Comparison Tests of Nut Material

Jerryc41

Jerryc41

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Comparison Tests of Saddle Material

This is a 34+ minute video comparing saddle material, but I didn't see conclusions. Maybe if I watched it all the way through...

There was too much chatting. I was hoping for a summary at the end. I'll post this and then hope I can post the link - from HMS.

"Give me the facts, ma'am, just the facts."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Yq...-64990669&mc_cid=c83b305ec1&mc_eid=6fdcc5f552
 
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Actually the comparison is for the different types of saddle materials. I don’t think nut material makes enough of a difference to matter... obviously none on barred chords.

I scanned through the video. The conclusion I got was more applicable for dogs.

The other conclusion is that people have preferences and will tend to favor what they like.

But it is an interesting discussion, one that has gone on for years. Luthiers are the ones that probably can offer the most input. One constant is that natural materials will vary some, whereas man-made will be more consistent.

John
 
After some additional thought, I can understand the obvious as to why dogs prefer a bone saddle.

John
 
The video talks about how ebony is warmer and then I noticed my Ken Timms has ebony and it is not warm!
I did upgrade the spruce fluke saddle to whatever plastic saddle they had to a bone one and it cut off the higher harmonics making the uke a lot warmer
 
The conclusion was that saddle material makes a small difference compared to the actual build quality and properties of the body itself. They compared it to performance cars where the body is the engine. Saddle, nut, strings, etc are like tuning with bigger injectors, cams, etc. You have to start with a good engine, and pick parts the match to get the performance you want.

As for the materials themselves... Going from bright with lots of sustain to warmer but less sustain was: bone, Tusq, rosewood, ebony. I don’t know why they bothered with plastic. Some felt the wood saddles gave that “authentic HI sound”, others thought the ebony lost too much up top - like turning the tone knob all the way down. YMMV depending on the instrument and play style.
 
Pardon me, are we running out of bones that we need to get replacement materials? I always thought a high quality uke always uses bone. I would expect minimum to be a Tusq for a high end uke.
 
AustinHing said:
Pardon me, are we running out of bones that we need to get replacement materials? I always thought a high quality uke always uses bone. I would expect minimum to be a Tusq for a high end uke.
Click to expand...

Why limit yourself based on what’s “proper”? If a particular uke sounds better to your ears with a rosewood saddle, then use a rosewood saddle. That being said, I don’t think anyone’s ever thought to themselves, “gee... this instrument would really sing if only the saddle were plastic”. ��
 
Early on in the video they showed a chart that compared sound frequencies of various bridge materials. It was shown too briefly to be useful, however. As for the "testing" during this video, it was more of a gab session coupled with sound bites.

To me (at least) it was NOT very well done or useful. But then ... I'm a cranky old f**t so.. what do I know?
 
SpaceForRent said:
Why limit yourself based on what’s “proper”? If a particular uke sounds better to your ears with a rosewood saddle, then use a rosewood saddle. That being said, I don’t think anyone’s ever thought to themselves, “gee... this instrument would really sing if only the saddle were plastic”. ��
Click to expand...
Well you have a point but I generally don’t think too much on the effect a saddle material might has on the sound. Action height yes. So to me it’s aesthetic purpose. I kind of not liking a wood based saddle. Even with the harder wood, the strings most probably will cut into the wooden saddle over time and hence lower the original action height which is kind of not ideal. Just my thoughts only.
 
AustinHing said:
Pardon me, are we running out of bones that we need to get replacement materials? I always thought a high quality uke always uses bone. I would expect minimum to be a Tusq for a high end uke.
Click to expand...

It just seems wrong to go out and kill a bison just to get that little piece of bone. :)
 
I hoping that’s not the case but more likely the bone as a by-product came from an animal slaughter for food, i.e. cow, lamb etc.
 
I saw this video last night (skipped through it mostly). I was a little bit tempted to leave a comment with time links to jump to each sound sample, but then I lost motivation. I thought there were considerable differences in sound. I thought the NuBone sounded pretty good, which is convenient as I think that's what's on most of my ukes. The bone/nubone/tusq sounded pretty similar to me though and I doubt I'd appreciate the difference without a side by side comparison. Did not like the rosewood sound - thought the plastic sounded better! I like the look of an ebony saddle/nut, but seems like a downgrade from NuBone unless I was just hanging it on the wall.
 
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Jerryc41 said:
"Give me the facts, ma'am, just the facts."
Click to expand...

Facts? Hmm. Depending on the instrument, strings, how you play, the sounds you like to hear etc, you may like one saddle material over another.
Listen for a data point if you care. Beyond that... my opinion that plastic sounded bad. If you have a plastic saddle maybe it's worth changing.

Jerryc41 said:
There was too much chatting.
Click to expand...

Haha, you could say that about this place.

bellgamin said:
Early on in the video they showed a chart that compared sound frequencies of various bridge materials. It was shown too briefly to be useful, however. As for the "testing" during this video, it was more of a gab session coupled with sound bites.

To me (at least) it was NOT very well done or useful. But then ... I'm a cranky old f**t so.. what do I know?
Click to expand...

Don't worry, the chart was just Tusq propaganda. And we're just having a conversation and trying some stuff. I wasn't trying to get anyone to change their saddle. But we do get the question once in a while and had never compared them like this. I'm not that good at this stuff but figured if we keep doing it we'll get better.
 
I enjoyed this video. Good work Andrew and the gang. I Would love to hear what a Ebony saddle + Nut sounds like on some modern ukes.
I'd probably get some ebony on one of mine if I could find someone close that could make/install it (I might ask LoPrinzi if that is a option in the future).
 
glennerd said:
...I doubt I'd appreciate the difference without a side by side comparison.
Click to expand...

Right! And the difference would be just that - a difference. Aside from the plastic, it seems that anything a uke-maker uses as a saddle will sound good. He's not going to use something he considers inferior just to save a dollar a uke.

I'd still like to see which material produces better highs, lows, sustains, volumes - whatever - in the form of a chart or graph, like the graph on the Tusque tag. Not that one is vastly superior, but that there is a difference. My Bonanza Oreo uses Corian for the nut and saddle, and people have liked the sound. Even Baz praised it.
 
I have varying types of saddle materials on my ukuleles and in my experience it is more that just swapping out saddles on the same uke. Different instruments react differently. An overly bright ukulele may not benefit from a saddle that brings out the highs; there is string to string balance to consider.

Tuning (Bb, B, C and high/low 4th string) and strings have a bigger impact on tone than saddle material. That said, I will swap out a saddle if I’m close and think the small tweak will get me there.

John
 
I agree with John. Though I'm still new to this, I'm quickly realizing what sounds I can (and can't) get out of my instruments. I had bought a set of 2 ebony nuts and saddles for a future project purely for the aesthetics. But after watching this video, I installed one of the saddles on my overly-bright cheap laminate tenor. It's still a cheap tenor, but the ebony saddle did warm up the sound just a bit. Totally worth it for a part that cost about $1.50.
 
Beau did nice, short video comparing saddle/nut materials.

 
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