remove or limit the "delete post" option

dwizum

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I've been lurking on this forum for some time and have just recently registered and become active. I have a suggestion regarding the delete post option - I looked back through several years of suggestions in here and didn't see it mentioned so I thought I'd make a new thread.

Through that time, I've noticed a strange trend. It seems that some users are in the regular habit of deleting all of their posts a few days after they make them (maybe it's only one user? the very nature of the posts getting deleted makes it hard to know).

Coming at this as someone new to the forum, one of the most valuable aspects here is the fact that there are years and years of old threads - endless hours of good reading material.

However, I regularly find myself frustrated - and the reading material reduced significantly in value - because some posts are missing from some threads. Even if a specific post doesn't contain anything unique or special, forum threads often take on a conversational nature and it's really hard to follow a conversation when some parts are missing - which makes even the remaining posts from other users less valuable.

All that to say, it seems like this is destructive to the intent of the forum and reduces it's value for other users. If people want to post transient content, maybe they'd be better suited on a platform designed to purge content automatically.

I'm not sure why this is happening or why people are deleting content here - maybe there are good reasons that I'm not aware of and I should just shut up and move on. But I wanted to post a suggestion here, since on other forums where I participate, users are only allowed to delete or edit their posts for X number of minutes - which allows enough time to fix quick spelling mistakes or delete an accidental duplicate post - but after which, if there is a legitimate need to remove content, they can talk to a moderator. This seems to help preserve the value of the material on the forum. Could this be implemented here?
 
I for one value having no time restrictions on my posts, I often don't find a spelling error or that I left out something I want to say in context, so I'd much rather be able to edit, or even delete at my discretion, especially if there are many posts in between. There have been occasions where I wrote something completely invalid and was glad I could delete the post later.


This is Michael Kohan in Los Angeles, Beverly Grove near the Beverly Center
9 tenor cutaway ukes, 4 acoustic bass ukes, 12 solid body bass ukes, 14 mini electric bass guitars (Total: 39)

• Donate to The Ukulele Kids Club, they provide ukuleles to children in hospital music therapy programs. www.theukc.org
• Member The CC Strummers: YouTube: www.youtube.com/user/CCStrummers/video, Facebook: www.facebook.com/TheCCStrummers
 
I delete all posts after a few days and keep my count to below 100.

I do not see bulletin boards as being encyclopaedias to store years of knowledge, I see them as a place to discuss things. Once you say something in a conversation, it vanishes into thin air as the sound energy dissipates. If you want to save something you need to be following the conversation and have a notebook handy. In the case of UU, it is very easy to save a quote in a post.

The best way to find something out with your ukulele is to discover it yourself. Finding an old post just spoils the fun for many new players. There is a big thrill in finding out something that is new to you, but may be centuries old. Also many discussion topics and arguments always end up the same way, they just keep repeating the same thing over and over, I am not going to deprive new players of the fun of discovery. If you get stuck on something, then you can easily post a story and ask a question and get an answer. Sometimes I don't answer questions directly, so you can work out the answer for yourself, which is another great way to have fun with your ukulele.

If you look at the Wikipedia, which is allegedly a real encyclopaedia, it has turned into a big computer game with erudite geeks putting in new competing edits every day on almost every topic. look at the History TAB on any Wiki page. I follow a thing run by the Australian National Library (NLA) called Trove, it has copies of thousands of newspapers and text from a text reader. A small group of very helpful (not) people sit on their devices all day "correcting" the text, so while they cannot change the scanned picture of the newspaper, they keep changing the text which is effectively the index and you cannot find things anymore without looking at every page. Some have been congratulated for making more than 1 million "corrections". Just little things like "clarifying" weather info so it looks better for climate change arguments their friends have. The idea that the internet is a reliable source of information is rapidly dying as these geeks damage more and more of the data and indexes. So I don't have any issue with deleting posts, at least no-one can edit them or steal them in 20 years if they are not there, and ukuleles will still be a four stringed instrument, mostly made out of wood. You should stop relying on the internet for important information, unless you can verify it yourself, there is a good chance that it has been edited to suit some Geek's politics.

