Fixing Up East-Start Archtop

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katysax

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We've got a couple of threads going about these ukes, but they contain a lot of scattered info. This thread is specifically for issues related to either upgraded or fixing these ukes. For example if you find a part that works or a string that works or have some tips for intonation, please share.

My plan is to use this tailpiece http://tinyurl.com/l4wj8ex in place of the six string tailpiece mine came with. I'd like to find a bridge to replace the six string bridge with the extra notches.
 
Here's a couple of posts from the other thread:

That's the tailpiece I found, got it in like two days. Had to use the original hinge part; I removed the entire tailpiece assembly, then pried apart the lip of the hinge that holds the scroll section, then swapped to the 4 string scroll section. The strings seat even though it's for a bass guitar (little awkward holding the end of the string in there while using a drill to tighten the tuner): http://www.amazon.com/Chrome-String-.../dp/B00ALQRLL4

This place in Arizona has the ebony bridges for $12.99. http://www.themandolinstore.com/scripts/prodView.asp?idproduct=7534

This video shows how to install it:
 
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More from the other thread:

bigphil said:
Taking the nut slots down helped the intonation immensely, if you don't have the capability of doing that yourself you will NEED to get someone to do that for you. Mine was unplayable before that. The furnished bridge will work fine it just looks weird. You will need to cut the studs off too or they will poke you when playing after adjusting the bridge lower. When adjusting the bridge height hold those studs so the don't screw down tightly as Mike mentioned otherwise it will mar the top. There are screwdriver slots in the studs for this purpose.
Click to expand...


anthonyg said:
My experience when using guitar strings on my steel string ukulele is that the best ones to pick are the D, G, B, E strings (lightest 4 strings) from a regular 10-46 (standard) set. That's where to start anyway. Using much heavier bass strings, such as using the middle 4 is going to lead to intonation problems because heavier strings need more compensation at the saddle to get them to intonate and as far as I can see there is NO intonation adjustment at the saddle. I recommend keeping the strings light to start with. Anthony
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bigphil said:
Well I've been working on mine a good bit today. Took off the strings and bridge, this is defiantly not just marks filed in the saddle piece, you can see both the 6 & 4 string spacing on the inside of the casting as well, so it was purpose made for both configurations. I polished off all the crappy buff marks with automotive swirl mark remover by just buffing by hand. I then smoothed all the rough fret ends and smoothed the fret surfaces with 320, 400, 600 paper and finished them up with 0000 steel wool. I also used the same paper grits to remove the glue and scratches on the fret board and oiled that. Finally I took the action at the nut DOWN close and the intonation is now pretty good. I haven't checked it against the tuner but I can now get it tuned so all chords sound sweet. I still need to trim the mounting studs for the saddle because they poke me while playing. I'm getting happier all the time. Sounds sweet on the amp too! I'm not real crazy about the strings on it though, they just feel weird. Maybe I've been playing nylon too long and it's just the feel of steel. I'm going to change them tomorrow in any case, stay tuned for updates.
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Skinny Money McGee said:
The intonation on mine is very good too. I marked the studs with a sharpie, took the bridge off, dremeled it & smoothed it. (took all of 5 minutes). Now flush with bridge and smooth. (painters tape over sound holes to keep metal dust out)
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RichM said:
Hmmm... it seems that if you wanted to repurpose a floating mandolin bridge, you could either drill holes in the base to match the resulting screw holes in the top (although the narrower mandolin bridge might not have enough width to do that effectively. Or, you could just plug the holes and let the bridge float. As I think another poster observed, a mandolin bridge is probably going to be much taller than the current bridge, so some sanding will be in order.
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Good call on the new fix-it thread Katy.

This is the tailpiece I ordered from Amazon. Same thing except plain. I thought it would be nice to see the wood under the tailpiece. They did use a nice flamed maple on these ukes. I'm keeping the bridge for now, however may make a new one out of a block of ebony and build in some compensation. If I do, I'll post it here.
 

