PDA

View Full Version : Mya-Moe News



Steveperrywriter
08-23-2014, 11:05 AM
Just saw a note on FB that Mya-Moe has gone to a lottery system to get onto its build list. Apparently, they have slipped to fourteen months, and rather than raise prices or expand to a bigger operation, they have elected to limit new orders this way.

Seems like a reasonable solution to me.

Cornfield
08-23-2014, 11:09 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z5_lfepaCQA&feature=player_embedded

Mine gets the build started in mid October

UkerDanno
08-23-2014, 11:37 AM
that guy sure likes to ramble, jus' sayin'...:shaka:

DownUpDave
08-23-2014, 12:18 PM
Nice problem to have but taking on one more builder like they did with Aaron a while ago would make more sense. They make a nice product but so do other builders. If you are not willing to expand due to demand you will suffer the consequences. Business is business be it nuts and bolts or instuments. I wish them all the best and I hope this works out for them and their customers. It will either create more demand or drive people away.

Doc_J
08-23-2014, 02:05 PM
The demand for quality instruments cannot be over estimated, apparently. I guess the lottery is another alternative to 1) raising prices, 2) increasing the wait list, or 3) adding capacity. I don't think it would easy to add capacity, after watching their "Birth of a Mya-moe". Adding another luthier (or two) and building more space would change their process and their product. That could be a real problem, at least in the short term. Plus the expansion would be a distraction from normal instrument building. I learned in Econ 101 if demand outpaces supply, raising prices should reduce demand and give them a shorter wait list. Or they could just close the wait list until it is short enough.

But the lottery is an interesting approach to manage their wait list. It's kind of like a random wait list for their wait list.

l3uffer
08-23-2014, 02:26 PM
I feel as though this is a sort of band-aid for the problem at hand... I like that Gordon doesn't want to recede from the front lines and become a guy who looks over his employees' shoulders, but at the same time, this only seems to draw out the problem longer until it gets worse. I agree with adding expert staff, especially because problems are bound to happen in any direction one takes. I bet Gordon, Char, and Aaron had a few hiccups they had to sort through when Aaron first started, so why not attempt the same now?
Besides, not all change is bad, right? Who knows? Maybe the changes from adding a new luthier (or two) may better the quality of future instruments...

KnowsPickin
08-23-2014, 02:45 PM
I think this is probably the best solution given the limitations. One thing I respect is that Gordon and Char want to keep their hands on the build process rather than becoming shop managers. This is really a labor of love for them and not just a business. They want Mya Moe ukes to continue to be their own creations. And I like the egalitarian aspect of their decision to not raise prices. They actually add value to the instrument by reining in access to them, but do it in a fair way to everyone. I'd hate for their work to be going only to the more wealthy players.

Good luck to Gordon, Char and Aaron!

Dan Uke
08-23-2014, 03:21 PM
nothing is set in stone so they could always change!it if it doesn't work. Based on the lack of MM in the marketplace, they must be really good.

erivel
08-23-2014, 04:04 PM
By entering a lottery there's a chance that you may never get picked. That would be really sad for the potential buyer. I'm glad I got my orders in already before the change. If I want another one however I don't know if I could wait that long...

Jim Hanks
08-23-2014, 04:39 PM
By entering a lottery there's a chance that you might may never get picked.
True, but your odds get better the longer you're in (if you reenter every month). But I find it hard to believe prices won't go up if demand is that high. Witness recent Moore Bettah sales.

NewKid
08-23-2014, 05:37 PM
Nice problem to have but taking on one more builder like they did with Aaron a while ago would make more sense. They make a nice product but so do other builders. If you are not willing to expand due to demand you will suffer the consequences. Business is business be it nuts and bolts or instuments. I wish them all the best and I hope this works out for them and their customers. It will either create more demand or drive people away.

What do you think are the consequences of not expanding to demand that Mya-Moe will suffer? If they were in it for the money they could just double their prices.

mds725
08-23-2014, 06:21 PM
My guess is that Mya-Moe is happy with its current income stream and doesn't feel like it has to build any more instruments in a year than it's already building. The lottery system changes whose ukuleles get built, but it won't, by itself, reduce the number of ukuleles Mya-Moe makes in a year. I applaud Mya-Moe for not choosing to regulate demand by raising prices. For what it's worth, the new lottery system may be great news for people who already own Mya-Moes and are thinking about selling them. People who might be willing to wait 14 months for a firm build date but who might not like the uncertainty of not knowing whether they're even going to get a build date may look to the secondary market for a Mya-Moe.

Jim Hanks
08-23-2014, 07:08 PM
. People who might be willing to wait 14 months for a firm build date but who might not like the uncertainty of not knowing whether they're even going to get a build date may look to the secondary market for a Mya-Moe.
Hence my comment about prices bound to rise. Again, witness recent Moore Bettah resales

mds725
08-23-2014, 08:06 PM
Hence my comment about prices bound to rise. Again, witness recent Moore Bettah resales

I agree that resale prices may rise. People may be willing to pay as much or more for a "sure thing" used Mya-Moe as they would have to pay for a new one, but it's hard for me to believe that either (a) the price of a used Mya-Moe would exceed that of a new Mya-Moe by that much or (b) Mya-Moe will raise prices simply because it can. My sense is that although there's a crazy secondary market for Moore Bettahs, if Chuck has raised his prices for new MBs, he has done so to reflects the amount of work that he has put into the instrument, not because he can in light of secondary market prices


Bottom line: I watched the lottery video.

I don't get how it works. For anyone ordering a new instrument, they might get a build slot in fourteen months...or next month? Or they may not get a build slot at all?

My takeaway from the video is that a lottery winner gets the next available build slot, which he or she would have to secure with a down payment, and then waits for however long the wait time is from deposit time to build time (currently 14 months). I think the lottery is a prerequisite to the right to make a deposit (which, untilnow, anyone could do simply by going to the website), and after a person obtains the right to make a deposit through the lottery, everything else concerning wait times is as it was before the lottery system was put in place. One question not answered by the website is how frequently lottery slots will be awarded and how many will be awarded at a time.

That's just my understanding, though. I could be wrong.

coolkayaker1
08-23-2014, 08:08 PM
"Since each ukulele takes a long time to make, and since we hand make every one, our production is very low while the demand is overwhelming. Originally, we kept a wait list, but the list got unbearably long. We decided to transform our ordering method in an effort to make a fair process that both honors people who have been waiting for a long time, while giving newer people a shot. We appreciate your support over the years."

Huh? What? A wait list with a customer choosing to order or not to order based on build date (the old method) is less fair than a lottery, where one never knows if they will ever get an instrument (the new system)?

So, yep,as Eric and Jon read into it, it specifically says, "We cannot guarantee that everyone on the list will be able to order an instrument." Huh? How is this fair?

They go on to ask that, outside and in addition to their online ordering system, a customer is to send them an email to get a lottery number. And they can do so every thirty days. HUH?

