New Uke Day (NUD) New... something day: tenor guitar turned octave ukulele. More guitar or more uke?

[Shaw]

This project has been in the works for a while, so I'm happy to show it to you all. I wanted an "octave ukulele" and was first considering using Perry's Octave Ukulele Strings on a baritone (so the other recent threads on these strings were nice to see). This results in a baritone ukulele tuned G2/C3/E3/A3, that is standard ukulele tuning exactly 1 octave lower than a normal low-G. This was attractive to me so that I could play with other standard tuned ukuleles and also play/sing in the same key. My hesitation was that I really wanted to emphasize the low end and I'd heard varying sound samples of baritone/octave ukuleles that seemed a bit lacking due to the size of the body and a scale not really intended for the instrument.

Down the rabbit hole I went and landed on the idea of converting a tenor guitar to an octave ukulele. I ended up finding this late 60s/early 70s Harmony tenor guitar with an X brace conversion done by David at Moonlight Luthiers. He is well known in the guitar community for restoration and bracing conversions on popular Harmony guitar models like the H1260 (which are quite pricey these days). The bracing conversion makes the instrument stronger and also brings out more mids/lows. It has the original spruce top, mahogany back/sides, and poplar neck, but he restored every other part of it.

The tenor guitar is an interesting instrument and can be tuned like a 4 string tenor banjo (C3/G3/D4/A4) or "Chicago style" for guitar player (D3/G3/B3/E4) among several other variations. After exhaustively researching strings and calculating the tension I wanted, I landed on the following to get G2/C3/E3/A3 (22 3/4 scale length, all strings GHS Phosphor Bronze):

String	Diameter	Pitch	Calculated Tension
B20	0.020	A3	22.06
B28	0.028	E3	23.93
B36	0.036	C3	23.94
B48	0.048	G2	24.27

I did end up taking it to my local guitar store for help sanding the nut to get these gauges to sit right. This is definitely as high as I would go with string tension on this instrument, but I'm happy with the result. It has a ton of character, I don't need to baby it, and it's completely different from anything else I've played. It sounds like a guitar, but has the spirit of a ukulele. What do you all think? Is it more guitar or more uke?

Forgive the fumbling in the sound sample. This was literally the first time playing with it and the frets feel absolutely massive compared to the concert I typically play.

 

[ploverwing]

To my completely ignorant ear, if you hadn't told me there was anything special about it, I would have assumed you were playing a guitar. So guitar category would be my vote

 

[Captain Simian]

It sounds more guitar like than uke. It definitely sounds beautiful. I’m curious to hear it with a high G.

 

[ukudancer]

All that matters is that you want to make music with it.

 

[TimWilson]

It sounds more guitar like than uke. It definitely sounds beautiful. I’m curious to hear it with a high G.

That's exactly what I was thinking! I'm super-duper intrigued by these Octave Ukulele Strings, but I think what I'd want to do is to make it reentrant an octave lower.

 

[Shaw]

Agreed that the wound strings at this tuning sound surprisingly like a normal acoustic guitar. More than I expected, really. I'm looking forward to taking it to a ukulele group at some point and passing it around since it can be played like any other GCEA ukulele, but it might add an interesting layer to a group.

 

[about2]

Love it! Way to go Shaw! It sounds lovely. So wish I could be in that group and bring my Favilla with Perry's strings to compare the two.

I think the Octave experiment has huge merit. It brings out a totally different voice. Has it inspired you to play more?

Just this morning, before work, I changed the strings on three instruments experimenting. I put some Pepe Romero Baby Bari strings on a solid spruce top/solid maple b&s tenor; I removed some Worth Browns from an old Conrad bari and replaced them with a combo set of wound and unwound; and converted my KoAloha KTM from a set of Baby Bari's to Worth Browns. They all sounded nice....the KoAloha really nice. It plays like butter.

