Based on some quick web searches (so take it with a large grain of salt), FSC certified wood can run 15 - 30% more than non-certified. The Iz has a MSRP of about $1800. Add 30% and you are just about there.
New Martin ukes
- Thread starter Blank Williams
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That explains a lot. Thanks Cluze.
jksk8in
Well-known member
I applied Dunlop 65 fingerboard O2 deep conditioner to my Martin OX soprano fretboard and bridge. It darkened the sipo at least a shade, and nourished the wood at the same time. Win Win!
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UkingViking
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I assume that Mahogany is not that more expensive in Nazareth than in China, the difference in crafting costs are way bigger.
Ib China they can make a solid Mahogany uke that can sell for < $300. That is after the retailers profit, the shipping from China and the lavour needed to make it. I guess the wood it self is less than $100 in that equation. Add 30% to that and you don't quite get a uke that is so much more expensive.
I dont have inside knowledge to what the wood costs, I guess the profiles active in the luthiers lounge will have a better knowledge of this. But I find it hard to believe that the wood it self is more than $500 more expensive than a non fsc alternative.
Edit: i just found a reference for mahogany where you can add 30% to the price without raising the price that much.
https://www.stewmac.com/tonewoods/s...hogany-top-back-and-side-set-for-ukulele.html
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Right, but the Iz tenor isn't made in China, it is made in Nazareth. It already has similar labor costs to the FSC concert, also made in PA. We need to compare apples to apples here, and the biggest difference between these two is the FSC certification of the wood used.
Now if you want to argue that the 30% premium should only apply to the wood and not to the full cost, that is certainly a flaw in my very simplistic back-of-the-envelope calculation. But we can't really compare the cost of a US built Martin instrument to the cost of a large-scale factory made instrument from China.
I also suspect there is a huge difference between the quality of the mahogany used at a large factory in China compared to the wood used by Martin in Nazareth, let alone the FSC certified wood used in this case.
It is all a bit like "organic" food. It is the same stuff, in theory. But it had to be farmed a specific way, adhering to specific rules, and is therefore much more costly to bring to market. Therefore they charge a premium. A lot of people don't care, and won't pay that premium. But to those who *do* care, it is important to them and they will happily pay that premium. Is it worth it? Maybe.
Personally, I think the FSC concert is way too expensive. For that cost I could have a luthier built instrument made just for me, using wood I have chosen.
glennerd
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Martin can list a 5K for $4500, so standard markup doesn't always need to apply when you're Martin.
This is a *very* good point.
UkeStuff
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I've watched many of Martin's own historical and promotional content as it comes to ukulele, and it certainly seems that Japan is a primary target of their new instruments. I'd be willing to bet that you can go to most of Martin's guitar dealers and see very few ukuleles...when I went to summer NAMM 2018, in the whole Martin booth, there was one row of ukuleles on a single wall. So while they may sell a few of the expensive ukuleles here in the US...I'd guess most of those sales are abroad.
Chris Martin talks in one of his videos about how Japanese visits led to the rebirth of the 5K Ukulele.
Then I also track the prices of certain ukuleles, and (good) ukuleles that sell for $1000 to $1500 in the US are often much more expensive when listed from Japan. So what may seem expensive in our market might just be the "normal" price in other markets.
I did play all five ukuleles at NAMM...no one stopped me or asked me about it...and I wasn't that impressed with the sound of the 5K (looks were a 10 out of 10). But the sound from the Konter ukulele was amazing, and I look forward to Petey's upcoming videos with it.
UkingViking
Well-known member
Obviously a far east made solid wood uke at the same price point will be used for landfill and be way inferior to a mexican made HPL ukulele. Or not.
You write that Martin offers ukuleles at many price points.
It just seems that the high end ukes get some extra limited edition collectors item pricing rather than just quality ukulele pricing. Of course that is part of their business plan, as you starte first in your post. What caught me by surprise about the fsc model is that it looks like a pretty standard uke, with satin finish and no ornamentation. It look like just a Mahogany version of their C1k uke.
It is tempting to compare to the K brands. The offer high end US made solid wood ukuleles, where the basic concert models are about $1000-1500. A kamaka concert is $13xx at the Ukulele site right now. If Martin were to produce the C1k i the US in stead of Mexico, it would be resonable to expect a similar pricing. Which would put the fsc Mahogany version at $1000 more. Something that can hardly be accredited the wood selection. So yeah, it is a collectors item like expensive watched etc, and I will probably never get the appeal.