Andy Chen
08-23-2014, 08:39 PM
Shucks, and I just had to give up a build slot to keep the wife happy.

Good thing I have a preloved Mya tenor bought at a great price.

I'm just wondering why can't the wait just be extended for those who are willing to wait. Gordon has a lottery for earlier build dates anyway, for those who want to try their luck.

consitter
08-23-2014, 08:52 PM
I totally agree. I don't get it at all. It seems like a terribly bad business decision and PR decision. Utterly unfair. But then I aint no businessman. Proof will be in the pudding.

Yeah. There's a lot of people that are going to feel stiffed--in a big way. If you're willing to wait, it shouldn't matter how long the list is. Shouldn't matter to them either. They would be turning out the same number of instruments either way. I would make the initial deposit non-refundable (if it already isn't), to ensure the customer is serious and wants to wait. To me, this would pretty much keep business, well, ad infinitum, if you know what I mean.

I waited five years on my custom build from KoAloha. I knew what I was getting into when I ordered it. Didn't know there would be a surprise ending (a whole other story).

What if by some stupid cowinkydink, everybody that gets pulled out of the 'hat' declines? Where are they then? Not gonna happen I'm sure, but at least the way they're doing it now, I would think that they know these people want to wait on their product.

Like Jon said, ain't no business man, but I just think there would have to be a better way.

thenewb
08-23-2014, 08:59 PM
Another option to the lottery system is a form of "tiered waiting list" system. Those who wants their instrument quicker pays a nominal fee to have their names on the express list. Those in the express list can have the instrument built between 3-6 months). On the other hand, those who prefer not to pay goes into the normal waiting list. All proceeds from this tiered system goes into charity under the payer's name.

Come and think of it, it is almost like the USPS delivery system. If you want it delivered faster, you gotta pay more.

I am not sure what's the ideal nominal fee for the express route...maybe $200, $500 per person?

The good thing about this tiered system is it eliminates the possibility of not getting an instrument under the lottery system. It also gives you the option of paying more to wait less. And it's also for a good cause too, since your money goes into charity. The bad thing is compared to the old waiting list system, those who aren't willing pay extra might have to wait a bit longer.

DownUpDave
08-24-2014, 12:03 AM
What do you think are the consequences of not expanding to demand that Mya-Moe will suffer? If they were in it for the money they could just double their prices.

The consequences are becoming quite evident as this thread evolves. More people displeased with it than pleased. I applaud them for not raising the prices, huge kudos to their high ethics. If they are not in it for the money and that is why they don't want to expand production just extent the wait list. If I am willing to pay $1200 - $2000 or more I want to know when I can expect delivery, even if it is 16 months. Not getting picked because of some random lottery leaves way too much uncertainty in the mind of the buyer. Having to continually reapply just in the hope they will pick you, I don't use that system for any other item I buy. Neither does anyone else.

They have a very successful business and I congratulate them on everything they have done for the ukulele community. As I said in my original post this is a nice problem to have. Lots of businesses struggle, starve and go under.

Jim Hanks
08-24-2014, 01:40 AM
An argument for the lottery system is that there is a business "cost" associated with care and feeding of the wait list. For of all those, the price for those customers is locked in, so if you want/need to raise prices, you can't until 14 months (and growing) from now. Second, all those people have an expectation of communication now for picking woods, options, etc. I'm guessing they've done the math and figure the effort of managing the lottery will be less.

stevepetergal
08-24-2014, 03:17 AM
This is fascinating.

stevepetergal
08-24-2014, 03:18 AM
It will either create more demand or drive people away.

I think you're not looking at the whole picture. This strategy is sure to do both.

kvehe
08-24-2014, 03:31 AM
It's driven me away. I was planning on a particular configuration for a specific serial number that would most likely come up during the winter, but that's over now.

See post # 88 for change of heart. :D

jwieties
08-24-2014, 03:52 AM
I think it's a creative attempt to solve a problem they've identified. If it doesn't work well I'm sure they will respond. MyaMoe certainly seems to reflect on their process and are not afraid to change things up.

Pantheon Steel, who make the "Halo" handpan, also use a similar system.
http://store.pantheonsteel.com/category_s/1844.htm

NewKid
08-24-2014, 04:46 AM
I'm going to play the Mya-Moe lottery. I would like to eventually own one of their instruments again. This time a Myrtle tenor.

didgeridoo2
08-24-2014, 05:23 AM
The odds of being picked are most likely going to be greater than people think. I have to imagine those with the absolute worst luck will endure 2 to 3 lottery drawings before getting a spot. If that is the case, and the folks at Mya Moe can manage a twelve month wait list, then 14 or 15 months would be the waiting period for those less fortunate. There will be a bunch of folks putting their names in initially, so it may take a few months to even out. That's my guess.

coolkayaker1
08-24-2014, 05:36 AM
The odds of being picked are most likely going to be greater than people think. I have to imagine those with the absolute worst luck will endure 2 to 3 lottery drawings before getting a spot.

Not challenging you, brother didge, but I am trying to understand the math here. I'm sure they will get a spot (if they put it in their phone reminder system to re-apply for a lottery spot every thirty days, that is...lol)--but the question is when will that spot be?

Someone smarter than me, please help: if the same number of orders come in as now, and there are the same number of build slots, then wouldn't the wait time for people, on average, be exactly the same as it is now?

didgeridoo2
08-24-2014, 06:09 AM
Not challenging you, brother didge, but I am trying to understand the math here. I'm sure they will get a spot (if they put it in their phone reminder system to re-apply for a lottery spot every thirty days, that is...lol)--but the question is when will that spot be?

Someone smarter than me, please help: if the same number of orders come in as now, and there are the same number of build slots, then wouldn't the wait time for people, on average, be exactly the same as it is now?
That's pretty much my take. G and C have a feeling that the demand will continue to rise and they want to manage it with the crew they currently have. They are asking folks who throw their hats in the ring to be fairly serious about their commitment. It's not a free for all, buy a lottery ticket and get a premium uke. They still cost a lot of money and ponying up $300 to hold a spot is required. Not sure if that deposit is refundable any longer, but if not, than perhaps folks will think twice before wasting anyone's time.

If you really want to better your odds, than set the reminder on your phone. Is it that big of deal? For some, probably. Like all you pampered uke underground vets (cool), who want to just cozy up to their uke builder page and email Char a hundred times about wood choices, while she smiles politely and works her ass off for you, only to have you turn around and order a Compass Rose that popped up on Gryphons website. ;)

Otherwise, roll the dice with your initial entry and please let them know when you are no longer interested.


How dare you challenge me cool. Not cool.

***please understand that a lot of this is in jest and nobody should be offended. I've wasted a bunch of Gordon and Chars time over the years and probably part of the reason they've made some policy changes. :)

erivel
08-24-2014, 06:27 AM
***please understand that a lot of this is in jest and nobody should be offended. I've wasted a bunch of Gordon and Chars time over the years and probably part of the reason they've made some policy changes. :)

So you're the one to blame! :)

Dan Uke
08-24-2014, 06:34 AM
haha Jeff, I'm sure many people have especially those on UU.

