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srpompon
07-30-2014, 12:59 PM
Looking at the works of art from DeVine, spend much time trying to understand how the strings were tied to the bridge.

69534

few hours after I saw this picture on facebook

69535

This type of bridge is good?

thanks!

Ivan

RichM
07-30-2014, 01:06 PM
I see more builders using this type of bridge. They are pretty easy to string, once you get used to them. And I am told they pretty much eliminate "bridge pop," which I thought was mythical until it happened to me!

CeeJay
07-30-2014, 01:37 PM
Looks like an absolute faff to me.......and if strings are pulling bridges off ukuleles then I strongly suspect that they cant have been well glued on in the first place !!

It looks like a "through the body" system that works on electric solid body guitars like fender strats and variax 700s where you feed in from the back and up the neck...........but to do it on an acoustic ....no thanks ...too much faffing about...... thread through...fish it out ...tie it onto the "bead"......pull it back ...oh I did not knot the knot tightly enough and now ...no .....looks neat and tidy ...but no.....I would give this bridge a wide berth......

FrankB
07-30-2014, 01:46 PM
There are all sorts of benefits to that type of bridge, Rich mentioned a very important one. Others have said the string tension is transmitted to the soundboard more directly this way. Alvarez-Yairi steel string guitars have a neat system in which the bridge and string hold down are separate. In the picture below, the string pins go into a plate that is much larger inside the guitar than would appear from outside. No pulling on the bridge, and a most direct connection to the soundboard.
Alvarez-Yairi:
69536

As you can see, the break angle is quite steep in the picture, due to the strings going directly into the soundboard. A similar effect occurs with the through bridge string.

PhilUSAFRet
07-30-2014, 01:49 PM
I think it's a superior system, as evidenced by the fact it's on a Devine uke. I"ve seen some discussion that suggests it transmits string vibrations more efficiently to the soundboard than some setups. Our luthiers would have more insight into that.

CeeJay
07-30-2014, 02:06 PM
There are all sorts of benefits to that type of bridge, Rich mentioned a very important one. Others have said the string tension is transmitted to the soundboard more directly this way. Alvarez-Yairi steel string guitars have a neat system in which the bridge and string hold down are separate. In the picture below, the string pins go into a plate that is much larger inside the guitar than would appear from outside. No pulling on the bridge, and a most direct connection to the soundboard.
Alvarez-Yairi:
69536

Frank, the picture that you show of an acoustic guitar looks like a system that I am familiar with and have no problem with....and use regularly. The end bead of the string goes into the hole and the pin holds it in place ?...or am I misunderstanding.....oh I see on re-inspection that the strings are held in place away from the bridge and into the soundboard direct....okay ...but you are still putting the strings in the "right" way if you get my drift.

My problem with the system in the OPs photo is that you have to first of all retrieve the "bead" from the broken string....then thread your new string through the hole and fish it out the soundhole.....if you don't have long slinky fingers (guilty as charged :o ) this could be a problem ...plus if you have broken only one string you have to get it out between the other strings...tie on the bead ..thing...whatever it is called....if you haven't pulled the new string all the way through by mistake or the Ukulele Gods have decided that is what shall happen......it's my problem that's all ..I'm not condemning the system ...I would prefer the peg system or through the bridge..that's all......and I still stand by my sentiment that if a uke string tension can pull it's bridge off then it was not built fit for purpose..........or someone is seriiiiiiously rocking out ....;)

mketom
07-30-2014, 02:18 PM
Changing strings on a through-the-bridge type bridge is not really as difficult or problematic as described above. IMO...

CeeJay
07-30-2014, 02:44 PM
Changing strings on a through-the-bridge type bridge is not really as difficult or problematic as described above. IMO...

Well please enlighten me then :confused:, because I seem to be getting it wrong in my head ........you must have to thread the string in from above ...? ....oh ...hang on.....I only play Soprano and Concert.......so I'm looking at this from the perspective of the smaller dimension......but I still don't like the potential fiddliness of it ...:D....ummm that is allowed isn't it ?

...and in the UK the chances of it ever getting so hot that the glue on the bridge will melt is minimal...not happened yet

see here for an earlier discussion btw http://forum.ukuleleunderground.com/archive/index.php/t-33070.html

ericchico
07-30-2014, 04:59 PM
It takes pressure off the bridge. I really like it. Spin the string until it lines up with the hole and fish it with your index and middle finger. I can see it not being for everyone though.

coolkayaker1
07-30-2014, 08:03 PM
Changing strings on a through-the-bridge type bridge is not really as difficult or problematic as described above. IMO...
Agree. Peter Hurney describes it here. People trying to envision it often forget the package curl of the strings.

http://www.pohakuukulele.com/pages/t_pinless.html

I have owned three ukes with this design, no problem changing strings. No claw fingers required, never needed a wire to remove the old ones, either. One caution in installation based on my experience: The bead should be knotted with care. Why? If a big knot hits the soundboard rather than the bead itself, i.e. the knot is between the bead and the soundboard, the bead will buzz on the soundboard when it vibrates. This can occur if one ties the bead to the string without thinking where the knot will be. To avoid this, I always used beads that had a hole completely through and tied the knot on the far end, away from the part of the bead that will contact the underside of the soundboard.

