefully calculating and adding 4 notches to get enough frets for all sizes. But, based on my loose calculations, you could get a 13.58" Soprano, a 15.22" Concert, 17.07" Tenor, and a 19.14 and/or 20.27" Baritone. Fairly economical.?

Moore Bettah Ukuleles said:

I use the Fender 25.5

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Aloha Chuck from wet and cold Wahiawa Oahu..wow you get up early like me..I can not wait to start my days..I practice at 530am..but gots to sleep early..I getting old

what time do you start in your shop?
I hope not to much more rain..did you make it through all the rain ok?

have fun with your work today..

If all you are doing is one or two instruments, then a good ruler, and sharp pencil is all you require. It's how I did my first 3 or 4 guitars and then I bought a fret marking ruler so I didn't have to do the math. Now I use custom made fretting templates for each of my scale lengths.

Be sure to measure from nut to fret for the entire length. NOT FRET TO FRET.

Reason is that if you get one measurement off in fret to fret then all the rest are off too.

anthonyg said:

I'm not a builder.................You probably should place them to at least 2 decimal places of accuracy(hundredth of a mm). Maybe more?

Anthony

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Man that's funny. What does one hundredth of a mm look like? Try hand slotting a board then let us know how accurate you think you could be. I'd say 1/100th of an inch (0.25mm) would be ambitious.

Liam Ryan said:

Man that's funny. What does one hundredth of a mm look like? Try hand slotting a board then let us know how accurate you think you could be. I'd say 1/100th of an inch (0.25mm) would be ambitious.

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Yes I wrote that and thought there was no way you could do it by hand. Still, I measure my fretboards to 0.10mm for accuracy. The OP wanted to be accurate.

Anthony