Steveperrywriter
08-24-2014, 08:00 AM
Here's the thing: If you make high-end ukes that are in demand, there is always going to be a waiting list. How you manage it is going to be up to you as the builder. Some folks pick a cut-off. Once it gets to X-number of months (or years) they don't take any more orders. Some makers raise their prices, and some hire help, but all of these are going to have their pluses-and-minuses for potential buyers.

I know of a classical guitar maker whose wait list got to be twelve years. And there were customers willing to sign on knowing that. He stopped taking orders because he was not sure he would be around long enough to get them done. And his prices are up there. He started sending customers to people he had taught.

There are one-man operations whose instruments are in such demand that the used ones go for more than the new ones, and they don't keep lists. Raising prices won't make more of them available, and they don't want to expand their operation.

There are folks who charge enough so a lot of casual buyers won't go there. Want one? You have to pony up a nice chunk of change and you still have to wait months or a year. (But even so: A high-end uke is a lot cheaper than a high-end acoustic guitar, or mandolin, or a viola or ... a lot of things. You can pay more for a good violin bow than a pretty good handmade ukulele.)

Looking at it from the builder's viewpoint is different than looking at it from the buyer's. People who want to buy what they want, when they want it, will make a different case than those who start out with rough boards and wind up with world-class ukes. Sure, you want to keep your customers satisfied, but before that, you have to make life bearable for yourself. If you have year-long waiting list, chances are you have figured out how to do the work well enough to attract the right kinds of buyers.

It's easy to say, as a customer who wants one, Well, you should just add staff. But that is going to change the nature of the instrument, isn't it? No two builders are going to do it exactly the same, and what makes a thing unique might improve it, or make it worse, but it will surely change it. Would a Moore Bettah mostly built by an assistant have the same soul? Would Beau Hannam's potential assistant have his eye for those exquisite small details? Would anybody joining the crew know what Rick Turner's fingers know how to do automatically?

Mya-Moe has come up with a way they want to try. It sounds reasonable from where I sit, and a year or two down the road, they will know how well it works for them ...

wickedwahine11
08-24-2014, 08:19 AM
Here's the thing: If you make high-end ukes that are in demand, there is always going to be a waiting list. How you manage it is going to be up to you as the builder. Some folks pick a cut-off. Once it gets to X-number of months (or years) they don't take any more orders. Some makers raise their prices, and some hire help, but all of these are going to have their pluses-and-minuses for potential buyers.

I know of a classical guitar maker whose wait list got to be twelve years. And there were customers willing to sign on knowing that. He stopped taking orders because he was not sure he would be around long enough to get them done. And his prices are up there. He started sending customers to people he had taught.

There are one-man operations whose instruments are in such demand that the used ones go for more than the new ones, and they don't keep lists. Raising prices won't make more of them available, and they don't want to expand their operation.

There are folks who charge enough so a lot of casual buyers won't go there. Want one? You have to pony up a nice chunk of change and you still have to wait months or a year. (But even so: A high-end uke is a lot cheaper than a high-end acoustic guitar, or mandolin, or a viola or ... a lot of things. You can pay more for a good violin bow than a pretty good handmade ukulele.)

Looking at it from the builder's viewpoint is different than looking at it from the buyer's. People who want to buy what they want, when they want it, will make a different case than those who starts out with rough boards and winds up with world-class ukes. Sure, you want to keep your customers satisfied, but before that, you have to make life bearable for yourself. If you have year-long waiting list, chances are you have figured out how to do the work well enough to attract the right kinds of buyers.

It's easy to say, as a customer who wants one, Well, you should just add staff. But that is going to change the nature of the instrument, isn't it? No two builders are going to do it exactly the same, and what makes a thing unique might improve it, or make it worse, but it will surely change it. Would a Moore Bettah mostly built by an assistant have the same soul? Would Beau Hannam's potential assistant have his eye for those exquisite small details? Would anybody joining the crew know what Rick Turner's fingers know how to do automatically?

Mya-Moe has come up with a way they want to try. It sounds reasonable from where I sit, and a year or two down the road, they will know how well it works for them ...

I think that is very well said. And for those one man operations, I could not agree with you more. When someone like Chuck dedicates a build to a uke, he is spending a great deal of time and a good portion of his heart and soul on that instrument. It only makes since that those folks would not take orders like at Burger King, you get in line, place your order and have it your way. That makes little sense from the perspective of a luthier when they only have so many ukes in them - either due to time constraints or desire.

It seems different when it is a factory operation like Kamaka or KoAloha (I don't mean the custom work by Casey or Paul but rather factory made by multiple hands). In those circumstances, sure I can see where you just hire more staff to keep up with demand, or build a long wait list.

From what I have seen of Mya Moe (and from watching their Birth of a Mya Moe series -- all 101 videos) they seem somewhere in between to me. They are certainly hands on owners, with a small staff (like the Chucks and Beaus and Ricks) but also there does seem to a bit of a factory element - lots of ukes in different stages, less customization, etc.

When a Moore Bettah uke is built it does not necessarily have inlay, in fact many of his most beautiful works do not. But for those that do - the Pan Am Clipper, the Tapa series, the dragon, you name it -- there is a great deal of individualization and customization of that instrument. I can see where hiring an assistant, or taking on hundreds waiting in line is neither artistically rewarding or practical.

But on a Mya Moe, you essentially are selecting the woods and so forth, and there is less customization. It is very cool to pick your exact wood combo and watch the build process - something you don't get to do when you buy a similar priced K brand uke. Still, it seems as though it would be easier to hire an assistant. Even if Mya Moe just had an assistant that took all the photos and did all the correspondence, as well as the boxing and shipping, that would free up Gordon and Char to do other things build related and would not require any luthier training.

I think people are willing to pay premiums for used ukes like Moore Bettahs in part because there is a very tiny chance of ever getting a new one due to the extremely limited supply. If Chuck had a lottery, he would be flooded with people just trying for a chance to get one. It is almost impossible to find one new or used so sure, take your chances and you may get lucky.

I don't know if Mya Moe is the same. I think rather than waiting on a shot in the dark, a lot of people might go elsewhere. Now that you essentially have to "win the lottery" to get one, I think many people will opt for another brand -- a uke in the hand, essentially. For their sake, I hope I am wrong. But hey, it is their business to run as they see fit and if it works for them to eliminate the ordering system, more power to them. I still think people will enter the lottery, but I have to wonder if they will lose some orders overall for the folks like kvehe who are no longer willing.

Doc_J
08-24-2014, 09:36 AM
I wonder if the Mya-Moe lottery and all this discussion of it will only further increase demand, or will the change/uncertainty of the order process discourage potential owners? I'm guessing the former.