If you want serious music lessons fork out some cash and pay a good teacher. There are plenty to choose from. A good music teacher is worth 100 UU forums. If you have a question, post a question. You do not need to be spending all day sorting through old posts, there are much better things to do with your time, like play your ukulele.

Thanks Bill for providing your perspective. I can see we disagree on a few things, which is okay. Personally, I guess I just think it's a bit of a shame to destroy old material when there's a chance someone might find it useful some day, which is why I posted this suggestion. I appreciate you explaining your views and I hope you take the time to consider mine.

And thanks for expressing concern about how I spend my time and how I learn. I can assure you that I do understand the value of spending time playing an instrument, employing a good teacher when needed, and posting specific questions when I have them. Those are all important things though and I'm sure that many beginners would do well to consider them. I'm pretty confident though that I learned many of the basics in the 25 years I spent building, repairing, and playing ukuleles and other stringed instruments before even knowing Ukulele Underground existed.

All that said, I do also consider myself a lifelong learner, and I do enjoy reading old discussions as a way of supporting my desire to learn. Even on topics I'm already familiar with, I find it educational to learn from the experiences of others by reading old material. I also respect the time of people who answer questions, and I don't really feel there would be benefit in just constantly flooding a forum with the same questions over and over again simply because old content has been deleted.

Finally, I hope you can see the irony in your second to last paragraph - you're claiming that "geeks" are actively ruining the reliability of information on the internet, yet at the same time you're removing your own (valuable!) content, which is essentially resulting in the same end result - less availability of reliable information.
 
dwizum,

While I absolutely respect the rights of others to eliminate their old posts (Johannes Brahms requested all correspondence from others at the end of his life and burned anything he didn't want the world to see--how's that for a mindset about your legacy), I'm with you on this one.

There have been a number of times that a thread on Ukulele Underground has appeared as a result of a search query elsewhere (e.g. Google) when I'm trying to find the answer to a ukulele-related issue. I also rely on Ukulele Underground as another way to value a ukulele that I want to buy or sell. There are a number of people that go back and delete the sales information before closing their thread--again, absolutely their right, but at the same time, those that leave that data ultimately inform others.

I don't think a deleted comment deletes "quoted" material, so even if people deleted their original post, it could still be in the thread, although confusing to read afterward. If a person wanted to spend all their time doing so, they could simply respond to all posts with a quote, guaranteeing that the material stayed available. Don't do that...but I'm just saying it is possible.

I have had to ask moderators to delete a few posts that I started as responses turned really negative--and they will do that if you ask (and they also sense a negative tone). UU doesn't go negative very often, so it is pretty shocking when it happens.

All that said, we had a bit of a scare earlier this year where there was a real risk that this forum could be closed, which I would miss (with the suggestion of moving to Discord, which just doesn't operate in a similar way). So it could be that we could wake up some morning and this all would be gone, immediately, without any warning.
 
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I do not see bulletin boards as being encyclopaedias to store years of knowledge, I see them as a place to discuss things. Once you say something in a conversation, it vanishes into thin air as the sound energy dissipates.

This is a forum, not a bulletin board, its purpose is to keep information available.

Use a chat program if you want your info to 'disappear'.

Social media is about as near to a bulletin board as we have now, maybe you should be on one of those, & not this forum.


I agree, we should be able to 'edit' our thread posts, but not to delete them entirely. :music:
 
I don't, but others will - oh, yes, I have a good life - for all the seventy years of it - never been rich, quite often on the bread line, but I have been very lucky to have had good health, thankfully.

I came late to computers, (& house telephones, for that matter) - no, I don't have a mobile phone - no, I don't need to be constantly in touch with people on the internet - I use forums to discuss with like minded people on various subjects that the forums are about. :music:
 
That is an odd situation. I don't think I've ever deleted one of my posts. I believe there are some restrictions on what you can delete.

I think you can pay to get a higher level of membership that includes unlimited messages. That's an incentive to upgrade.

One thing I like about this site is the ability to edit a post at any time, not necessarily delete it, but make edits. Another forum I use limits editing time to one hour.
 
There have been occasions where I wrote something completely invalid and was glad I could delete the post later.


