Ebikes

merlin666 said:
Are ebikes not like hybrid cars and charge battery when going downhill?
Click to expand...

Straying off-topic a little bit, but I considered something like this when I was planning my e-trike. Basically, what I was thinking of was trying to make a bike with no chain! Make it a pure electric rear hub motor bike, and use the pedals out front to crank a generator to charge the batteries. No direct connection between pedal and wheel, just electrical wire. Merely pedaling to charge the battery.

I determined that doing so would be possible, but probably not efficient. You have a power loss of at least 10% turning electricity into motion. You have MORE than that much loss turning pedal power into electricity. So, something like 30% or more loss in the system. VS a regular bike where the chain drive only has about 3% loss. I guess it would be good for allowing the rider to pedal at a constant "moderate" rate, thereby getting some charging on the flats, and using the extra power to get up hills. I ultimately decided it was too complicated given how inefficient it would be. It also wouldn't have the same pedal "feel" as a bike, which would be weird.

As-noted hub motors CAN regenerate if they are set up to do so. Mid mount, because the motor at the crankset does not get force-turned by the momentum of the wheels when you are not pedaling, do not regenerate.
 
merlin666 said:
I had no awareness that ebikes are already such a big thing. I live in flat area and have an almost 30 year old mountain bike with steel frame that is very light and can easily be carried up the stairs or over an obstacle. I don't ride to get to places but to move my legs and be out there, so not really an E bike candidate. Though I can appreciate the benefit of motor assistance for elderly people going up hills or hauling loads. But in practice all I see is kids speeding on shared paths without even using the pedals and being hazardous to pedestrians. I think some restrictions and licensing would be beneficial at least in our area.
Click to expand...
i'd suggest you rent one and try it. You'll probably be planning on adding a conversion kit to your bike within about 15 minutes into your first ride. It's a bonus that you live on flat terrain. ebikes are not just for elderly. in fact, pucker factor can be quite high.
 
LorenFL said:
Straying off-topic a little bit, but I considered something like this when I was planning my e-trike. Basically, what I was thinking of was trying to make a bike with no chain! Make it a pure electric rear hub motor bike, and use the pedals out front to crank a generator to charge the batteries. No direct connection between pedal and wheel, just electrical wire. Merely pedaling to charge the battery.

I determined that doing so would be possible, but probably not efficient. You have a power loss of at least 10% turning electricity into motion. You have MORE than that much loss turning pedal power into electricity. So, something like 30% or more loss in the system. VS a regular bike where the chain drive only has about 3% loss. I guess it would be good for allowing the rider to pedal at a constant "moderate" rate, thereby getting some charging on the flats, and using the extra power to get up hills. I ultimately decided it was too complicated given how inefficient it would be. It also wouldn't have the same pedal "feel" as a bike, which would be weird.

As-noted hub motors CAN regenerate if they are set up to do so. Mid mount, because the motor at the crankset does not get force-turned by the momentum of the wheels when you are not pedaling, do not regenerate.
Click to expand...
I always preferred belt drives over chains from my motorcycling days. i think belt drives would be a good fit for an ebike. cleaner anyway.
 
LorenFL said:
I bought a lightweight "low racer" style recumbent bike, and it's great... but, it's more built for straight line speed than cornering. It gets around okay, but I've never been a "motorcycle guy", so I get nervous in fast curves with two wheels. I've been thinking hard about a trike. My creative side wants to build one!

Being a "sports car guy", I want one that will take a corner as fast as I'm dumb enough to ride it. That means, REALLY low center of mass and engineered to handle cornering forces. But, I also want it to be comfortable, lightweight... and cheap. I don't ask for much, right?

It's on my agenda. Somewhere after "finish reorganizing the garage" and "build a drip irrigation system for my wife's garden". I want to at least hack together some kind of ridable e-trike, even if it's not the "ultimate".
Click to expand...
I was a "biker" on motorcycles for decades. My advice to you is, don't be afraid of turns and corners. Leeeeean into them. The faster the turn, the more the lean. It's okay as long as you don't scrape part of the bike on the pavement. Two wheels will corner a lot faster than 3. Trikes, for geometric reasons I don't understand, seem easy to tip.
 
Stoneyrun said:
I always preferred belt drives over chains from my motorcycling days. i think belt drives would be a good fit for an ebike. cleaner anyway.
Click to expand...
I broke a rear drive chain once. On Sunday. No repair available. Motorcycle had to be towed home. Never broke a belt.
 