The lottery lets Mya-Moe have a stable 12-month (or whatever they choose) backlog with a nice pool of customers to fill the waitlist/random openings as needed. But their system, really doesn't benefit/decrease the average real wait of a new customer. It just adds uncertainty.

hawaii 50
08-24-2014, 09:53 AM
I wonder if the Mya-Moe lottery and all this discussion of it will only further increase demand, or will the change/uncertainty of the order process discourage potential owners? I'm guessing the former.

The lottery lets Mya-Moe have a stable 12-month (or whatever they choose) backlog with a nice pool of customers to fill the waitlist/random openings as needed. But their system, really doesn't benefit/decrease the average real wait of a new customer. It just adds uncertainty.

wow Doc is this a marketing tool(if it is it is genius)...:)..
for those who are comparing a MB with a MM pretty sure they have never seen or played a MB.... kind of different...IMO

good luck to the Mya Moe family....:)

wickedwahine11
08-24-2014, 10:14 AM
wow Doc is this a marketing tool(if it is it is genius)...:)..
for those who are comparing a MB with a MM pretty sure they have never seen or played a MB.... kind of different...IMO

good luck to the Mya Moe family....:)

I didn't mean to compare them as instruments in apples to apples. I do think there is a difference between them, with -- for me at least -- MB definitely winning that head to head matchup, both tonally and visually. I only meant to compare them in terms of small operations vs. large factories building style and the relative supply and demand in regards to ending Mya Moe's wait list. Plus while both are financially out of reach for many, a lot more folks can afford a Mya Moe than a MBU.

hawaii 50
08-24-2014, 10:23 AM
I didn't mean to compare them as instruments in apples to apples. I do think there is a difference between them, with -- for me at least -- MB definitely winning that head to head matchup, both tonally and visually. I only meant to compare them in terms of small operations vs. large factories building style and the relative supply and demand in regards to ending Mya Moe's wait list. Plus while both are financially out of reach for many, a lot more folks can afford a Mya Moe than a MBU.

no not you Staci..
in general the folks that mention MB and MM as kind of equal might be a little confused...just saying not trying to make any one look bad....:)

I think adding another builder seems to make the most sense for MM...as they are more of an assembly(production) than MB....
waiting 1 to 2 years for a nice custom uke no problem for me...as this is just how it is.....

my 2 cents

Doc_J
08-24-2014, 10:42 AM
wow Doc is this a marketing tool(if it is it is genius)...:)..
for those who are comparing a MB with a MM pretty sure they have never seen or played a MB.... kind of different...IMO

good luck to the Mya Moe family....:)

I don't believe the lottery was meant as marketing, especially given the current demand for their instruments. But the change in the ordering process and all our discussion here on UU about this lottery should spark more interest in Mya-Moe ukes.

Gordon, Char, Aaron and all the folks at Mya-Moe are good people. I hope this works out well for them and their customers.

WCBarnes
08-24-2014, 12:14 PM
I have a birthday coming up and my wife's present to me was going to be putting me on the MM wait list knowing it would be ready a little after my birthday next year, killing two birthdays with one stone... er, uke. I was quite happy with that arrangement. This lottery throws a large wrench in that plan! That said, it will not change my plans to get a MM. I have wanted one for years and am now at the point to be able to afford it. Here's hoping my "ticket" is drawn at the right time to align with my original plan.

coolkayaker1
08-24-2014, 01:51 PM
I think rather than waiting on a shot in the dark, a lot of people might go elsewhere.

I agree with you, Staci. If the goal is to reduce orders (and perhaps it is), this will do it. In fact, I would not buy a ukulele through a lottery system, so I'm with Kathryn. I own four Mya Moes, and would not buy another through this new system as we understand it here. Too many other things to think about in life than renewing my lottery bid every month, shooting unnecessary emails back and forth, and holding money in my bank account in "reserve" in case Mya Moe ever anoints me as worthy through their veiled, behind-the-scenes lottery in Oregon.

Additionally, as WCBarnes mentions below, I've heard so many stories of timing the purchase for special occasions, or when one can save enough to buy their Mya Moe. No more. Mya Moe is highly likely to send out a "You won the lottery and have build next month!", only to get a "Wow, that was quicker than I thought, and I'm still saving up. I'll pass for now." When the system seems like a "maybe" to the customer (Maybe they'll pick my number, maybe they won't, and maybe they never will), then the customers will treat it like a "maybe" on their end, too.

What is especially peculiar to me is the amount of work this is going to take for Mya Moe. Getting dozens of emails to "put me in the lottery", "please renew my lottery bid this month" or "okay, take me out of the lottery now," etc. A tracking nightmare!

Playing off Staci's notion, I think people who opt into the lottery will, while they wait, possibly spot another ukulele that will catch their eye elsewhere (UU Marketplace, etc.) and they will be shooting an email to Mya Moe to remove them from the lottery. It's human nature (and the $300 is refundable--were it not, no one would sign up for the lottery). This backing out is considerably less likely to occur when one has a solid build date in the current system.

I still can't see either the fairness to buyers, or the benefit to ukulele makers at Mya Moe, in this new system.

Nickie
08-24-2014, 02:17 PM
Well, I'm not a MM uke fan, never have been, but I admire their unwillingness to raise prices. I don't gamble, so playing a lottery with any company isn't my idea of fun at all. I'd rather pay my deposit and know when my uke is being started. And I don't understand not hiring another person. Apprentiship used to be the way to learn, and carry on the brand. Example: LoPrinzi. Augustino carefully taught his daughter Donna, who has taken over the buidling, and there's not been one iota or sacrifice in quality. And there's no lottery.

Andy Chen
08-24-2014, 02:44 PM
"What is especially peculiar to me is the amount of work this is going to take for Mya Moe. Getting dozens of emails to "put me in the lottery", "please renew my lottery bid this month" or "okay, take me out of the lottery now," etc. A tracking nightmare!"

This is very true. It would certainly add to their workload.

Dan Uke
08-24-2014, 02:46 PM
very interesting but if I really wanted any instruments, I would play by whatever rules they have. Maybe some of those that don't like it rather get something else

stevepetergal
08-24-2014, 02:47 PM
I'm seeing the up-side to the new system.

Gordon and Char have an untenable waiting list. They are slaves to that list. Now they will be able to shrink it to a workable length. If they want to have a six (or eight, ten...) month waiting list, that's all they have to have. They just don't draw any names until they catch up that far. Plus, they get to take a vacation once in a while. Maybe plan an extended trip in the future. They probably deserve it. Not only that, they might have less than half the number of customers calling and emailing them wanting a personal conversation every week or so. It seems they enjoy that part of the business, but it must be cumbersome, even exhausting.