One could just use a knot with no bead, but it's often hard to get it large enough, and even enough in form, not to potentially pull through the soundboard (that's a guess, I never tried knots alone for several years to know; perhaps it would be fine). Knots made from repeated ties tend to be long and thin knots, and the contact portion of the knot, especially on thinner A and high G strings, can be hard to get large enough; I like the large footprint of the bead, as does Eric DeVine, it seems.

Biggest advantage besides no bridge popping--no soundboard dishing, sometimes called bellying. The force pulls up on the soundboard more evenly through the bridge; other tie designs pull the front of the bridge downward more than a string-through design, sometimes causing dishing.

kohanmike
07-30-2014, 09:11 PM
I just converted my Lanikai to this kind of string method, works great, easy enough to do. I actually think it's a brilliant idea, instead of the tension pulling the bridge horizontal across the top, the tension pulls the bridge and the top together. Makes total sense to me. There was a discussion about this a couple of weeks ago, here are the steps I posted to make the conversion.

http://www.fairfax67.com/images/Bridge string thru.jpg

coolkayaker1
07-30-2014, 09:26 PM
That's cool, Mike. One-sixteenth drill bit...I'll have to remember that.

Oldpharte converted a knotted bridge (as opposed to a tie bridge, like Mike's) in 2013 and had quite a nice thread and pictorials. That took some finesse to drill into the knotted string slot without hitting the slot and making the mod look terrible. I forget his bit size, but think it was smaller still to fit in those teensy slots, like on Martins. Good stuff all.

ukantor
07-30-2014, 10:18 PM
I've used this method on a couple of my home built ukes. It is very easy to fit or change strings, no problems at all. A bit of bent wire helps to fish the strings out through the sound hole, then it's all plain sailing. In my not very humble opinion there are several compelling advantages - and no disadvantages.

John Colter.

dhoenisch
07-31-2014, 02:49 AM
I did the same style of bridge for my mom's uke. I had always heard of bridges popping off of cedar, so the string though bridge seemed like the best style of bridge to use. Also, I don't use beads or anything. Knots in the strings is good enough. Of course, I made the bridge plate of Maple, so there is less of a chance of the string knots widening the holes at all.
http://i118.photobucket.com/albums/o92/dhoenisch/Musical%20Instruments/DSCN0177_zps16560eeb.jpg

Dan

CeeJay
07-31-2014, 04:52 AM
Bradford
07-17-2010, 03:27 AM
Hey Mike, I'm glad you clarified your intent. Most luthier glues are designed to release with heat. With a string through bridge in a hot car, the strings may not pull the bridge off the top, they will pull the top away from the sides instead, or pull the neck away from the body. Solid wood or laminate, they are still glued together and that glue will start to fail at 130 degrees F or so. Hide glue may be OK to about 150, but I would not risk it with any uke of value.

Brad

Moore Bettah Ukuleles
07-17-2010, 04:17 AM
You're exactly right Brad. A bridge is meant to be a sacrificial component in the event of exposure to high temperatures.

Two previous entries from a discussion about this that took place four years ago...just to put another angle on the subject.....

But as ever I seem to be the lone voice of argued dissent :rolleyes:....I don't like straps either...

and as for better tone quality ...surely the tone comes through the saddle (I will stand to be corrected on this) or "bridge" (banjo uke) what happens after that is pretty much immaterial ? the strings on a banjo uke very often don't have any connection to the "soundboard" ...or vellum at all..except via the wooden bridge or saddle ..no ...yes ?