Nickie said:
I was a "biker" on motorcycles for decades. My advice to you is, don't be afraid of turns and corners. Leeeeean into them. The faster the turn, the more the lean. It's okay as long as you don't scrape part of the bike on the pavement. Two wheels will corner a lot faster than 3. Trikes, for geometric reasons I don't understand, seem easy to tip.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I get it on a pure physics level. Has to do with things like center of gravity and instantaneous roll centers. But, I've made it to 55 years old without a bunch of road rash, broken bones or head injuries, I'd like to keep it that way! It will take some engineering and tinkering to get a trike to handle the way I want it to. That's why I want to go super-low with it. If it's not low, it will tend to lift the inside wheel and want to roll over. That plus some carefully engineered suspension geometry should actually make it corner better than 2 wheels. If nothing else, I'll have fun trying! Maybe it will get me off the couch?
 
26"-7" in wheels, 3"-6" farther apart than trike average, so the frame/seat can hang below the axles within a wider stance.
 
LorenFL said:
Yeah, I get it on a pure physics level. Has to do with things like center of gravity and instantaneous roll centers. But, I've made it to 55 years old without a bunch of road rash, broken bones or head injuries, I'd like to keep it that way! It will take some engineering and tinkering to get a trike to handle the way I want it to. That's why I want to go super-low with it. If it's not low, it will tend to lift the inside wheel and want to roll over. That plus some carefully engineered suspension geometry should actually make it corner better than 2 wheels. If nothing else, I'll have fun trying! Maybe it will get me off the couch?
Click to expand...
Or make a reverse trike with two wheels in front and one in back.
 
I should add one bit advice.
Test riding the bikes to see if they go the speed, YOU, want them to go, and what control options you have is a good idea.
The e-bike I had had 20" wheels, which is good for torque, especially on hill climbs so it was probably better climbing hills than other hub drive e-bikes for this reason.
Mine had some wonky speed control issues, which wasn't really a problem for me, yet I couldn't get it sorted out by anyone.
Mine had 4 speed/power settings, the lowest 2 were so low that I had no idea why there needed to be 2 of them and who would use them. The highest 2 settings were right up at 28 kmh (17.5 mph) and 32 kmh (20mph), which is what I used anyway, yet sometimes I could have done with a 20 kmh setting or a 24 kmh setting.
So, test them for your pusposes.

EDIT: OK, I should explain more. Pedal assist hub drives will go faster or slower than their nominal settings.
If you provide the power from your legs then will just keep going faster, yet the power assist will cut out.
If you just soft pedal and don't provide any assistance, then sometimes like if there's a hill or a headwind, then the motor will struggle a little, and when the motor is struggling, then its battery efficiency (and range) go way down.
So, from the point of view of battery efficiency/range/life, there is a sweet spot speed that the bike wants to cruise at.
 
Last edited:

From Electric Bike Report :​

Spring E-Bike Sales Happening Now​

As ideal bike riding weather is on the horizon, many brands are discounting e-bikes on popular models both old and new. Here's a quick roundup of our favorite deals we've seen lately:

Aventon​

Aventon has steep discounts on the original Aventure ($300 off) and several other discounts offered on older and current models alike.

Ride1UP​

Ride1UP's usual sticker price already feels like a steal, so getting another $200 off top models like the Cafe Cruiser, 700 Series, and a new favorite of ours, the LMT'D, is a seriously good find.

Lectric​

Lectric is offering the upgraded elite bundle for free right now ($277 value) with the purchase of an XP 3.0. That makes one of our favorite value e-bikes an even better get right now.

Rad Power Bikes​

Rad has several popular models going for as much as $200 off including the RadRover, RadCity, and more.

Flyer​

Our friends at Flyer are offering the EBR audience HUGE savings on the M880 e-bike. You can get $800 off when you use the code EBR at checkout.

Blix​

Discounts of several hundred off of favorites such as the cargo carrying Packa Genie, or the lightweight folding Vika+.

Electric Bike Company​

The Model A from Electric Bike Co. is currently discounted another $100 right now. We're mid-review on this one and it's been a fun ride worth looking into!

Himiway​

One of our favorite speedy fat tire e-bikes, The Cruiser, is $100 off.

Velotric​

A brand we like for the fun color choices and solid rides, the Discover 1 is $100 off, and you save $200 when buying any two e-bikes together.