Now for the customers, maybe there is a down-side. How bad is it really? Really. The sensible thing to do if you want a Mya Moe would be to enter the lottery, buy a temp ukulele, and hope for the best. (By the way, there is no shortage of builders making beautiful, fine ukuleles.) If and when your name gets drawn, you take the ____ (fill in the blank) months to sell your ______ (fill in the blank) ukulele. In fact some, perhaps many, will fall in love with the Talsma, Ko'Olau, Moore Bettuh, Kamaka,...and decide to remove themselves from MM's list. Everybody wins. You have an instrument that makes you happy, the maker of your uke makes a sale, and the next person pulled from Mya Moe's hat gets on the list. Will Mya Moe lose business? Not in any way they will ever notice.

The alternatives to MM going to the lottery system are pretty unattractive. Keep going as is? How long can it go on? Apparently no longer, as far as Gordon and Char are concerned. End of conversation. Raise prices? Now you're turning away customers. Start saying no to customers? Can't be done in a way we would see as fair. Close down the "Order" section of the web site for months (or a year) at a time? Everybody would be upset. These are the ways you hurt the brand's reputation.

If you think the lottery will hurt Mya Moe in some way, I think you're mistaken. They will continue to build as they have, or better yet, as they would like to going forward. Good for them. Their instruments will not be built by people burned out by their own success. If I was actually getting one, I'd be very happy. If I put my name in the hat and never got one, I'd get something else that I would really love anyway.

It's all good. ENJOY.

stevepetergal
08-24-2014, 02:51 PM
"What is especially peculiar to me is the amount of work this is going to take for Mya Moe. Getting dozens of emails to "put me in the lottery", "please renew my lottery bid this month" or "okay, take me out of the lottery now," etc. A tracking nightmare!"

This is very true. It would certainly add to their workload.

I'll bet they already have software doing it for them. They're pretty sophisticated with that end of the business.

wickedwahine11
08-24-2014, 02:57 PM
I'll bet they already have software doing it for them. They're pretty sophisticated with that end of the business.

That is true. They have the iPhones all set up with the build tracker, etc. They do seem very computer savvy.

stevepetergal
08-24-2014, 03:03 PM
I don't understand not hiring another person. Apprentiship used to be the way to learn, and carry on the brand. Example: LoPrinzi. Augustino carefully taught his daughter Donna, who has taken over the buidling, and there's not been one iota or sacrifice in quality.

Taking on an apprentice and increasing the size of your business by 25% are very different things. If Gordon and Char had a son or daughter who wanted to build ukuleles, it would already be happening. But, I believe taking an apprentice would be very problematic for a company as streamlined as Mya Moe. Training someone, (even someone with experience) is expensive and enormously time-consuming. The 14 month list might stretch out to 18 months without adding a single customer. "By the way Mr. Smith, your October 2015 delivery date will now be some time in 2016." Will Mr. Smith recommend Mya Moe to his friends? There's a question Gordon and Char don't want to ask.

Cornfield
08-24-2014, 03:14 PM
If it doesn't work out, they can always go back to the waiting list.

stevepetergal
08-24-2014, 03:14 PM
It's driven me away. I was planning on a particular configuration for a specific serial number that would most likely come up during the winter, but that's over now.

I'm amazed. Are you disgruntled because you wanted a specific serial number you might have missed anyway? Were you really interested in a My Moe or was the ukulele just a side-issue?

stevepetergal
08-24-2014, 03:19 PM
I'm wondering if Gordon and Char have thought about the possibility of drawing a name more than once, while other customers wait. Not that others will find out and cry foul, but the Mayers seem to strive for fairness. Technically it would be "fair" but how would they feel?

didgeridoo2
08-24-2014, 03:33 PM
very interesting but if I really wanted any instruments, I would play by whatever rules they have. Maybe some of those that don't like it rather get something else
This.
My tongue in cheek comment about the pampered UU vets kind of alludes to the fact that there will be new players/buyers who will not remember there was a change and they will do what needs to be done to get "their" Mya Moe. This will be a small hiccup when we look back in a few months.

coolkayaker1
08-24-2014, 03:47 PM
People like to place an order and be put on a wait list, in the knowledge the instrument will be built at a given time. How long the wait list isn't a problem, you know what you're getting into from the start. With this {new} arrangement you may never get one built, however long you wait. Meanwhile someone else comes along and opts in and gets drawn out of the hat a month later with virtually no wait time.


Jon had many solid points in his last post, but this one above resonated with me.

If the goal is for the good people at Mya Moe to avoid burnout and cut back on ukulele building, take vacations, etc., as brother SteveP mentions, it's perfectly understandable. SteveP notes they are "slaves to the list". Steve, they're not. Gordon and Char control the work schedule! We, the customer, never see it. If they now make two ukes a day, cut back to one. Make ukes only two weeks a month. It's all good. It can all be factored into their build schedule. If they want to build one single, solitary uke a month for the rest of the existence of Mya Moe and have a waiting list develop until until 2020 (if anyone wishes to sign on), it's their choice as owners. They can give everyone on the wait list their deposit back and it's all over. They are in complete control. No slaves that I can see.

The customer, however, can choose to order a ukulele from that build schedule...or not. It's quite fair, open, simple. No lottery, no emails. If the customer feels it's too long a wait, they won't place an order. Simple. Since we all know Gordon and Char are fair-minded people, there's no bias as to whether they choose in a lottery Steve's uke before Jon's uke before Carmen's uke, right? So, then, why have the lottery? Why add uncertainty for customers? Why add potential angst for customers, as Jon mentions, when JoJo signed up today for the lottery and gets a build next month, and I have re-applied to the lottery for a year and have never yet gotten lucky?

Introducing luck as a factor in an honest, committed, two-way, seller-buyer transaction will likely not be good for the seller or the buyer.

Ukulele Eddie
08-24-2014, 03:56 PM
I find this thread fascinating. Gordon and Char have a business. It's their choice to run it how they choose to run it, success or failure (and clearly to date more the former than the latter but, on the other hand, the past does not equal the future). Apparently, the joy of what they do gets marred when their backlog is excessive (they determine what "excessive" is). Lots of opinions here on how right or wrong their decision is. Some people will be drawn to them because of how they handled their currently excessive backlog, others will go away. I doubt any opinions in this thread matter to them. The one thing that will is whether or not they get their backlog to a spot where THEY are comfortable. So why six pages of dialogue on a topic that ultimately serves no purpose whatsoever? Damn, I just added to it! ;-)

coolkayaker1
08-24-2014, 04:04 PM
So why six pages of dialogue on a topic that ultimately serves no purpose whatsoever? Damn, I just added to it! ;-)

Because we are customers, and it's okay if we discuss these things. Comments such as "they can do what they want" (not you, Eddie, but a couple below) are a given. Dah! Obviously!

If everything on this forum was discussed only by those that actually could make the choices, there would be no forum. ;-)

I think Gordon and Char and Aaron read this Forum quite a bit and may (or may not) tweak based on things they might not have considered. Just as we, the customers, may (or may not) tweak our buying based on this thread.

