Modified Saddle advice - remove shims or new saddle?

TQuest

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Newbie looking for advice about a saddle. I hope this is the right forum.

I purchased a used 2012 Islander MST-4 last month, with a missing string and a motivated seller. After watching lots of YouTube vids, I put on a new set of Martin fluorocarbon M620. Allowed 4+ weeks for strings to settle, but I noticed that the C string sounded rather dull to my ears – strangely, it’s sustain and brightness did not match the C on my other tenors. I sent an email to Islander about the original strings and they replied Aquila Super Nylgut.

I have been curious about the single Aquila Red C string, so bought one and went to swap it out a couple of days ago. Went to give the ukulele a closer inspection and cleaning while changing the C, and when I took out the saddle I saw that it had not 1, but 2 shims under the original – one flat and one angled. The angled shim made the action higher on the G and C string side. The intonation at the 12th fret is correct on G, sharp on C and E, and flat on A.

At this point, I’m not sure if I should remove the 1 angled shim to make the saddle flat, remove both shims to get back to the original saddle height – the action feels high to my taste, measuring between 3.0 and 3.5 mm on G and just under 3.0 mm on A at the 12th fret – or replace it with an entirely new saddle from GraphTech.

I’m also wondering if the saddle height was adjusted for reasons other than higher action – buzzing on high frets?

Any advice is appreciated.
 

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Hmm, best advice is probably a full setup by someone that can check the frets as well and level if needed. If you're doing that there is no reason not to do a new saddle.

If that's too expensive, then I'd still recommend a new saddle. If it buzzes when you get the action down where you want it, then you could always go back to this saddle.
 
Newbie looking for advice about a saddle. I hope this is the right forum.

I purchased a used 2012 Islander MST-4 last month, with a missing string and a motivated seller. After watching lots of YouTube vids, I put on a new set of Martin fluorocarbon M620. Allowed 4+ weeks for strings to settle, but I noticed that the C string sounded rather dull to my ears – strangely, it’s sustain and brightness did not match the C on my other tenors. I sent an email to Islander about the original strings and they replied Aquila Super Nylgut.

I have been curious about the single Aquila Red C string, so bought one and went to swap it out a couple of days ago. Went to give the ukulele a closer inspection and cleaning while changing the C, and when I took out the saddle I saw that it had not 1, but 2 shims under the original – one flat and one angled. The angled shim made the action higher on the G and C string side. The intonation at the 12th fret is correct on G, sharp on C and E, and flat on A.

At this point, I’m not sure if I should remove the 1 angled shim to make the saddle flat, remove both shims to get back to the original saddle height – the action feels high to my taste, measuring between 3.0 and 3.5 mm on G and just under 3.0 mm on A at the 12th fret – or replace it with an entirely new saddle from GraphTech.

I’m also wondering if the saddle height was adjusted for reasons other than higher action – buzzing on high frets?

Any advice is appreciated.


wow, those look like some beefy shims! I think saddles are pretty inexpensive. You could buy one and sand from the bottom. I just did an eBay search for TUSQ ukulele saddle and one came up for like $12. Like Jim said, what's the worst that could happen? you could just put the old saddle back in.
 
Setup is a pretty personal thing - it's hard to advise if you should or should not lower the saddle, or why it's set up un-level now, since those things mostly boil down to personal taste. I do know some players who like a slightly different action for each string (usually slightly higher on lower pitched strings) so it's not unheard of for a saddle to not be flat.

If you feel the action is too high, then by all means try lowering it! The good news about shims is it makes an action change pretty harmless - you can pull out a shim, tune it up, and see how you like the action. Once you get an idea for where you want it to be, then yes - it does make sense to put in a new saddle, cut to the correct height, and discard the shims. Shims aren't inherently bad, but they're pretty hard to do perfectly, so most people would probably consider it "best practice" to not use them permanently in an instrument.

An off the shelf compensated saddle should get your intonation closer. Or you can buy a straight saddle and compensate it yourself and get it dead on (although if the saddle witness point was already close to the front edge on the A, you may not be able to solve it being flat since you may be out of adjustment to move it forwards).

If you do decide to try a new saddle, it may make sense to just go ahead and order two - they're really cheap after all, and then if you mess one up (cut it too low, etc) you'll have a spare ready to go.
 
Thanks for all the good advice. I plan to order a new saddle, and checked the GraphTech website to find a matching replacement TUSQ saddle, but none of the models available were exact matches in measurement to the one from my MST-4 - the closest ones are the PQ-9250 and the PQ-9275. So I sent a message to Islander asking them which one is used on the MST-4, which I plan on ordering asap.
 
I would suggest trying the saddle it has now without the shims. Note how it plays and feels to you and the height. If it works well for you, with no buzzing, then you're good to go. Even if you still go with a new saddle, this would give you more info to go on before fitting the new one.
 
I would suggest trying the saddle it has now without the shims. Note how it plays and feels to you and the height. If it works well for you, with no buzzing, then you're good to go. Even if you still go with a new saddle, this would give you more info to go on before fitting the new one.

Thank you for the tip, jer. I've been trying to order a replacement from Kanile'a / Islander but have not been successful - I will acknowledge they are very busy with the recent opening of their new shop. I was trying to experiment so I could have one saddle without the shims and one with it, in case the shims were installed to correct any buzzing or sound issue.

I'm at the point where I don't want to wait any longer for a replacement, and will probably remove the shims this weekend and go back to the original saddle height. I'll just try and deal with any potential issues that may come up.
 
Last night I removed the 2 shims that were glued to the saddle of my MST-4. Little bits of the shim were still stuck on after removal, so I smoothed them off with 220 grit sandpaper. I'm not particularly skilled so I probably took off a tiny amount of the saddle as well, but not very much.

I had also changed the strings from Martin M620 to D'Addario EJ99TLG just 5 days ago, but the thick Low G string from that set was sitting on top of the nut slot instead of in it. Rather than file the nut slot, I swapped in an Aquila Red Low G string 3 days ago and it fits fine and sounds much better than the previous Low G string - less boomy.

This morning without the shims, the Low G and C strings sound a little clearer, with a little more midrange and a little more sustain, than with the 2 shims. Maybe it's just a placebo effect, but it sounds like an improvement to my ears.

However, the negative is that the action has now been lowered from just between 3.25 and 3.5 mm to 2.25 mm and feels a bit low when I strum.
 
At least you had some positives from that. Maybe something right in between the original and this latest results would be just right. Sometimes I think you have to go too far one way and the other to hone in on exactly what you're after. So it sounds like a good experiment.
 
The shims look like an attempt to increase action possibly after the saddle was sanded too much. I had a uke with the same issue and contemplated shims, but was fortunate that a luthier friend cut a new saddle for me. You seem to be handy so I suggest you buy a replacement saddle that is a bit larger than needed and then sand it down carefully to the action you like. Also you seem to like the reds so maybe use a full set of those. Good luck.
 
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