..all this is in the interest of a fair and balanced discussion ...not me saying I hate the system.....even if I do not like the stringing method as described (hook it out with a coat hanger and a vacuum cleaner ...the curve SHOULD make it pop up through the soundhole......shoulda ,woulda ,coulda.......seems a bit vague to
me....) But it does look neat and tidy.

coolkayaker1
07-31-2014, 04:56 AM
I've read many, many threads about bridges pulling off in room temperature--many, many, many--but never read one about a guy that left a uke in a hundred and thirty degree automobile. As I live in room temperature and would never leave my uke in a car at 130F, I suppose I'm good with the "safety valve" of making sure the bridge stays on by using a string-through design in my personal micro-environment: room temperature. :eek:

Your post reminded me about this video regarding lifetime warranties and ukuleles in hot cars. LOL


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HFPHela8YH4&list=UU06nJBnlPClpFxntabpjZkg

RichM
07-31-2014, 05:03 AM
Bradford
07-17-2010, 03:27 AM
Hey Mike, I'm glad you clarified your intent. Most luthier glues are designed to release with heat. With a string through bridge in a hot car, the strings may not pull the bridge off the top, they will pull the top away from the sides instead, or pull the neck away from the body. Solid wood or laminate, they are still glued together and that glue will start to fail at 130 degrees F or so. Hide glue may be OK to about 150, but I would not risk it with any uke of value.

Brad

Moore Bettah Ukuleles
07-17-2010, 04:17 AM
You're exactly right Brad. A bridge is meant to be a sacrificial component in the event of exposure to high temperatures.

Two previous entries from a discussion about this that took place four years ago...just to put another angle on the subject.....

But as ever I seem to be the lone voice of argued dissent :rolleyes:....I don't like straps either...

and as for better tone quality ...surely the tone comes through the saddle (I will stand to be corrected on this) or "bridge" (banjo uke) what happens after that is pretty much immaterial ? the strings on a banjo uke very often don't have any connection to the "soundboard" ...or vellum at all..except via the wooden bridge or saddle ..no ...yes ?

..all this is in the interest of a fair and balanced discussion ...not me saying I hate the system.....even if I do not like the stringing method as described (hook it out with a coat hanger and a vacuum cleaner ...the curve SHOULD make it pop up through the soundhole......shoulda ,woulda ,coulda.......seems a bit vague to
me....) But it does look neat and tidy.

I find that on the on uke I currently have that uses this bridge arrangement, the restringing is pretty simple. I feed the string into the hole in the bridge and usually it curves up out the soundhole, rarely requiring any fishing around.

As far as keeping a uke in a 130F car.. just... don't. Ever.

kohanmike
07-31-2014, 05:57 AM
...even if I do not like the stringing method as described (hook it out with a coat hanger and a vacuum cleaner ...the curve SHOULD make it pop up through the soundhole......shoulda ,woulda ,coulda.......seems a bit vague to
me....)

Not vague at all, he people who actually use this method say it's easy, including me, so why make a mountain out of a of it, it's not even a mole hill.

CeeJay
07-31-2014, 12:26 PM
Not vague at all, he people who actually use this method say it's easy, including me, so why make a mountain out of a of it, it's not even a mole hill.

Not making a mountain...merely offering an alternative point of view in the interest of having a humorous (hopefully ) and lively discussion

I have only opined that I ...me ...personally do not think that it is a simple and straightforward system ...in the face of other's opinions mine obviously has no value...:p

Fair enough.. I know when to pick up my beer and move to another conversation......:deadhorse::nana:.

kohanmike
07-31-2014, 04:00 PM
Sorry, didn't catch the humor, guess it got lost in the British to American translation.

Manalishi
08-01-2014, 12:04 AM
I have a 'through string' bridge on my hand made sopranino,
and find it just as easy to restring as a 'normal' bridge. It
leads to unintentional humour though. A friend of mine saw
it recently and commented 'Wow! Imagine if I had to change
a string during a gig!'. The humour coming from the fact that
a changed string during a gig,would never 'settle' in time and
hold its tuning,and the particular friend would never play a gig
in his life,as he is still nervous in our local group,after several
years!

henrydu
08-05-2014, 10:46 PM
I had a DeVine muse tenor. My friend told me that he found there is "Bridge Doctor" inside the DeVine ukulele.
He said that DeVine seems to design his own JLD bridge system (http://www.jldguitar.net/warped_tops/fixtop.html ) to avoid soundboard warpage.
My friend also said bridge doctor design may limit the performance of tone and tenuto sound. (Because of Rigidity bridge system)

I only feel DeVine is very sensitive. Even a little difference of fingernail contact will cause different timbre.
It reminds me need to exercise more. :p

srpompon
08-06-2014, 04:41 AM
Henry,

Thanks for the info, your Devine have a normal bridge or the kasha style bridge?

thanks,

Ivan

henrydu
08-06-2014, 03:03 PM
Thanks for the info, your Devine have a normal bridge or the kasha style bridge?


My Devine is Muse Model.

From Devine's web, he said the Muse model ukulele is based off of the same bracing system as the Kasha ukulele but designed for a more precise style of playing. The Muse offers a slightly more detailed sound. You will tend to hear the strings more independently of each other. This makes it just slightly better for finder picking or classical styles of playing.

http://forum.ukuleleunderground.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=69738&d=1407315641