It just fools me that they made it look plain. The IZ tenor is prices more similar to K brand tenors, thought it looks more like a special limited edition.
Tell you what. Everything I hear from other people and see for myself regarding Martin's uke production leads me to one conclusion, and it's not a pretty one. In my eyes, they are just following the larger trend instead of innovating and pushing the envelope themselves. Now that the uke craze seems to be on the rise again we see them coming up with new models. Before that, it was years of silence on the uke front. They both have recognized enough of a brand and small enough a company to be able to affect the uke market themselves but they never do. Today, Martin seems more like an opportunist instead of properly involving themselves in the ukulele business which makes me a bit upset and sad.
I think we have to keep in mind that at Martin, guitars are their bread and butter. I too would like to see more from them in their uke line. I'm sure they could produce a killer Guitarlele if they thought it would be profitable.
I would also like to see a new tenor guitar and baritone uke.
I would also like to see a new tenor guitar and baritone uke.
I got in touch with my local shop, Elderly Instruments, to ask about the OXK concert, and when they thought they might be getting some in. According to their buyer, after talking to Martin, the estimate is November. Elderly is hopeful it will be sooner, but that is quite a bit of a wait...
Whenever someone manages to get their hands on one, be sure to let us all know your thoughts.
Whenever someone manages to get their hands on one, be sure to let us all know your thoughts.
mingus
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Hello, I just received the 0XK concert. Sounds and plays great! I always thought the soprano version looked so boring. The concert version looks like really nice Koa, and the set-up is great straight out of the box!
Got it from GearTree, and it was here in 2-days, and they didn’t even charge tax!!
Got it from GearTree, and it was here in 2-days, and they didn’t even charge tax!!
Kaelrie
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Isn't that what everyone hated on Kala for doing? Screwing dealers by selling direct at the same price?
I believe that Kala was doing a bit more than that. It wasn't just direct sales at the same prices as retailers, it was having sale prices that were well under what dealers could do.
Martin does not sell ukuleles from their website. Their instrument pages show the suggested retail price and have "Find A Martin Dealer" links, but there is no way to buy directly. They do sell strings and T-shirts directly.
Kaelrie
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LOL for a second I got all jealous that such a shop was local to you. Nice! Then I remembered the K shops and HMS/TUS are my local shops and almost slapped myself for being silly.
Ahh ok.
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The craziest thing about them being my "local shop" is that I lived here for years without ever knowing about them. Then I got in the ukulele and "discovered" them. I very quickly came to realize just how lucky I am to live so close to such a great shop!
Those of us who are near someplace great can take it for granted. I feel terrible for all the folks who live in places without such resources. I just happened to get lucky, and I am very very thankful for it!
Martin for years and years demanded that dealers sell their instruments for the MSRP. Anyone who didn't lost their dealership. Although some "sales" were allowed.
Now that interest in acoustic guitars has cooled substantially, they are looking for other revenue streams. Since the already have the jigs and plans for ukuleles, it made a lot of sense to ramp up production to bolster sales. Especially trading on the Martin name in other countries.
I read recently about how the Kingston Trio's popularity started the Folk Music revival. Since the members played Martin guitars and Vega banjos, that popularity translated to guitar sales and Martin expanded rapidly to meet the demand.
(In appreciation, Martin released a 40th Commemorative Kingston Trio instruments in 1997 of a D-28 Dreadnought, an 0-18T tenor, and a Vega replica long neck banjo. In 2002 they released a 45th Anniversary Bob Shane limited edition D-28KTBS guitar.)
Now that interest in acoustic guitars has cooled substantially, they are looking for other revenue streams. Since the already have the jigs and plans for ukuleles, it made a lot of sense to ramp up production to bolster sales. Especially trading on the Martin name in other countries.
I read recently about how the Kingston Trio's popularity started the Folk Music revival. Since the members played Martin guitars and Vega banjos, that popularity translated to guitar sales and Martin expanded rapidly to meet the demand.
(In appreciation, Martin released a 40th Commemorative Kingston Trio instruments in 1997 of a D-28 Dreadnought, an 0-18T tenor, and a Vega replica long neck banjo. In 2002 they released a 45th Anniversary Bob Shane limited edition D-28KTBS guitar.)
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