This is Michael Kohan in Los Angeles, Beverly Grove near the Beverly Center
9 tenor cutaway ukes, 4 acoustic bass ukes, 12 solid body bass ukes, 14 mini electric bass guitars (Total: 39)

• Donate to The Ukulele Kids Club, they provide ukuleles to children in hospital music therapy programs. www.theukc.org
• Member The CC Strummers: YouTube: www.youtube.com/user/CCStrummers/video, Facebook: www.facebook.com/TheCCStrummers

Good point.
 
I don't think UU has a chat forum. Its just a bulletin board. I have seen all the iterations of bulletin boards over the years and lived maybe 40 years of my life without needing a device or telephone in my pocket. I know what it is like to just have no internet, it really is relaxing and free, and much better than what you have today. It is sad to see so many young people who have never known anything else miss out on so much stuff because they have to be connected to social media every waking minute.

Now you can't even bear deleting posts because you might want to read them next year. Do you have a life?

If you really like the information I post send me a PM and we can arrange a commercial agreement for me to generate content for your book or music history assignment or what ever commercial thing you are collecting the information for, I can generate a lot more "discussion" than I post on UU.

I leave posts on the board for what I think is long enough for UU members to read them. I think that is enough. The board owners can ask me to save data or any other member can cut and paste it if they feel a need to keep it, as has happened in this thread. One of the problems with the board is the hefty amount of saved data. If every member deleted 10% of their posts, how much would that improve the service?

If you're going to resort to accusing other forum members of not having a life, or having some secret conspiracy to use your content in a commercial fashion, I'm not sure you and I have enough common ground to continue discussing this topic together, but in the spirit of participating I'll try to explain my position again. Frankly, I'm not sure how we got to the point of insults or accusations, given how positive and receptive this community is in general. Considering how strongly you feel about protecting the things you write, I'm wondering if you might be happier focusing on an online community where either content is protected or automatically deleted, or there are explicitly stated license terms for posted content? Deleting your posts a few days after you make them isn't stopping any of the web crawlers or archive engines from grabbing them. "Geeks" with strong politics or thieves interested in stealing content for commercial purposes aren't sitting at a laptop reading old forums one post at a time, they're using automated software to capture everything shortly after you hit the post button. And since there's no license stated anywhere on this site (that I can find at least) there isn't anything stopping someone from doing whatever they want with what you write, even if you delete it a day later.

Let's be clear though - my only interest is being able to read a thread - for my own personal enjoyment - without having to guess and fill in the gaps. I'm going to state that again because you seem interested in making assumptions otherwise. Even if we assume for the sake of argument that your posts have no valuable content, deleting them just results in the thread being very difficult to read. I don't sit on this forum every day, so yes - as already stated - sometimes I am reading threads more than a day after they were written. The presence of a search function and an archive section tells me that the people who set this forum up intended members to have access to older content, so I don't think my desire is in any way unfit for this site.

One final thought:

If you really like the information I post

Ironically, I can't answer that, because you delete all your posts before I get a chance to read them! :) Once again, let me state: this isn't about you (I didn't even know who you were until you posted here, and I certainly didn't intend to single you out or engage you) and it isn't about the specific content of what you post. It's about maintaining the integrity of the threads you participate in - it's about keeping everything usable, readable, and valuable.

I'd love to continue to hear from others. Thank you Keith, choirguy, and Mike for contributing your thoughts.
 
I've seen previous threads about deleting posts and tried to find how to do it myself (for comments which had low relevance/value to conversation). After trying on various browsers, I started to suspect they removed this option to users who signed on after a certain date. Not sure if this is the case, but I can't find an option to delete.
 
I've seen previous threads about deleting posts and tried to find how to do it myself (for comments which had low relevance/value to conversation). After trying on various browsers, I started to suspect they removed this option to users who signed on after a certain date. Not sure if this is the case, but I can't find an option to delete.

I can't find one either. However, you can edit your post and delete most of it, leaving the minimal prose, e.g., this content has been deleted for the safety and well-being of all concerned.
 
And it isn't about you, either.

I hope I never gave the impression that I thought otherwise. I made a suggestion in the suggestions forum, that's all. I thought that was the intent of the suggestion forum? To solicit suggestions? I'm not sure how doing so is "making it about me."

