Quick finish?

As you all know I run build courses here in the UK. Helen, my wife has retired from being a coastal paths officer (her section was the Chepstow to Newport path - Google it) and is now behind all the admin at Pete Howlett Ukulele. We will be running 5 day residential tenor courses over the winter with the possibility of 3 days courses building paddle ukulele. The usual problem is getting a durable finish on the ukulele in the short time you have to cover building and set-up. Essentially, I am looking for an -other-than-Tru-Oil finish or Shellac. Thinking outside the box, I came a cross this product here in the UK: http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=30835. I know you will all think I am nuts but for those who have experimented with other substances (unsmokebale and non snortable that is).... anyone used this stuff or something like it to finish a uke? Coating and drying time has to be 1 1/2 days.

hmm I might give it a try, i tried truoil and 2-3 weeks applying plus another 2-3 weeks curing time is too time consuming for a nice finish.

About 40 years ago I was introduced to a wipe on oil based finish at my local DIY/Joinery shop..I used it on the neck of my home made bass guitar..I used this bass guitar in a professional band six nights a week for over five years...I still have it and still play it now and again...The finish is still ok and not worn thro'..I can't remember the name of the product but it has to based on the modern stuff.

For a satin finish, three coats of lacquer vinyl sealer. Applied in the morning and it can be handles in the afternoon. Done.
I've never done this but our mutual friend has.

most lacquer sanding sealer is too soft, which is why it is a 'sanding sealer', it is not meant to be hard. straight up lacquer can be used to that effect. And if you only use 2 or 3 coats, depending on technique, and the product, you can get away with an open pored finish, out of the gun. Students with spray guns sounds like herding cats though, and you finishing all their work is not exactly right.. A single coat of a faster drying oil, like Daly's 'ProFin' , over very well sanded wood, maybe to 1000 with zero scratches, that will yield a very decent looking finish that will give some protection. It needs to be handled delicately at 1.5 days though, as it will fingerprint. The students can then choose to carefully put another coat on later, if they are confident, or, a little paste wax like Liberon, or Renaissance, that will give a little extra mileage. Any surface building finishes that are not sprayed, that will be thick enough at 1.5 days, will most likely have applicator marks, with the exception of cases of very skillful application of something like shellac. Shellac would probably be my second choice of finishes to get a decent 1.5 day finish. Water poly will be dry, and can be very thick in 1.5 days, but there will be applicator marks, and maybe other problems. I think there is potential in a waterborne for a 1.5 day finish. My favorite waterborne is 'Enduro', which is probably not available in the UK, as it is a professional product here in the US, not in paint stores, as far as I know.
Maybe a couple thin coats of shellac, rubbed down, and then a couple applications of paste wax the next day. Careful prep beforehand.

Just some thoughts..

Chris:

Interesting that you bring up ProFin just now. I've got tests going on with the satin on cherry, Alaska yellow cedar and myrtle. All were sanded to 600, and the finish has been wiped on with very thin coats in much the same way as I would use Tru-oil. After 3 coats, with very light sanding in between, it looks very good. The "pop" is impressive, especially on the figured myrtle. I've been waiting at least a day between coats since I haven't been in a hurry but it seems like it would be possible to do two in a day. RH here has been 40 to 50, which is a factor.

I did all the finishing for a woodworker friend who did large corporate projects, as well as fine woodworking, one of his 'goto' finishes was Profin. I know that finish very well. Try sanding to 1000 before the first coat, or higher if you dare! (try it!) No scratches allowed.. It is worth waiting a day between coats, you will get better build, even 2 days if you have the time. Profin is a good finish, but with Rosewoods, Ebonies, various other woods, it is slow to dry, and will fingerprint for some time. ( a couple, to a few weeks) With Koa, Maple, Myrtle, Cherry, Cedar, it will dry quickly. Also, if you, say, finish sand with Abralon, to 500, or 1000, apply your finish, notice spots or fingerprints on it later on, you can remove them easily, clean up the finish again, by using a worn down piece of the same pad.

for any really fine piece, IMO, 600 grit is just getting started for an oil finish.

Not available in the UK.

Pete Howlett said:

Not available in the UK.

Click to expand...

Too bad.

Thanks for the info, Chris.

Hijack over and out.

Pete, there is probably a comparable product in the UK. It is basically a hard drying oil, and fast drying, which is why they call it 'ProFin'. It is like a Teak oil with slightly higher solids, and a little more drier.