Andy Chen
08-24-2014, 04:21 PM
On the plus side for G + C, these six pages are mostly testament to how much people want their ukes. Then again, the 14-month wait list also told them that already.

Ukulele Eddie
08-24-2014, 04:27 PM
Because we are customers, and it's okay if we discuss these things. Comments such as "they can do what they want" (not you, Eddie, but a couple below) are a given. Dah! Obviously!

If everything on this forum was discussed only by those that actually could make the choices, there would be no forum. ;-)

I think Gordon and Char and Aaron read this Forum quite a bit and may (or may not) tweak based on things they might not have considered. Just as we, the customers, may (or may not) tweak our buying based on this thread.

Hmmm. I'd be interested to know how many people commenting on this thread are TRULY high potential near-term customers or not. I'd wager most are not.

kvehe
08-24-2014, 04:29 PM
I'm amazed. Are you disgruntled because you wanted a specific serial number you might have missed anyway? Were you really interested in a My Moe or was the ukulele just a side-issue?

You amaze easily. In any event, I wouldn't say I'm disgruntled - just disappointed. I like the Mya-Moes I have, and wanted another one to commemorate a specific event. I've done it before, and if I can't have it, that's a disappointment, but at this stage of my life I should be downsizing anyway. Maybe they've done me a favor. :D

See post # 88 for change of heart, now that I've calmed down and gotten used to the idea.

igorthebarbarian
08-24-2014, 05:00 PM
Assuming demand stays the same, this will drive up Used Prices. Heck people might be able to charge MORE for a used in-hand one. Or could we see place-holder people who hold a spot ( like paying someone for a spot in Black Friday lines)?
I commend them on not raising prices, which is awesome.
It is a "creative" solution to what I'm sure is a tough problem with the backlog. I would have cut off the log and said, lottery for everyone going forward, after we get the current backlog done.
These are good problems to have though if you're running a business, especially in this economy!

Cornfield
08-25-2014, 01:50 AM
This will probably cause a lot of people to skip Mya-Moe and get on the Moore Bettah waiting list instead (tic)

stevepetergal
08-25-2014, 02:09 AM
I get what coolkayaker is saying, when he says Gordon and Char are not slaves to the list. But, they aren't willing to leave the list at 14 months and growing. I can't even imagine how intimidating it must look from their side. Let it grow to years? Not the way they run their business. For most people, too much is too much. I'd be happy to climb a mountain, but put the Andes in their entirety in front of me, and I don't think I'd even try the first one.

If they wanted to build on a more relaxed scale, how to do it? You can see that Mya Moe is a well-oiled, concise machine.They have an operation designed to build at its current pace. Cut production by 25 percent and they'd have to shut that machine down and build a new one from scratch. It can be done, I suppose. Perhaps they're not slaves to the list, but slaves to the production. The list is the indicator. And again, if they chose to slow production, how would they get there from here? Tell everybody on the current list they'll have to wait another 2 to 8 months? Very bad P.R. and not their style. Not to mention Aaron and Nicole, who now have another mouth to feed. Cut production by 25 percent and Aaron would almost surely have to go.

byjimini
08-25-2014, 02:46 AM
I hope it works out well for them, whatever it is they're trying to achieve. Personally I think it's silly, if I put down a deposit for something then I want a rough date, not a lottery ticket.

It's a shame as I wanted to order a resonator through them, maybe this turn of events is saying that it simply wasn't to be. :(

RichM
08-25-2014, 02:51 AM
Personally I think it's silly, if I put down a deposit for something then I want a rough date, not a lottery ticket.

(

According to Mya-Moe, you wouldn't put a deposit down until you'd been given a build slot.

byjimini
08-25-2014, 03:01 AM
Yep, found the page now. Not quite as drastic as some are making out, I still think it's a bit over the top though.

marymary
08-25-2014, 03:27 AM
I think it might have been more prudent to close the order list as Linda Manzer does (I believe she keeps a two year backlog, which is what she is comfortable with) and then reopen it on occasion when there is room. At least a buyer is either on the list or not, and not just hopeful that he or she will be able to get in line at some future point in time.

That said, I hope it works out. Collings closed their build list for ukes for a while and then reopened it, but sales have been very slow since. There is always the chance that the market will cool for what you are selling.

coolkayaker1
08-25-2014, 03:45 AM
According to Mya-Moe, you wouldn't put a deposit down until you'd been given a build slot.

True, Rich. And hence, much mind-changing by buyers in the meantime. "I'm not obligated by a deposit, and in the meantime, an awesome KoAloha came up on the Marketplace at a great price. So, when Gordon emailed that my name was chosen for a deposit and a build, I had to tell him thanks but I'll have to pass."

didgeridoo2
08-25-2014, 03:59 AM
True, Rich. And hence, much mind-changing by buyers in the meantime. "I'm not obligated by a deposit, and in the meantime, an awesome KoAloha came up on the Marketplace at a great price. So, when Gordon emailed that my name was chosen for a deposit and a build, I had to tell him thanks but I'll have to pass."meh. There's someone waiting in line right behind you who's ready to order. Eventually, the people who want one will deal with it.

For the record, I'd be a bit put off by the new system if I was looking to get a Mya Moe. But the way I see it, it won't be too difficult to get a spot once it smooths out.

jwieties
08-25-2014, 04:21 AM
I think it might have been more prudent to close the order list as Linda Manzer does (I believe she keeps a two year backlog, which is what she is comfortable with) and then reopen it on occasion when there is room. At least a buyer is either on the list or not, and not just hopeful that he or she will be able to get in line at some future point in time.

But isn't this essentially what they are doing. List is closed, but when slots open, rather than a rush to fill the slots by those who check their website everyday, they use a lottery system (perhaps more fair?) to refill the list.

I suppose they could close the list, wait till the build time is down to 6 months, and then reopen the list until it gets back up to a year. It might take out some of the uncertainty that it seems some don't care for. I believe in the end that uncertainty will pay off. It will make one feel a little more "lucky" to have won the chance to own their instrument.

If it doesn't work, no doubt they will re-evaluate and make the necessary changes. I'm sure they are reading and I'm sure they appreciate everyone's feedback, good or bad.

Ukulele Eddie
08-25-2014, 05:26 AM
Just in case there is any doubt, my comment was not at all intended to indicate they are anything less then finely crafted ukes. It was simply that I wondered how many people commenting in this thread are seriously in the market now for a Mya-moe. That's all.


Well, I am very tempted to take you on in that wager. Mya-Moe are hugely respected here and have been exceptionally well patronised by many members of this forum for a number of years now.

But I'm not a gambling man. Don't buy tickets in lotteries either.

Steveperrywriter
08-25-2014, 05:34 AM
The basic system seems pretty simple to me: Close your list, and buyers have no chance of a build slot; or offer a lottery, and give buyers whatever odds at a build that offers.

No chance, versus some chance.

Me, I buy a lottery ticket now and then. I don't expect to win, but for a day or two, I have the fantasy to play with ...