The reason why I addressed the "this isn't about you" comment at Bill is because I wanted to help him understand that I hadn't started this thread to single him out, cause conflict with him specifically, or otherwise target him. I legitimately wouldn't have even known who he was, or that he was deleting his posts, if he hadn't responded to this thread. It seemed like he was getting agitated, so I was trying to reassure him that I wasn't trying to be confrontational. This may be a case of the context being lost in the text. I'm sure if we were all talking about this face to face it would be easier to pick up on.

So, to be clear - I'm not trying to pick a fight, I'm just offering an idea. If no one agrees, that's fine, my feelings aren't hurt. Hopefully this thread can get back on track and focus on the idea (whether in support or not) instead of veering off track.
 
I've deleted many attachments, because they sometimes show up rotated so I need to replace them with photos in the correct orientation. I think the trick is going to the "advanced" editor versus the quick edit, and then looking down near the bottom - there's a manage attachments button that opens a new window, and you can then select and delete individual attachments.
 
I have deleted one of my post as I do not want to feed the forum members who hijacked my thread.

Of course they have their right to express themselves, but they shall open a separate thread and not steal mine.
 
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Yeah I'll tend to give a search before asking so Im not asking the same thing that may have been asked like the previous month. On my moped site we actually hound the noobs to do some research before being spoon-fed. I know, we're evil. Maybe doing weird builds we do makes it really useful to find how someone before you actually pulled it off.

I do see all the points about playing instead of reading though. I spend more time reading than I should. For example, now.
 
Yes, the delete post function is available, but only for a while after a post, I'm not exactly sure for how long. Wait too long to delete and it's locked in forever. The delete function can be accessed under Edit Post, you can do it from there. Wish I'd known and been doing it sooner, kinda embarassed to have so many posts...get a life! :)

No need to be embarrassed by your number of posts, John. They are proof that you are a strong, active supporter of the Forum. That’s something to be proud of. And you don’t need to get a life. You already have one... right here with all of your ukulele friends. :)
 
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Yeah I'll tend to give a search before asking so Im not asking the same thing that may have been asked like the previous month. On my moped site we actually hound the noobs to do some research before being spoon-fed. I know, we're evil. Maybe doing weird builds we do makes it really useful to find how someone before you actually pulled it off.

I do see all the points about playing instead of reading though. I spend more time reading than I should. For example, now.

I visit another site every day, and it's common for members to tell people to search for an answer before asking a question. The problem is that searching rarely does any good. Aside from that, one of the purposes of a forum is communication. The is practically nothing I find here that I can't find using Google, but that's not why come here. This is as much a social site as an informational site. If someone can berate a member for not using Search, he can take the time to supply an answer.

EDIT: I just did a search for Ohana, and I got 20 pages. Many of the posts had no mention of Ohana.
 
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Bill 1 has replied (to the thread) directly above my post, but how long it will stay there for I don’t know - usually not particularly long. (Edit. It ended up being hours if that). I take his several points but disagree with his logic, I’m also frustrated at his habit of deleting his posts: often his content is very good and just the type of stuff that’s worth archiving for future reference. Some of the information he supplies or points that he makes can be exceedingly hard to find out elsewhere - and ironically if I manage to then it’s because someone has decided to leave the details as an on-line legacy for others to benefit from.

With the current software difficulties on this forum I often delete posts and start again, we need that facility. Sometimes I’ll edit an old post to correct an error or to add detail, we need that facility. Occasionally I’ll look at something and wonder why I said that or chose those particular words, sometimes it’s both wise and civil to edit our posts and we need that facility.

I do dislike people taking information out of their posts, but it’s their choice to exercise their option or not.

Yes, the delete post function is available, but only for a while after a post, I'm not exactly sure for how long. Wait too long to delete and it's locked in forever. The delete function can be accessed under Edit Post, you can do it from there. Wish I'd known and been doing it sooner, kinda embarassed to have so many posts...get a life! :)

No need to be embarrassed by your number of posts, John. They are proof that you are a strong, active supporter of the Forum. That’s something to be proud of. And you don’t need to get a life. You already have one... right here with all of your ukulele friends. :)

:agree: (with Jan)
 
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