What about 2 or 3 coats of shellac, giving a little intro/ info on FP, and then wax it? with instructions to brighten the finish back up with a little paste wax if desired? Shellac and wax is a nice finish, though I do not have enough experience with how it ages with handling like with an instrument. I think you could have a beautiful, and cured enough finish in 1.5 days, to send the little uke packing. True, it is not an ideal finish.


From people who have more experience with shellac and wax as a finish than I, bad idea? ok idea? why?

What we just finished doing in this last uke building class was a brush on shellac finish. In the scheme of things, the products are about as safe as you are ever going to find, quite inexpensive, readily available just about anywhere in the world. Have a very long track record of being a successful instrument finish, and one that can be repaired with minimal effort.

We gave each of the students a very nice squirrel hair mop with a thin mix of waxy blonde shellac. They got a lesson on how to apply it. "Not like painting a barn" and without an exception, everyone took to the process like ducks to water.

4 - 5 thin coats brushed on with 5 - 10 minutes between coats. Let sit for a couple of hours and then a very light tickle with P400 grit paper, and then a couple more thin coats. By now there is most certainly a finish that is sitting up on the wood. Hang to dry over night.

The next day we used some P800 dry to just barely tickle the finish and then an ultra fine foam sanding sponge for any of the edges etc that we didn't want them to cut through on. A touch of wax and a burnish was all it took to get them to look better than any one of them would have believed. Certainly better than any oil finish with that little amount of work involved.

The best part is that the students applied the finish themselves. Learnt it wasn't difficult. Could easily repeat the steps unsupervised and get set up with minimal cost. And several had projects at home that they were struggling with finishing and that were now going to get a similar treatment on.

We also went through the processes to show how you could get a really high shine with just more time and effort. I had an instrument exactly like the one they just built but that I put rope binding on and a much more filled and glossy shellac finish that they could see was possible with only a bit more time invested. All really invaluable parts to a build course I think.

Great replies Chris and Allen ( sounds likke a law firm) .... I'll experimet.

This stuff is AMAZING. Truly, ridiculously easy to spray on and not run or bloom or in any way ruin. Seriously. We get students to use it, mostly school kids who have left their major work till the last month...,

This stuff can be sprayed in one day and handled strung up the same afternoon. We sell it for $15 a can I think.

The pics show a Uke sized same I show to people who want a quick finish. This tasty black wood is straight off the big sander with 80 grit scratches. It has 2 coats of the can on it.

Cedar top, cherry back on a finished guitar

Sorry Beau but totally useless. I live and work in the UK. Come and visit sometimes and go to the local equivalent of your hardware store if you can find one and see how badly served we are here. I often read with saddening envy the stories of those who begin, "I went to the local store...." and then go on to describe the purchase of materials or products that are great for luthiers but completely unavailable anywhere here in the UK. My nearest finishing suppliers are 4 hours away and if I want to look at exotic timber I have a 5 hour drive 'by appointment only'.

I also want a fool-proof finish - one that even the Klutziest person can do. Spray-can spraying is as much a skill as using a gun or fadding on French polish with a rubber....

Here you go geezer

Seriously, anyone could use this stuff. Even an un PC Australian. Try a can for 12 quid. One can will do a uke. Ill buy it for you, send it to you (free shipping!!!!!!!!!!!) and you can pay me back double when you realise how easy and good it is.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Wurth-Lac..._Body_Shop_Supplies_Paint&hash=item35c94ad5d2


Others here
http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_t...er.TRS0&_nkw=wurth+lacquer&_sacat=0&_from=R40

i forgot to mention its most enduring property- the Matt (the only one ive used) is self flattening. Ive not had to cut it back. I lay the uke/guitar on its back and spray the top and let it be for 30mins or so till hard enough not to move when i do one of the sides. Then do the back and the other side. Repeat same day then its done.

Also, dont worry about spray technique as you dont need any. Just like fly spray and it all morphs into itself, just vaguely cover/wet all wood.

The first time i used it it went on looking white but it is just matting agent or something and it all disappears into clear. I can do a vid tomorrow if you want.

You could also spray it in your back yard, which is a bonus.

I will try it - thanks! However this would be good for one-on-one students where I could use my spray shop. Courses are slatted for winter here in the UK where 'winter' actually means close to freezing, dull and wet!

We find this product soooo easy that we sell a student with no spray/finish experience 3 cans of it to spray their whole guitar at home and save themselves the $150 we charge for a day of tuition. Probably only need 2 cans for a thin finish.

It is also seems to have no witness lines so you can touch stuff up in the middle of a back without any worries. We do matt touch ups with it on factory guitars sometimes for tighter customers.

I think it might be magical too