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Phil. The string tension table is great. One thing though. The Risa has adjustable saddle pieces. Ours don't. I think they need them but that's a future job. Right now we want the best available intonation without adjusting the saddle which is a TALL order. I would start with light strings because light strings need less allowance for intonation. Heavier strings need more allowance for intonation. Intonation going sharp means you want more compensation at the saddle. Intonation going flat means you want less compensation at the saddle. Thicker strings don't vibrate as per theory and thick steel strings are worse in this regard than thick nylon strings.

Somebody please fit the lightest 4 strings from a 10 -46 set and see how it is. This can be a benchmark.

Anthony
 
In my opinion, getting the action down at the nut and smoothing up the frets are the two biggest issues. I suppose each nut will be uniquely slotted but unless the action is pretty low your intonation, especially for the first 3 or 4 frets will be way sharp. The frets seemed to have been finished with sandpaper running parallel to the strings. This leaves scratches that "grab" the strings when doing bends, feels terrible.

I also restrung mine with the middle strings from an Ernie Ball Super Slinky guitar set. Strings on mine as furnished were .012 .016 .025 & .032. Starting with the second string in the Slinky set they are .011 .016 .024 & .032. I like the sound of these better but even though Risa apparently considers this a "thin" set, they are still not like the slinky set on a guitar. I think I'm going to try again with the slinky set and start with the first string which will give .009 .011 .016 & .024. Bonus in my opinion is only one wound string then too!
 
kohanmike said:
I like that idea Bruce, http://www.amazon.com/Chrome-Guitar...5603&sr=8-2&keywords=short+tailpiece+4+string.
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I just realized something, using that open tailpiece makes it easier to change strings by being able to hold the stop on the string in the slot under the plate. The scroll piece on the other prevents that. I just put in an order.

Open tailpiece 250.jpg
4 string tailpiece 250.jpg
 
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If you're changing a string on a tailpiece that is slotted, rather then a pass-through hole, a small piece of BluTack will hold the ball-end in place while you use two hands to thread the string at the tuner.

For anyone who hasn't changed steel strings before, pull the string through the hole in the tuner until tight, grab a point about an inch to an inch and a half past the tuner, depending on string gauge, and pull the string back through to that point before putting a 90° bend in the string. Put one turn on over the hole and the rest under. This will help grip the string.

Just to help illustrate, here's the headstock on my Ibanez. You'll notice that I haven't followed my own advice on the 90° bend. That's because I have a locking nut, so it isn't necessary.

head.jpg
 
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The Big Kahuna said:
If you're changing a string on a tailpiece that is slotted, rather then a pass-through hole, a small piece of BluTack will hold the ball-end in place while you use two hands to thread the string at the tuner.

For anyone who hasn't changed steel strings before, pull the string through the hole in the tuner until tight, grab a point about an inch to an inch to an and a half past the tuner, depending on string gauge, and pull the string back through to that point before putting a 90° bend in the string. Put one turn on over the hole and the rest under. This will help grip the string.
Click to expand...

That's the ticket, good advice. Still like the idea of no scroll piece in there, now I'll have a choice.
 
anthonyg said:
Phil. The string tension table is great. One thing though. The Risa has adjustable saddle pieces. Ours don't. I think they need them but that's a future job. Right now we want the best available intonation without adjusting the saddle which is a TALL order. I would start with light strings because light strings need less allowance for intonation. Heavier strings need more allowance for intonation. Intonation going sharp means you want more compensation at the saddle. Intonation going flat means you want less compensation at the saddle. Thicker strings don't vibrate as per theory and thick steel strings are worse in this regard than thick nylon strings.

Somebody please fit the lightest 4 strings from a 10 -46 set and see how it is. This can be a benchmark.

Anthony
Click to expand...

I've posted the string info elsewhere. I deleted this one as it is not East Start arch top uke appropriate. Sorry

Phil
 
I finally got a chance today to give my uke a good inspection. Here are my thoughts:

I'm actually very pleased with the construction of the uke, considering it's price tag. There are no major flaws and it looks better than I thought it would. I was also happy with the electronics. The pickup height needs tweaking and the strings suck, but it still sounded decent. Everything worked and it was very quiet. No hums or buzzes.

End of praise.