Dan Uke
08-25-2014, 06:43 AM
meh. There's someone waiting in line right behind you who's ready to order. Eventually, the people who want one will deal with it.

I agree, instead of telling everyone no...they have a database of names they can tell contact if they change their mind. Also, there are people on the waitlist that paid their deposits who try to get off the waitlist so it works both ways. I've spoken with several luthiers and I don't think there are many or any that enforce non-refundable deposits, unless they had to purchase wood, tuners, for that particular built.

I disagree about not being bound to the waitlist. Even though its an estimate, there are some customers that get upset when it's not delivered by a certain time, especially if it's for a special occasion. They are humans so must feel some obligations to try to keep to their schedule. That's why Brad Donaldson does not require deposits.

katysax
08-25-2014, 06:53 AM
I empathize with Mya Moe. I have a small business with two partners. How to manage growth is a big challenge. You can't just add employees when you need special skills and training. Sometimes you can't grow and stay who you are. It's unlikely this change will hurt demand. There are plenty of builders now who have processes for selecting customers that are pretty random or hard to figure out. That doesn't stop them.

RichM
08-25-2014, 07:22 AM
When I bought my Mya-Moe several years ago, the wait time for a custom build rarely exceeded 90 days (from order to receipt of finished uke), and Gordon and Char usually had time to build a few spec ukes which they would sell on their website. The intervening years have been very good to their brand, and for good reason: they build a great product at an affordable price, and they are incredibly decent, fair, and honest people. Katy makes an excellent point above, that "just add more builders" is not an easy decision for a small shop, as it changes everything. It would also seem that Gordon and Char have chosen to be ukulele builders, rather than ukulele build shop managers. It's their business and their choice, but I am certain that the decisions they have made is with the goal of serving their customer the best way they can. If it doesn't work out, I'm sure they will choose a different path. I, for one, think it *will* work out; many customers who see a 2+ year waiting list decide to look elsewhere, as they aren't interested in waiting. The lottery gives them a fighting chance.

cantsing
08-25-2014, 07:58 AM
In introducing the lottery, Gordon described the demand for their ukuleles as "overwhelming." If you regularly watch the Unscripted Series, you'll notice that he's talked more than once about burnout-related issues, and he's also said several times "When this is no longer fun for us, we'll stop doing it."

I don't think it's a stretch to conclude that their tremendous success is a growing source of pressure for them, and I think they are trying to find a way to move forward that works for them.

Understandably (to me, anyway) they don't want to expand production. Some have proposed that they should set up a waiting list (no deposit required) that would eventually get you onto the build list (requiring a deposit). This is perceived as fairer than a lottery, however, it creates an expectation that everybody on the waiting list is guaranteed a ukulele if they simply wait long enough. Using a lottery means that nobody is guaranteed a ukulele until they are on the build list, which allows Gordon and Char the ability to reduce the number of ukuleles they build--or even to stop building entirely--without breaking an implied promise to anybody.

Obviously, I don't know what factors actually went into this decision, but as a person who recently received a Mya-Moe, I know that Gordon and Char are people of integrity, and I believe that they are trying in good faith to balance the desires of their future owners with their own needs.

HBolte
08-25-2014, 08:22 AM
The big brown truck is delivering my MM(#1456) tomorrow. Glad I ordered last year. Personally I'd rather have a slot and long wait as opposed to the lottery. I do hope it works out good for MM as well as the customers.

coolkayaker1
08-25-2014, 11:19 AM
didgeredoo: "meh. There's someone waiting in line right behind you who's ready to order." nongdam: "I agree, instead of telling everyone no...they have a database of names they can tell contact if they change their mind. My opinion, Didge and Daniel, is that you're underestimating two-person Mya Moe's time spent on communication to just "move on to the next customer". The inefficiency of back-and-forth emails. I, personally, think the new system will be crushing on MM re: emails and communications.

As jweities noted in his thoughtful post #70 below, I'm sure MM will glean some useful perspective from this thread. They are very thoughtful people that way. In the end, we all wish them the best with any system they choose.

coolkayaker1
08-25-2014, 01:39 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=avsPX6Ws9OQ

CeeJay
08-25-2014, 02:19 PM
Why not just say ..yes we can build you a Uke ..but not for ...(insert)however long ?....Car manufacturers have done that for decades .

KnowsPickin
08-25-2014, 03:04 PM
Why not just say ..yes we can build you a Uke ..but not for ...(insert)however long ?....Car manufacturers have done that for decades .

Actually, that is what they have been doing for years now. In my opinion, the problem is that the wait time is getting longer than they want to encumber themselves. This is a retirement business for them both and is a labor of love. Right now they are in the enviable position that if the company becomes an undue burden and ceases to be a pleasure, they could just stop taking orders, finish previous commitments and quit. The hardest part of any job is if you know you can't quit. I'd hate to be in a business where I knew I could not quit for several years due to the backlog.

Good for them that they have found a way to keep their instruments affordable, but also keep the demands on themselves to a manageable level. Good luck, Gordon, Char and Aaron. I want you to be able to enjoy this calling for many years to come. You have created quite a legacy.

Skinny Money McGee
08-25-2014, 03:18 PM
Actually, that is what they have been doing for years now. In my opinion, the problem is that the wait time is getting longer than they want to encumber themselves. This is a retirement business for them both and is a labor of love. Right now they are in the enviable position that if the company becomes an undue burden and ceases to be a pleasure, they could just stop taking orders, finish previous commitments and quit. The hardest part of any job is if you know you can't quit. I'd hate to be in a business where I knew I could not quit for several years due to the backlog.

Good for them that they have found a way to keep their instruments affordable, but also keep the demands on themselves to a manageable level. Good luck, Gordon, Char and Aaron. I want you to be able to enjoy this calling for many years to come. You have created quite a legacy.

Well said.... I just entered their lottery for a concert resonator. We'll see how it goes!

CeeJay
08-25-2014, 03:22 PM
Actually, that is what they have been doing for years now. In my opinion, the problem is that the wait time is getting longer than they want to encumber themselves. This is a retirement business for them both and is a labor of love. Right now they are in the enviable position that if the company becomes an undue burden and ceases to be a pleasure, they could just stop taking orders, finish previous commitments and quit. The hardest part of any job is if you know you can't quit. I'd hate to be in a business where I knew I could not quit for several years due to the backlog.

Good for them that they have found a way to keep their instruments affordable, but also keep the demands on themselves to a manageable level. Good luck, Gordon, Char and Aaron. I want you to be able to enjoy this calling for many years to come. You have created quite a legacy.

Okay that's fair enough, asked and answered as they say in court ...Cheers Squire.

Moore Bettah Ukuleles
08-25-2014, 04:35 PM
Actually, that is what they have been doing for years now. In my opinion, the problem is that the wait time is getting longer than they want to encumber themselves. This is a retirement business for them both and is a labor of love. Right now they are in the enviable position that if the company becomes an undue burden and ceases to be a pleasure, they could just stop taking orders, finish previous commitments and quit. The hardest part of any job is if you know you can't quit. I'd hate to be in a business where I knew I could not quit for several years due to the backlog.

