Auction site uke sale, bad, bad experience!

Sorry if this thread is inappropriate and breaks any UU rules, please remove it if so.
Just wanted to alert people who occasionally sell ukes on the usual auction site in the UK, of a buyer with the user name 'sidneypopo'.
This "person" bought my Ohana SK-21M sopranino on 15th July, they received it on 19th July and left me really great positive feedback saying 'super cute, great price, great seller etc'.
Then, 2 weeks later at around midnight last night I received a message saying they had opened a claim stating they hadn't received the uke.
Unfortunately for me, I have the proof of postage receipt but it was only sent 1st class, not a recorded tracked service.
Now you would usually think that them leaving positive feedback for the uke, would be proof enough that they received it, but we all know what the auction sites claim policy is like and it usually favours the buyer, no matter how dodgy their claim is.
Anyway, the case is pending and the funds are on hold in pp, so basically it looks like I've lost the Ohana and the money I got for it.
Just wanted to share my frustration and warn people to always send using a tracked service, sorry for the rant.

You've got their name and address, and proof of delivery. Tell them you'll go to the police.
What they are doing is fraud and since it involved the postal system it's probably an even more serious offense.

hoosierhiver said:

You've got their name and address, and proof of delivery. Tell them you'll go to the police.
What they are doing is fraud and since it involved the postal system it's probably an even more serious offense.

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As far as I'm aware, if you don't have an actual tracking number that proves they received it, you don't have a leg to stand on with the auction site, even if they have left feedback for you. It baffles me why they waited 2 weeks to do this to me, all I can think is they are desperate for money, or maybe someone has just informed them that they can scam sellers if they don't sign for a parcel and unfortunately for me I'm the target.
I can see from their feedback that he also bought another Ohana concert uke around the same time, so this person is a uke player, which p###es me off even more

Have you spoken directly to the buyer? I don't know what's going on but maybe he bought two instruments on the auction site. The other instrument didn't turn up but he accidentally started the dispute against you. I don't know really. Try direct communication and see what happens.

Anthony

anthonyg said:

Have you spoken directly to the buyer? I don't know what's going on but maybe he bought two instruments on the auction site. The other instrument didn't turn up but he accidentally started the dispute against you. I don't know really. Try direct communication and see what happens.

Anthony

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Hi, yes we've communicated briefly through the resolution centre. He has left feedback for the other Ohana so must have received that one too. He bought my uke on 15th, it was posted on 17th and he left feedback on 19th. I've not heard from him since yesterday, I have sent numerous messages through the resolution centre but no reply. If he doesn't reply, the next step is after 10 days he can escalate it to a claim and it's then left for the auction site to decide the outcome. As they have already took the money back from my pp account I fear the worst

Just my sly mind at work but perhaps someone else is using their name and computer while they are away. It's possible.

This has taught me to always get a signature for any ukes I sell and send. Sorry bout you being ripped off. I hate people like that, slime of the Earth.

I am feeling for you - nothing worse than getting scammed like that - How far away fro you does he life? Any mates in the area? You could always go and pay a visit getting at least the sopranino back.

did you insure it?

So sorry!

You have proof that you bought postage and shipped a parcel to that address if you have a receipt from a postal office where it was handed over the counter. In the US the receipt shows weight date cost and destination. If through eBay it only proves that you bought the postage. The crummy bit is if something really doesn't show up. even though it isn't your doing, you get the penalty, so they force you to buy insurance. In the old days we made the buyer pay for the insurance instead of taking it out of our costs, which is the FAIR way. I blew my stack years back when after a bunch of changes by eBay I not only couldn't leave negative feedback, I couldn't charge for shipping materials, handling, or insurance, and if I put it in the shipping an eBay popup would tell me my shipping was "too high" for this type of item and not let me list it! So much for fair market value!. It's insane! eBay lost a lot of sellers to "The River" (Amazon) at the time.

However there is the feedback which should be incriminating on the buyer.

Maybe send an "Ask seller a question" from the sale page (click on the seller name in the feedback) of the other uke he bought to that seller and describe what happened to you and ask him to let you know if it happens to him too. Then you have a better case.

Yep I almost always insure even if the buyer doesn't pay for it unless I am okay risking the item, my time, listing fees and postage plus shipping mailer etc. as an out of pocket loss because there are too many scummy people in the world.

If the resolution centre goes against you, consider taking it to the small claims court. Your proof of posting plus the buyers feedback might just constitute enough evidence. Contact the seller of the other uke. If he had a similar experience it all helps to build a case for both of you.

At the very least it's worth looking into. My daughter used the small claims court when her landlord refused to return her bond when she moved flats. The procedure was pretty straightforward, no need for lawers, though it may just be worth consulting a solicitor. She got her money back.

The small claims court is for cases like yours.