Mokwheel​

A newcomer we tested last year which proved to be a fun ride, the Basalt is currently discounted, and you pick up $300 in free accessories, or $1000 in free accessories when you purchase any two e-bikes (and that looks to include the power inverter and solar panels!).

Juiced​

Closeout sales means massive savings for consumers. Juiced is closing out the popular HyperScorpion and HyperScrambler meaning $600 off.
 
Bibs said:
26"-7" in wheels, 3"-6" farther apart than trike average, so the frame/seat can hang below the axles within a wider stance.
Click to expand...

Yep! That's exactly what I'm aiming to do. There are some "tried and true" DIY designs available, which I've purchased to give me something to start with. All of those, along with all of the ones that are commercially available, do not place the heaviest part of the trike (that would be ME) as low as possible. I understand why they don't... they need to run the chain beneath the rider. But, I plan to get creative with that, and physically place MY butt a good 2-3" lower than is typical. We are 100% on the same page, my friend! Super low, axle height up a bit, a little bit of negative camber, etc, etc.

And I'm willing to go through the hassle of making it absurdly low because... I'm not really willing to go much wider. I want to ride on sidewalks and bike trails without being obtrusive, so I actually want to be on the narrow side. Thus... lower.

Stoneyrun said:
Or make a reverse trike with two wheels in front and one in back.
Click to expand...

That part is a given. A reverse trike (they call them a "tadpole" trike) is a lot more stable in cornering. I'm not interested in a traditional single front wheel trike. (which they call a "delta" trike for some reason)
 
DJ Mango said:

From Electric Bike Report :​

Spring E-Bike Sales Happening Now​

As ideal bike riding weather is on the horizon, many brands are discounting e-bikes on popular models both old and new. Here's a quick roundup of our favorite deals we've seen lately:

Aventon​

Aventon has steep discounts on the original Aventure ($300 off) and several other discounts offered on older and current models alike.

Ride1UP​

Ride1UP's usual sticker price already feels like a steal, so getting another $200 off top models like the Cafe Cruiser, 700 Series, and a new favorite of ours, the LMT'D, is a seriously good find.

Lectric​

Lectric is offering the upgraded elite bundle for free right now ($277 value) with the purchase of an XP 3.0. That makes one of our favorite value e-bikes an even better get right now.

Rad Power Bikes​

Rad has several popular models going for as much as $200 off including the RadRover, RadCity, and more.

Flyer​

Our friends at Flyer are offering the EBR audience HUGE savings on the M880 e-bike. You can get $800 off when you use the code EBR at checkout.

Blix​

Discounts of several hundred off of favorites such as the cargo carrying Packa Genie, or the lightweight folding Vika+.

Electric Bike Company​

The Model A from Electric Bike Co. is currently discounted another $100 right now. We're mid-review on this one and it's been a fun ride worth looking into!

Himiway​

One of our favorite speedy fat tire e-bikes, The Cruiser, is $100 off.

Velotric​

A brand we like for the fun color choices and solid rides, the Discover 1 is $100 off, and you save $200 when buying any two e-bikes together.

Mokwheel​

A newcomer we tested last year which proved to be a fun ride, the Basalt is currently discounted, and you pick up $300 in free accessories, or $1000 in free accessories when you purchase any two e-bikes (and that looks to include the power inverter and solar panels!).

Juiced​

Closeout sales means massive savings for consumers. Juiced is closing out the popular HyperScorpion and HyperScrambler meaning $600 off.
Click to expand...
Looking it over-Thanks
 
I built my e-bike a couple of years ago with a “Retrospec” 7 speed beach cruiser and a 52v 1000w Voilamart front hub kit. Lots of fun here on the island where I live, and of course I ride it to the beach…C41970BB-4761-4173-A166-A3696748E666.jpeg4A6DC495-3B4A-49F5-B78A-D28B4D2AB62D.jpeg
 
rustydusty said:
I built my e-bike a couple of years ago with a “Retrospec” 7 speed beach cruiser and a 52v 1000w Voilamart front hub kit. Lots of fun here on the island where I live, and of course I ride it to the beach…
Click to expand...
What did you do for the battery?
 
So yesterday, my wife and I went out browsing. I thought I would check things out for a couple of weeks before buying but I ended up coming home with a 2022 Aventon PACE 500 ST Next Gen ML. My wife is going to look around more.Decided to wait until more ice and snow melt away before heading out on the streets and trails.

For now it will sit in the basement until the Robins are singing.

Thanks for all the suggestions and advice.

20230318_221425.jpg
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top Bottom