Graph Tech Ratio Tuners

I was just thinking about this thread. Has anyone contacted GraphTech directly? While I know of other ukulele sites and forums, this is one of the most active when it comes to people who work on and modify their own instruments. If I were GraphTech, I wouldn’t want the negative PR this thread is producing and I’d want to get to the bottom of the issue. Maybe The Ukulele Site is doing that already (reaching out to the company), but it would be good-particularly some of you who were in contact with the company when these were announced in January-to reach out again?
 
Choirguy said:
Maybe The Ukulele Site is doing that already (reaching out to the company)...
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I bet they have contacted the company. You don't make money by giving replacement parts away. I'm sure GraphTech will tweak the formula or the design and get them to be perfect.
 
gochugogi said:
Yeah, I'd rather have those Kala geared tuners! It's a HMS "custom" Kala Elite Koa. Basically the 1KOA-T model but with an ebony fingerboard, bridge and binding. Oh, and those Ratio tuners. And I do like it but it's only been 2 weeks so I'm still experimenting with strings and messing with the action. I changed the strings 3 times so the tuners got a workout and failed...
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Well, it's good you found out while it's under warranty. What a nuisance, having to keep waiting for replacements instead of playing. I have a concert with very low action and Oasis strings and a tenor with low/average action and Martin Premium strings. They both sound great. I used a wound C on the concert, but the tenor didn't need it. Let me know what you settle on, you have more experience than I do by far. That's a gorgeous instrument--the satin finish and dark binding are striking. I hope you two settle into a good relationship.
 
Actually I'm only a few blocks from HMS and they keep a big bag of ratio tuners at ready. It only takes a couple minutes to change and they do in on the spot!
 
gochugogi said:
Actually I'm only a few blocks from HMS and they keep a big bag of ratio tuners at ready. It only takes a couple minutes to change and they do in on the spot!
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Lucky! Although it's probably best I don't live anywhere near a ukulele store.
 
I cannot regard tuning pegs as cheap, disposable items. They should be a "fit it and forget it" component. I don't care how inexpensive they are, if they cannot be relied upon, totally, then I would not be interested in buying.

YMMV

John Colter
 
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Bill1 said:
The Ratio plastic tuners are still very close to a prototype stage. They have some teething problems no doubt, but are a low cost solution.

If they can be produced at a low enough price, then you would probably keep a spare set in your case with your spare set of strings. If you can get ten sets for the same price as one steel set, maybe you would buy three or four sets and keep some spares?
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Well, the Ratio tuners are $29.95 vs $65 for Gotoh UTPs, so Ratios have a long ways to go in terms of both cost cutting and reliability.
 
I have a different mindset about this: I feel the hardware on an instrument should last for a lifetime, and not just for sustainability, but also because I'd assume that the breaking of a tuner puts a lot of stress and potential damage on an instrument. To me, this is still a knockoff with several disadvantages over the real thing. I'd happily pay twice the price for real Gotohs if I don't have to worry about them breaking or slipping. Also not keen on putting extra screw holes in an instrument for tuners that might end up failing.
 
Rakelele said:
I have a different mindset about this: I feel the hardware on an instrument should last for a lifetime, and not just for sustainability, but also because I'd assume that the breaking of a tuner puts a lot of stress and potential damage on an instrument. To me, this is still a knockoff with several disadvantages over the real thing. I'd happily pay twice the price for real Gotohs if I don't have to worry about them breaking or slipping. Also not keen on putting extra screw holes in an instrument for tuners that might end up failing.
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Right. Although the Gotohs are twice the price, they look better and work better, and they are a plus when selling an instrument. Regardless how inexpensive an item is, if it's not reliable, people won't want to buy it. I find it hard to believe that Ratio didn't test these tuners sufficiently to find weak points before selling them to the masses. If people here have had so many failures, what is happening with the Ratio buyers who haven't posted here?
 
Rakelele said:
I have a different mindset about this: I feel the hardware on an instrument should last for a lifetime, and not just for sustainability, but also because I'd assume that the breaking of a tuner puts a lot of stress and potential damage on an instrument. To me, this is still a knockoff with several disadvantages over the real thing. I'd happily pay twice the price for real Gotohs if I don't have to worry about them breaking or slipping. Also not keen on putting extra screw holes in an instrument for tuners that might end up failing.
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Agree. To me, the only real use of these tuners would be for an Outdoor, as that would truly make them outdoor friendly, and they won't hurt those ukes if they break. . Their failure rate would hurt Outdoors reputation however.
 
One more Graph Tech Ratio Tuner on my Kala Koa Elite has bit the dust, this time the one for the low G string. Like before, it quickly detunes when taken up to pitch, dropping about a whole step in a second or so. So three out of four. The good news is HMS customer service is truly excellent and they will replace the Ratio tuners—free of charge—with a set of Gotoh UPTs. I left my Kala Koa Elite at the shop and they said I can pick it up tomorrow afternoon.

Incidentally, we checked out another ukulele with the Graph Tech Ratio Tuners installed and two failed out the gate, detuning rapidly...
 
Wow, that's weird with the de-winding, I haven't had any of that with mine, they turn very smoothly and hold well, although one of mine snapped off. So far so good with the replacement. I expect they will work out the kinks. They work as well as Grover 9s, I like tuning from the back, and they look better IMO. I'll eventually buy more.
 
I’m disappointed with graph tech results so far. I really wanted them to work. Maybe they will find a solution? Frankly I was surprised when I was on HMS that Kala Elites had them on for the overall price of the Elite instrument. I also saw some Tydes with them. Let’s hope is get figured out. I have to agree, HMS are great. Going above And beyond to fix. You will be happier with Gotoh UPT I’m sure.

One could do the graphtech change out if only one failed and replacement supplied on a cheaper instrument but for me when you are in the +$900 and up, I would not want them on instrument as they currently ship.

I really like that Koa Elite you picked. Nice model. Good luck
 
The Gotoh UPTs are amazing on my Koa Elite: extremely precise, handsome and fast and easy to tune with. A wee twitch of the knob and the tuning is locked in. The Ratios—not considering the mechanical failures—were really smooth but sloppy and imprecise, requiring a lot of back and forth. And, yeah, the Ratios were ugly and cheap looking compared to the UPTs.
 
gochugogi said:
.......—I find them smoother turning than my Gotoh UPT but less responsive. That is, if I make a small adjustment, nothing happens so I make a bigger one and it skips over the pitch.....
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If that is the case, I can already do that with friction pegs! LOL
 
Gochugogi,
With the new UPT in Place on your Kala Elite are there any holes visible where the graph tech we held in place?
Your experience is why I would expect UPT on that caliber of instrument. HMS has a very similar mahogany with white top binding and it had open back geared tuners. I Loved the sound of that tenor. Missed getting it as it sold. I think UPT is the way to go. hopefully graphtech do a second generation and fix the problems. Maybe to to metal or combination of metal and plastic or better plastic and more pre use gear movements.
 
Yes, there are tiny screw holes and they were filled with matching wood filler. I'd never notice unless I looked closely. Luckily the Ratios use really small screws. Some of my other instruments had big screws and left massive potholes!

And, yeah, I loved the sound of the dog hair Elite they had at HMS. I was going to buy it but decided not to since it has the same crappy Ratio tuners (they failed while I was trying it out in the shop!). Instead I bought the standard doghair Elite directly from Kala, albeit I might miss the ebony board, at least no plastic tuner...
 
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