Good for them that they have found a way to keep their instruments affordable, but also keep the demands on themselves to a manageable level. Good luck, Gordon, Char and Aaron. I want you to be able to enjoy this calling for many years to come. You have created quite a legacy.
Exactly. A long wait list, while providing a degree of security, takes away a person's options. Most of us who are self employed have chosen that route to allow us to have more freedom than we would have than if working for someone else. I can't speak for MM but I've personally had a waiting list of over five years at one point. This kind of pressure not only inhibits creative expression but can also lead to poor health and to ignoring other personal business and relationships. Mya moe knows what they're doing and are apparently making business decisions based on what's best for them. If you trust them as builders why not trust them as business people? I say kudos to them. Do what makes you happy and keeps you thriving. Not all of business is about getting bigger. Sometimes it's about controlling and preserving what you already have.

rustysmith3
08-25-2014, 04:38 PM
This is an interesting approach. It's weighted because you can add another chance every month. I've been a guitar player for decades and just entered the uke world several years ago. I received my Mya-Moe nearly two years ago. It was a very personalized and positive experience. I know three custom guitar builders who refuse to expand their building process but there are many more. Wait lists can be years or now non-existent. I applaud all of them for wanting to stay true to their art and being completely hands on for each and every instrument. This lottery system seems to me to be a way to try and be true to the vision of enjoying their business while building the finest instruments they can. If this lottery system doesn't work out they can go back to the an ever increasing wait list. If it does work out it's a brand new way to solve a problem and other luthiers may choose to try it out. I say hats off to Gordon and Char for a creative approach.

Beau Hannam Ukuleles
08-26-2014, 05:57 AM
A lottery is not "fair" as described by Gordon.

People wait for quality and quality things take time to make- it is that simple.

Dan Uke
08-26-2014, 06:05 AM
My opinion, Didge and Daniel, is that you're underestimating two-person Mya Moe's time spent on communication to just "move on to the next customer". The inefficiency of back-and-forth emails. I, personally, think the new system will be crushing on MM re: emails and communications.

As jweities noted in his thoughtful post #70 below, I'm sure MM will glean some useful perspective from this thread. They are very thoughtful people that way. In the end, we all wish them the best with any system they choose.

I think the opposite. There must be tons of inquiries so instead of replying to all of them, they focus on the winners of the lottery. They are banking on the strength of their Mya Moe name.

kvehe
08-27-2014, 05:25 AM
Now that I've had time to digest this whole thing, it's fine with me. Whatever Gordon, Char, Aaron, et al. need to do to keep things the way that works best for them is fine with me. Looking forward to my myrtle tenor, down the road a bit. Me? Downsizing? LOL, that'll be the day.

bohemian46
08-27-2014, 03:23 PM
The lottery system is a deterrent to purchase and I fail to see the fairness.
The "excuse" is that they don't want to raise prices.
Why raise prices because of an abundance of orders. ?; just fill the orders as you get them. Simple and F A I R.
Raise prices for reasons other than an attempt at "altruism" in a convoluted fashion.

What I think is fair and good business sense:

Ukuleles are made in the order received. It is that simple.

This appears to be a calculated PR move for whatever reason.

I am not favorably impressed, which has nothing whatever to do with my opinion of the instruments.

mds725
08-27-2014, 05:20 PM
The lottery system is a deterrent to purchase and I fail to see the fairness.
The "excuse" is that they don't want to raise prices.
Why raise prices because of an abundance of orders. ?; just fill the orders as you get them. Simple and F A I R.
Raise prices for reasons other than an attempt at "altruism" in a convoluted fashion.

What I think is fair and good business sense:

Ukuleles are made in the order received. It is that simple.

This appears to be a calculated PR move for whatever reason.

I am not favorably impressed, which has nothing whatever to do with my opinion of the instruments.

I think you've missed the point of the lottery, which is that Mya-Moe wants to regulate the flow of orders it receives. Before it instituted the lottery, anyone could order just by going to the website. As the pace in which orders were received exceeded the pace at which they MM builds ukuleles, the wait list got longer and that became a source of stress for Gordon and Char. The whole idea of a lottery is to regulate (and slow down) the pace it which orders come in, because what I'm sure Gordon and Char want is to relieve some of the pressure of a wait list that's 14 months long and continuing to get longer. Of the ways to regulate the flow of incoming orders, (including a lottery for a specified number of slots, saying no to some people but not others, or closing the build list) the one that seems the fairest due to its randomness is the lottery. I applaud them for running the kind of business they want instead of letting the business run them.

mds725
08-28-2014, 02:34 PM
Gordon discusses the context in which the decision was made to institute a lottery.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=04UqaMkpT-Y

mds725
08-29-2014, 10:19 AM
The lottery is now a "wait list," with slots being filled as they open in the order in which people applied for them. Here are the statement and video Gordon posted today on Mya-Moe's Facebook page.


"Due to popular demand, we have changed the 'lottery' to a 'wait list'. No randomness involved, so as we add build slots, we will select people from the wait list in the order we received their name. We do require that you 'refresh' your entry every 60 days in order to remain active on the list.

"As a footnote, I found (or am finding) this process fascinating. Aaron said that he thinks this change to our ordering process is the biggest change we've made at Mya-Moe since he came on board. So, it's no wonder that we had to iterate to get it right. It also highlights the value of social media and an engaged owner/enthusiast group who offered us (mostly) positive input & alternatives so that we could figure out what is best for us and the community."


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PEIPGl3TSyg

bohemian46
08-31-2014, 02:09 PM
"I think you've missed the point of the lottery, which is that Mya-Moe wants to regulate the flow of orders it receives. Before it instituted the lottery, anyone could order just by going to the website. As the pace in which orders were received exceeded the pace at which they MM builds ukuleles, the wait list got longer and that became a source of stress for Gordon and Char. The whole idea of a lottery is to regulate (and slow down) the pace it which orders come in, because what I'm sure Gordon and Char want is to relieve some of the pressure of a wait list that's 14 months long and continuing to get longer. Of the ways to regulate the flow of incoming orders, (including a lottery for a specified number of slots, saying no to some people but not others, or closing the build list) the one that seems the fairest due to its randomness is the lottery. I applaud them for running the kind of business they want instead of letting the business run them. "

No... I do get it and that is why I responded with my first ever post.. as I was compelled to do so.
Compelled why..?

Because I worked for companies that had a greater demand than they were able to produce.
I taught business management and customer service for high line Euro Auto makers.
I am now self employed and cannot keep up with demand. I fill orders as they are received.

And now we see that the "lottery" has been abandoned, as it should be.
It was senseless and not at all "fair".

First come, first served.
It is not a game, it's business... good business.