But then I pulled out the Favi with Perry's strings . . . it's just a different world. I think you're onto something. The sound just resonates through every pore or the instrument. I will grant you the Favilla is an excellent baritone. There is a reason it's been called a poor man's Martin . . . but put octave strings it . . . and, wowzer.

Long live the octave!

 

[Keith5523]

Guitar to my ears as well. And I like it. A lot.

 

[Shaw]

Has it inspired you to play more?

I think it's going to inspire me to record more, which I haven't done in years. I'll be able to record the lead with my concert ukulele and then record a backing rhythm track with the octave ukulele without any worry of transposing--literally the same fingers on the same frets. Add a little percussion and I'll be a one man band.

 

[Shaw]

If anyone else is interested in going down this road, I just noticed that Moonlight Luthiers has an H1201 for sale with a V brace conversion. The pictures seem to be broken, but it would be worth shooting him an email since he's only done a handful of tenors.

 

[Captain Simian]

That's exactly what I was thinking! I'm super-duper intrigued by these Octave Ukulele Strings, but I think what I'd want to do is to make it reentrant an octave lower.

I’m sort of considering trying this on my Mele baritone.

 

[ploverwing]

I am really loving this octave tuning thing. And your tenor guitar in this tuning sounds rich and glorious. I'd love to hear the two (about2's baritone and your tenor guitar) together, too. What about a collab? Any interest in that?

 

[about2]

I am really loving this octave tuning thing. And your tenor guitar in this tuning sounds rich and glorious. I'd love to hear the two (about2's baritone and your tenor guitar) together, too. What about a collab? Any interest in that?

I’m interested, but clueless on the details. How would we go about it?

 

[AZChris]

To me, the phosphor bronze strings make it sound like a guitar missing the treble strings. I'd be curious to see what silk/steel and nylon sound like and if it's more uke-like.

You did a very cool experiment. I bet the sound of that mixed in with other ukes sounds interesting and fattens up a group sound in a big way.

 

[EDW]

Years ago there was a site with Ry Cooder's suggestions for string gauges for different tenor guitar tunings, which included uke tuning.I can't find it anymore, so maybe the page is defunct. I have also seen videos on YouTube about it. Cool idea. I know if I were to get a tenor guitar, at this stage I am too lazy to learn a new tuning or different fingerings!

 

[ploverwing]

I’m interested, but clueless on the details. How would we go about it?

Lol I'm clueless too! I know @AZChris and @Renaissance-Man collab so they may have some comments.

 

[Knows Picker]

Sounds good that way. I've tried that trick with a mix of wound and unwound strings and never really liked the result. The sound always seemed unbalanced and kind of thin.

 

[Futurethink]

You used steel strings, so that makes everyone perceive a guitar (in addition to the octave change). You said it sounds like a guitar to you. It's the twang of metal strings.

It would be interesting if you outfitted it with nylon strings, submitted a new sound sample, and asked your question again.

I recall previous threads where members here have tuned a tenor guitar like a baritone 'ukulele (Chicago tuning) and were sometimes met with outrage from tenor guitar fans who insisted that it should only be tuned like a tenor guitar.

Play what makes you want to play more. I'm a fan of the octave 'ukulele.

By the way, for those who say they tried the Guadalupe strings and found them too muddy sounding, Guadalupe has changed the way they make the strings. More clarity now, and also more tactile "tension".

 

[EDW]

I recall previous threads where members here have tuned a tenor guitar like a baritone 'ukulele (Chicago tuning) and were sometimes met with outrage from tenor guitar fans who insisted that it should only be tuned like a tenor guitar.

I guess we won't tell them about the countless guitar players out there who have made a career using "alternate tunings"

 

[about2]

By the way, for those who say they tried the Guadalupe strings and found them too muddy sounding, Guadalupe has changed the way they make the strings. More clarity now, and also more tactile "tension".

Wow, I didn’t know that. I’ve used their sets in the past. Thanks!