Nut and Saddle Replacement

Tomthebaptist

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I would like to replace the nut and saddle on my Kamaka HF-3 with bone. Am looking for a good luthier to make them for me. Any recommendations?

Thanks,

Tom
 
I just had this done by Acoustic Vibes in Tempe, AZ...
 
I would like to replace the nut and saddle on my Kamaka HF-3 with bone. Am looking for a good luthier to make them for me. Any recommendations?

Thanks,

Tom

I’ve done that job myself on cheaper Ukes and it isn’t that hard to do. However yours is an expensive instrument (circa $1500?) so I can quite see that you’d want a perfect job done by a professional - think it will cost you quite a bit though. When I checked the SUS site I see that this model Uke is fitted with a bone nut and a bone saddle, I wonder whether they have made an error or whether the spec has changed?

Did you notice a difference?

Every time I’ve fitted a bone saddle and nut it’s made a noticeable improvement over Nu-bone and the like. However I’m puzzled as to why an expensive Uke might need these changes, I’d had expected the material used to be perfectly suitable. I’m wondering whether anyone has approached Kamaka about any aspects of the change or the work.
 
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I’ve done that job myself on cheaper Ukes and it isn’t that hard to do. However yours is an expensive instrument (circa $1500?) so I can quite see that you’d want a perfect job done by a professional - think it will cost you quite a bit though. When I checked the SUS site I see that this model Uke is fitted with a bone nut and a bone saddle, I wonder whether they have made an error or whether the spec has changed?

Every time I’ve fitted a bone saddle and nut it’s made a noticeable improvement over Nu-bone and the like. However I’m puzzled as to why an expensive Uke might need these changes, I’d had expected the material used to be perfectly suitable. I’m wondering whether anyone has approached Kamaka about any aspects of the change or the work.


Hi Graham, I agree with you. My HF-3 is a 2019 model. Everything about it is top-shelf except the the nut and saddle. I’m not a big fan of plastics, especially on top of the line instruments. If Pono can afford to use bone on their entry level ukuleles, I think Kamaka, Koaloha, and Keniliea could too. I too think bone makes a difference - if not in sound certainly aesthetically.

Thanks for your input.

Tom
 
Well if you don't like the looks of the present setup then by all means make a change. But I'd be quite surprised if the present nut and saddle are actually cheap "plastic", and not some type of engineered material such as NuBone or Graph Tech. I'll be the contrarian here and submit that most folks would not be able to tell the difference between a Graph Tech and bone saddle without looking.
 
Bone nuts and saddles are not all created equal. Since it is a natural material, some will be better than others, even if they come from the same source. This is just one of the reasons that I, personally, would not change out an engineered plastic nut and/or saddle on a quality uke unless they needed to be replaced.
Many makers use the engineered plastics because they yield consistent and predictable results.. which cannot be said for bone.
Other reasons that I would discourage doing that would be the expense, and the potential for damage to the uke, even if done by a luthier.
Of course, it’s your uke.... but...
 
Graphtech nuts And saddles are excellent. I‘Ve changed them on guitars. KoAloha uses them on their instruments. I had a KoAloha Opio tenor with one and. It was fine. I thought Kamaka used bone but guess not. First, I would inspect nut slots and make sure they were fine. Is set up good? Then try new strings. After that, if you aren’t happy, and can find someone good to replace with bone, go for it.

On ukulele I’m suspect of guitar tech ( not all created equal) on set up change! However, if you find a good one.


Post results if you do. Good luck!
 
I thought Kamaka used bone but guess not.

This is actually a good point. I'm seeing some contradictory information when looking online. Most listings don't specify the material for the nut and saddle at all but I'm seeing more mentions of them being made out of TUSQ than actual bone. If I'm looking at my own Kamaka I would say that the nut and saddle are synthetic, but then again bone can have some colour variation too. Doesn't matter to me one bit but I was just curious since it's the topic for this thread. Either way, I'm confident all of the Hawaiian K brands use quality materials suitable for their ukes.
 
Thanks to everyone for your input. I decided not to swap out the nut and saddle for bone. I prefer bone, but I do not want to pay for the switch. While there may be high tech plastic alternative to bone which may be more consistent than bone, the reason it is used is to cut cost. It’s a cheap alternative. That’s my opinion which is worth about as much as a turd on a brass door knob.