Another thought. Go to your local citizens advise bureau first - if they haven't been closed by government cuts, that is.

What really baffles me is that they left the feedback and seemed to be genuine then changed their mind along the way and decided to do this. Really a shame. I had this happen to me on ebay. I didn't send with a tracking number and they got their money back. It wasn't for much, so I just let it go. Such a terrible feeling.

Thanks for the replies everyone. My pp account is now minus the amount they paid inc postage, so I can't sell or buy anything else. I'm going to add funds to clear this and just wait for the auction site to review it in 10 days. If I win great, f not I've learnt a valuable lesson! The post office told me that standard 1st class parcels can't be tracked, they have given me a claim form for a 'lost parcel' which I will send off and see what happens. It does seem odd that the buyer has now fell silent, guilty conscience hopefully. Thanks everyone, I'll update if any progress.

The positive comments can be tracked to IP address and location. They will know the computer that gave a positive review. If it is where the uke was sent then it is on them. But that's all you got with 1st worst class mail.

We deal with attempted fraud regularly and for years. Stolen identity and credit can be used at any store and filters almost always block them but every so often a loophole is made.

Let me be clear, No one can access anyones payment info from our site. We can't even ever see that. I'm talking about people that attempt to buy ukes with stolen credit cards. At times I have pondered the whole thing, thinking, how do humans live this way. I've realized mostly these people don't even think they're bad for lying and hurting innocent people. They think if they can outsmart you (getting away with it) then they earned it. To many life is personal survival and the only wrong is being poor or getting caught. We even sometimes root for such a character on a movie. Wow, what a good thief. This guy can outsmart the system, cool. Right and wrong is less clear. For those with no soul… anyway they can beat the system is rightly earned by their cleverness. Or the other's own stupidity deserved it. There are people that will most likely never look in the mirror so don't even bother trying.

Just accept the world as it is and realize if you are gonna sell online, you may need to learn more about fraud protection. Frog protection?
So good luck on this one Daz. At the worst you still helped some here realize the wild west of online sales.

Tootler said:

If the resolution centre goes against you, consider taking it to the small claims court. Your proof of posting plus the buyers feedback might just constitute enough evidence. Contact the seller of the other uke. If he had a similar experience it all helps to build a case for both of you.

At the very least it's worth looking into. My daughter used the small claims court when her landlord refused to return her bond when she moved flats. The procedure was pretty straightforward, no need for lawers, though it may just be worth consulting a solicitor. She got her money back.

The small claims court is for cases like yours.

Another thought. Go to your local citizens advise bureau first - if they haven't been closed by government cuts, that is.

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I was wondering if the UK used a similar system to what we have. I'm a big fan of small claims court as UPS will tell you.

DazW said:

Thanks for the replies everyone. My pp account is now minus the amount they paid inc postage, so I can't sell or buy anything else. I'm going to add funds to clear this and just wait for the auction site to review it in 10 days. If I win great, f not I've learnt a valuable lesson! The post office told me that standard 1st class parcels can't be tracked, they have given me a claim form for a 'lost parcel' which I will send off and see what happens. It does seem odd that the buyer has now fell silent, guilty conscience hopefully. Thanks everyone, I'll update if any progress.

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I had almost the exact same experience a few months ago. I sold a Gretsch guitalele on ebay, buyer left positive feedback, we even had an email exchange about best strings, tunings etc. A few weeks later a notice from Paypal saying the buyer had issued a chargeback as he claimed he had never bought the item in the first place, and they had taken the money from my account in the meantime while the investigation was 'pending'. Looking on his feedback I saw he had resold the Gretsch a few days before issuing the chargeback.

Get proactive on it - phone paypal, make it clear you class it as a fraud, a theft. Tell them you are going to the police, they'll suddenly be very helpful! Visit the Action Fraud website and ring them too, the money has been taken from your account so you are out of pocket. You have the guys name and address, and an online trail. keep ringing paypal, Action Fraud and the police if necessary - teach the swine a lesson!

http://www.actionfraud.police.uk/

One thing which is tough to prove is did the recipient get the package. I've had many packages dropped off at the front door. When I used to live in an apt complex, I used to see packages left at the door all the time and I'm sure some would get stolen by a neighbor or someone visiting the neighbors. I live in a house now but doesn't mean it won't get stolen. Secondly, I've had packages dropped off at the wrong address.

Hopefully the fact that he left a positive reply will prove he did get the package and you win the dispute.

This is an interesting point. I was always under the impression that it costs about $400 to prosecute a case in small claims court. Is it? Isn't it?

Captain America said:

This is an interesting point. I was always under the impression that it costs about $400 to prosecute a case in small claims court. Is it? Isn't it?

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I think it varies depending on where you live, in Indiana it's only about $80 and you get it back if you win (if you claim it in the suit).

time to call Guido and have him chat awhile.