Can we discuss the specifics of how different materials affect the sound of a ukulele?

[de Houtwinkel]

... so you basically hook up your uke (soundboard) to a scope and look for a nice curve .

• And you log all that data with construction specifics?
• Ever did a break-down of a vintage instrument like that to find the secret sauce?

I really should be taking this elsewhere, right? (last ones, promise!)

(PS: my how really was for asking how you actually tune it, like with brace location and shaping, or varying top thicknesses in certain areas. But that's like asking you for the recipe of your special sauce I guess ...)
edit: I know that would have to be a too elaborate answer...

Why isn't there a spruce top with the grain perpendicular to the strings, not even on an archtop, that's what keeps me up at night...

Ha I'm totally fine with answering your questions here!

I use a tapping method with a special high-tech dowel(rubber eraser tip on a dowel LOL) usually right around the bridge plate or specific brace. I am doing that right in front of a mic that is hooked up to software that can measure the frequency response. And really actually there is a bunch of data collected beforehand from the top wood. I gather the wood properties and test the 3 main nodes. That gives me a clear indication of where to set off from there, and more importantly a target thickness for the top.

Honestly there really isn't anything intricate about a vintage instrument whether it be an old Martin, or an old K brand uke. They are actually quite simple! Simple bracing, simple woods, simple everything. In fact most K brands have very similar bracing structure even today. They found their "sound" long ago, and they have stuck with it. That really falls into aural illusion theory but we can discuss that another time. The only important factor in a vintage uke is time. Everyone seeks that "vintage" sound, but we can replicate it with torrefied woods today. But I like to say the instruments built by luthiers like myself, will have a much better sound.

Yes to answer your "secret sauce" question....there isn't a secret! It is really about tuning an instrument to it's full potential. One of the many variables is the quality of the tonewood, construction, thinning the top as far as you can go without it breaking, and technique. There are many brace styles to choose from that all will output different sounds. It's not a one size fits all unless you want your uke to sound like the other 100s you find in a music store. Those ukes aren't reaching their full potential.

 

[70sSanO]

Sound is subjective, full stop. No two people hear the same thing so really there is just opinions without merit. I myself am hesitant to use adjectives when describing certain tonewoods, their pairings, and how they react.

With this in mind. Every, as far as I can recall, tenor ukulele I've played sounds "better" tuned to B, sometimes Bb, than tuned to C. I know it is subjective, but there just seems to be more of an openness. A rich sustained resonance vs a sometimes choked tone/note.

I fought tuning down for years trying a myriad of strings, but I could never replicate the richness. I play fingerstyle melodies, so I imagine that has influence my opinion over the years.

John

 

[PTRarch.]

I can absolutely relate to that one! I have one of those "sleepers": nice to play, but sounded, well, dull. Until I tuned it down, and it just fell into place...

 

[BiosphereDecay]

I'll take ANY laminate with a thin top over a solid one that is like a plank.
It just has to resonate, literally.
A decent laminate (I'm talking 1,8 mm) with a good quality tonewood veneer resonates better than the same solid tonewood on a 3,5 mm top...

How would you (or whoever feels like answering) describe how the thickness of the soundboard affects the qualities of the sound? The soundboard of the concert I primarily play is exactly 2 mm thick, or at least very close to it. It's solid top mahogany. Is that a good thickness, or should I look for something thinner or thicker in the future? How much of this is a personal preference thing? I had never even thought of this factor tbh.

 

[de Houtwinkel]

With this in mind. Every, as far as I can recall, tenor ukulele I've played sounds "better" tuned to B, sometimes Bb, than tuned to C. I know it is subjective, but there just seems to be more of an openness. A rich sustained resonance vs a sometimes choked tone/note.

I fought tuning down for years trying a myriad of strings, but I could never replicate the richness. I play fingerstyle melodies, so I imagine that has influence my opinion over the years.

John

I can definitely agree with ya! It's really up to the player to choose their own destiny in my opinion. Do you stick with the status quo, or do you explore the myriad of possibilities? That is kind of where I am at as a builder. I think outside the box if you will and encourage my clients to as well.

 

[PTRarch.]

How would you (or whoever feels like answering) describe how the thickness of the soundboard affects the qualities of the sound? The soundboard of the concert I primarily play is exactly 2 mm thick, or at least very close to it. It's solid top mahogany. Is that a good thickness, or should I look for something thinner or thicker in the future? How much of this is a personal preference thing? I had never even thought of this factor tbh.

One of the many variables is the quality of the tonewood, construction, thinning the top as far as you can go without it breaking, and technique. There are many brace styles to choose from that all will output different sounds.

There you go...

Oh, and never use "exactly" and "or very close to it" in the same sentence on the same subject. Or you will raise an engineer's tantrum .

It IS or it IS NOT. Thank you .

 

[BiosphereDecay]

There you go...

Oh, and never use "exactly" and "or very close to it" in the same sentence on the same subject. Or you will raise an engineer's tantrum .

It IS or it IS NOT. Thank you .

Haha fair enough. I just measured at 2mm with a flexible tape measure, and then thought "this probably isn't precise enough to justify using the word exact", and so I tacked on that caveat.

 

[PTRarch.]

It's really up to the player to choose their own destiny in my opinion.

Let me differ & elaborate on that one ...

That may be a genuine starting point for a personal custom build, but with off-the-peg, the game can be trying to find the inner voice of the instrument. And make it resonate with you, for you, the way you like it. Be it via strings or tuning, when you feel a uke start to speak in stead of whisper, that's close to an aha-erlebnis. In my humble opinion - far from your expertise and knowledge, I'm merely a thinking tinkerer.
But I think you get the point...

 

[PTRarch.]

Haha fair enough. I just measured at 2mm with a flexible tape measure, and then thought "this probably isn't precise enough to justify using the word exact", and so I tacked on that caveat.

If aspiring lutherie: calipers!

 

[BiosphereDecay]

If aspiring lutherie: calipers!

I think "highly curious" might be a better word than aspiring at this stage. I'm sure I can get calipers pretty cheap, but I don't know how I'm going to afford a bunch of new tools. I'll probably just collect them gradually over time, assuming I do continue past the "curious" stage.

 

[PTRarch.]

Isogaba Maware.

 

[BiosphereDecay]

Had to look that up, but you're saying to take my time and not dive head first into it before I know enough about the subject to know what I actually want to do, correct?

 

[PTRarch.]

Exactly. Or very close to it .

Walk. Don't run.

Take

One

Step

At

A

Time.

The first, convinced. The second, commited. The last, confident.

 

[Keith5523]

And like most of the threads I post in, I really don't belong in here but find it very interesting.

I think it all depends on the NUT. The NUT holding the ukulele lol! I'm sure most participating in this thread could play a string connected to a tin can and make it sound decent. I could take any builder's pride and joy, and make it sound like a string attached to tin can.

 

[PTRarch.]

Game on...

 

[de Houtwinkel]

Let me differ & elaborate on that one ...

That may be a genuine starting point for a personal custom build, but with off-the-peg, the game can be trying to find the inner voice of the instrument. And make it resonate with you, for you, the way you like it. Be it via strings or tuning, when you feel a uke start to speak in stead of whisper, that's close to an aha-erlebnis. In my humble opinion - far from your expertise and knowledge, I'm merely a thinking tinkerer.
But I think you get the point...

Ha yeah I get what you are saying in a philosophical way. I just hate mass produced instruments that are made merely for profit. I don't buy tools just to have to put work into them for them to work properly. They should work perfectly out of the box, and that is how it goes with the product I make.