I ordered the model with the one piece bridge and was very disappointed when I saw the trapeze bridge/tail setup. I am no fan of the trapeze tail to begin with and when I saw the screwed up way it was installed and the strings slewing off on an angle my disappointment turned into disgust.

I pulled the tail off today and discovered two problems. First, they mounted the tail slightly off center. Second, the u-shaped rod was severely bent out of shape. Both ends were bent off center and at different angles. This was the major problem with the string alignment. I spent a few minutes with a pair of pliers and gave it some cursory adjustments. This made a huge difference. It still isn't perfect, but at least it's usable for now. Some of you may want to examine yours closely for similar problems. I would like to eventually replace it with a one piece bridge/tailpiece, but that will wait for another day. As for the multi-purpose bridge, again, it is usable....but it's a piece of crap. I know some of you are planning on replacing the bridge. Please be aware there is a ground wire underneath it. Make sure your new bridge gets grounded to this wire or you will get alot of unwanted noises.

The nut, as others have noted, is less than perfect. The slots are too shallow and it's slightly wider than the neck. I spent time this past year or so learning the art of cutting a nut. I've made half a dozen or so for some of my guitars and two of my ukes. So replacing this one with a new bone nut is a no-brainer.

And finally, the frets are in bad shape. They desperately need to be leveled. This is something I have been wanting to learn how to do anyway. All my guitars could stand a leveling and this uke will never play correctly without it being done so I figure it's time to make that plunge. The only problem I foresee is that the treble side of my 1st fret is setting VERY low. I'm not sure why, slot cut to deep, pounded down to hard or what. I'm not sure if a leveling will help that problem. It may end up needing to be replaced but I will address that issue when I get there, I suppose.

And finally, I know many of you have already swapped out strings or plan to soon, but I still want to urge EVERYONE to replace the strings ASAP. Not only will quality strings sound better, but they will be easier on your frets.
 
Skinny Money McGee said:
There are several sellers on ebay selling the open tailpiece, from, dare I say, China?

Go on ebay and search "bass trapeze tailpiece"

Never done business with these guys, but they have them too.
http://www.guitarpartsresource.com/bass_tailpieces.htm
Click to expand...

The reason I didn't order from Ebay is that you never know how long it will take to get stuff from China. I'm kind of eager to fix mine up, and I don't want to have an unknown shipping wait. However, maybe I'll get one of the plain ones and replace the scrolled one when it comes.
 
Wagster said:
I know some of you are planning on replacing the bridge. Please be aware there is a ground wire underneath it. Make sure your new bridge gets grounded to this wire or you will get a lot of unwanted noises.
Click to expand...

Major necessary info, the bridge I ordered is all ebony so I don't see how that will work with a ground wire. Have to rethink the bridge now, the last thing I want is humm in the amp.

Skinny Money McGee said:
There are several sellers on ebay selling the open tailpiece, from, dare I say, China? Go on ebay and search "bass trapeze tailpiece" Never done business with these guys, but they have them too. http://www.guitarpartsresource.com/bass_tailpieces.htm
Click to expand...

That's what I was going to suggest, I did find others on amazon and eBay, but most were directly from China, just to add, I've had lots of success ordering from China, but it is a wait sometimes.
 
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kohanmike said:
Major necessary info, the bridge I ordered is all ebony so I don't see how that will work with a ground wire. Have to rethink the bridge now, the last thing I want is humm in the amp.
Click to expand...

Mike, the purpose of the wire is to give the strings a ground. Ungrounded strings are not only noisy but you don't want to be a surrogate ground should your amp short out and dump some serious voltage into your patch cord!

If you want to go with a wooden bridge, one option would be to put the wire under the tail piece mounting plate. This would require drilling a small hole for it and possibly splicing the wire to make it long enough. It may be a somewhat tedious task, but certainly do-able if that's the direction you want to go.
 
This came from wofchs:

"I saw a chrome bridge on eBay for a cigar box uke or electric ukulele, is that a "fixed bridge" and would not require the tailpiece? I'm really new in this adventure of having a fixer-upper.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/190829437766?redirect=mobile"
 
I'm not sure there would be an easy way to get the flat base of that bridge to fit the arched top of the ukes...
 
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