Tom
 
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Thanks to everyone for your input. I decided not to swap out the nut and saddle for bone. I prefer bone, but I do not want to pay for the switch. While there may be high tech plastic alternative to bone which may be more consistent than bone, the reason it is used is to cut cost. It’s a cheap alternative. That’s my opinion which is worth about as much as a turd on a brass door knob.

Tom

When you can do so then avoiding a large bill from a Luthier seems like a good way forward to me, I think that you have made the right call on this. I don’t doubt for a moment that all engineered materials are not equal so what’s fitted may well be perfectly suitable. In my limited experience about 80% of the gains and only 20% the costs are found in changing to saddle. Changing a saddle is normally quite simple and so is reinstating the original one ... perhaps that’s a pragmatic way forward for you or someone else in a similar position.
 
It’s a cheap alternative

I'm not sure that's strictly true. Raw bone saddles at retail are maybe $5-$10 and in small quantities are basically a dollar or two each. A Graph tech (i.e. Tusq) ukulele saddle lists at $13.65 retail and usually sell around $11. Even if you assume a large scale manufacturer is getting the Tusq product at a huge discount, it doesn't seem like a place they're saving money - or at the least, it's a small enough difference that it's a wash.

If a builder is using generic molded plastic parts, yes - that's for cost savings since they're pennies each in bulk. Or if the builder is buying raw bone and cutting/shaping them to size themselves one at a time, switching to the Tusq product is an automatic labor savings since you can just slap it in. But like for like, the "brand name" plastic stuff like Tusq is not automatically cheaper than bone.
 
It might be worth dropping an email to Kamaka and asking them what the HF-3 nut and saddle are made of.

Their top models may use bone nuts and saddles. If so, they may allow you to purchase a set.
 
It might be worth dropping an email to Kamaka and asking them what the HF-3 nut and saddle are made of.

Their top models may use bone nuts and saddles. If so, they may allow you to purchase a set.

I'm pretty sure they use TUSQ compensated made specifically for them - but yes, you can purchase them directly from Kamaka. I have.
 
I'm pretty sure they use TUSQ compensated made specifically for them - but yes, you can purchase them directly from Kamaka. I have.

Thank you for this tip. I will call them. I really prefer bone. I don’t know if it makes a difference or not, I just prefer it to high tec plastics. I’ve payed Guitar for over 50 years and own a Santa Cruz OMPW a couple of Martins and a Taylor, they all have bone nut and saddle and that is what I grew up with.
 
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I was looking at some photos of my now sold Kamaka HF-3. It sure looks like the saddle and nut were synthetic. Very uniform bright white color and sharp edges and corners. Whiter than bleached bone.

I am guessing that the compensated saddle with angled surfaces would have been difficult to do in bone. Since bone is a porous material, and it is not completely uniform, they probably had too many rejected parts due to flaws or chips or thin areas breaking while manufacturing them. So, they switched to synthetic materials.

The density of the TUSQ, Nubone or whatever material they use is probably very close to buffalo or bovine bone. And the wear properties are supposed to be equal. I've read that TUSQ is supposed to be harder than Nubone. Resulting in it being brighter on guitars. Couldn't find a reference for ukes. I would think bone would be warmer than either synthetic material.

It may or may not be cheaper than bone. But it will be vegan appropriate.

I seriously doubt that I could tell the difference in sound between bone or synthetic in a blind A/B comparison test.

Bridge Saddle.jpg


I have to point out that Southern Ukulele Store has the saddle listed as "bone." I know the two rub strips on the bridge of my HF-3 were synthetic.
 
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It would be interesting to know if many could differentiate in sound between bone and composite. My gut is that few could do so, for many factors. Makes for an interesting test.

I would do the work myself. I'm good at such things. I saw this weekend a clamp that would work well in such an application: I might have to do this chore myself with my Mainland.
 
@Kenn218 If you call Kamaka, please post what you find out.

Here's a photo of the underside of a new Kamaka saddle.
It appears to be synthetic; and does not appear to be TUSQ as there are no markings.
 

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@Kenn218 If you call Kamaka, please post what you find out.

Here's a photo of the underside of a new Kamaka saddle.
It appears to be synthetic; and does not appear to be TUSQ as there are no markings.

Hi Clear, I'm not planning to call Kamaka since I no longer own my hF-3 tenor. I only suggested to Tom that he might get an answer from them if he called.
 
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